[FIX UNDERWAY] ASP gunsight, incorrect CCIP in A2G in 1.2.15

Good evening Gentlemen.

Release notes for the 1.2.15 version of the -21 mention improvements in ASP operation when engaging air targets with gun. I haven't tested these yet, but while attacking ground targets I got impression that related code changes inadvertently bugged the gunsight operation in A2G mode.

When engaging ground targets with cannon, with weapon and ASP switches set accordingly and gyro turned on, the piper is displayed about 15-20 mils to the left or to the right of the centerline - see attachment 1, screen taken during A2G tutorial mission, piper covering one of the target trucks. The plane was not flying with any sideslip. I haven't figured out when it stays on the left and when on the right, I presume it might be based on direction of the final turn before the dive.

Apart from horizontal position being incorrect, the vertical one is miscalculated either - note pic in attachment 2, taken moment after the first one. As You can see, the gun shoots waaaay too close to hit intended target.

The same situation happens when attacking with S-5 rockets, although both horizontal and vertical deviations of the piper are smaller. The rockets still fall a bit short of the target though.

Haven't tested S-24 rockets and bombs yet, but I'm afraid these might be affected to a certain degree as well.

All the -21 pilots, feel free to do some more extensive testing to give LN guys more feedback on the problem.

Cheers.

When engaging ground targets with cannon, with weapon and ASP switches set accordingly and gyro turned on, the piper is displayed about 15-20 mils to the left or to the right of the centerline

I can confirm this observation. But for ASP in missile mode, not gyro mode (typo, Art-J?).

All looks rather normal, but when you switch from AIR to GUN mode at the Weapon Selector Panel on the left hand side of the ASP and GUN (vs. LNC) at the ASP, the pipper is displaced.

No typo, mate. Gyro mode, as it's supposed to be used during strafing runs, as the tutorial suggests. Missile mode during rocket runs, I admit I should be more clear about that.

One can use cannon with ASP in missile mode too, so that the horizontal deviation goes away, but the vertical one remains.

Tried some bomb attacks and the bomb mode seems to be working reasonably good after all.

Same here. "Gun shoot gyro" for a2g gunnery pipper is off to the south - to the left when going west and to the east when going east, yes, it wanders around.

I have tested it in A-A mode. No auto distance still. When manually increasing distance the piper goes up :) this is funny. The ASP is worst then ever.... :(

This problem might be in connection with the inaccurate crosswind behaviour. The piper goes way out of center line in crosswind. Try flying with a 36m/s crosswind and piper in gun mode MSI

I also noticed these two problems when testing the sight yesterday. The pipper being offset to the side and the pipper going up instead of down when increasing range in manual air-air gun mode.

When increasing range, I'd expect the pipper to rise and not fall!

No it should go down, so you have to pitch the plane - and the canon - up to shoot higher and further

When increasing range, I'd expect the pipper to rise and not fall!

Huh? The further the bullet flies, the lower it drops. The pipper is supposed to show where a bullet will cross it at a given range, so it should drop as well as you increase range.

Heck. I just love gunfight and this is getting ridicoulous that ASP is a bigger mess after each update....

I have found that when firing the grome KH-66 that they are consistently hitting low from where the ASP pipper is located. This been happening since the update to 1.2.15.

Reading into a english Mig-21 manual, auto ranging definitly should work with the ASP set to "guns".

Wingspan needs to be set, but in Auto mode, range should be taken from the locked radar target, or be set to 600m if no target is locked.

I hope the devs will look into this.

FinnJ

Well they dont seem to :)

There was a good summary translated from russian sources on the A-A operational modes of ASP in one of the pointless debates on this issue. That table stated soemthing very similar to that, and was neglected by LN.

Well they dont seem to :)

There was a good summary translated from russian sources on the A-A operational modes of ASP in one of the pointless debates on this issue. That table stated soemthing very similar to that, and was neglected by LN.

Last info was, that it was perhaps a misunderstanding and that they will look into it again: http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2324661&postcount=46

Last info was, that it was perhaps a misunderstanding and that they will look into it again: http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2324661&postcount=46

Great to see that they are looking into it.

It would not make much sense not to use radar ranging for guns, considering that even the F-86 had it and most probably also the Mig-17.

Otherwise the ASP in gun mode simply would resemble the gunsight of the Mig-15.

FinnJ

The ASP is currently a priority fix for the next MiG-21 update.

Sounds great, thanks.

The ASP is currently a priority fix for the next MiG-21 update.

This is great, Cobra!

New modules are great, but please keep working on Mig21 please please!!

^ I wouldn't worry about that. The way I understand LN newsletters and hints, they've got some cool improvements for 21 awaiting release of DCS 2.

Would be great to hear from you what is LNs position on the workings of the ASP.