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[FIXED] Cockpit 3D model issue.


Schmidtfire

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Cockpit model is not correct for F86F. The windshield-bars should be wider and thicker,

and angle should be more narrow for the correct Sabre look.

 

Comparison pics from real life F86F photos and F86F in DCS:

 

f86windhield.jpg

 

image.jpg

 

 

it doesnt say the exact block number.

 

 

there are many block within the F86F series.

 

It would only be fair to be 100% certain by comparing F86F35 real life cockpit to in game cockpit model.

 

 

The picture you show looks is for sure pre block 35 you can tell by the different cockpit panels type used and the fact it lacks labs switches.

 

 

 

 

this is a real F-86F-35 cockpit and looks to about what we have in game

 

F-86F-5.jpg

 

the image is not at a good angle so you cant quite see the windscreen thickness ,so anyone providing a shot of the block 35 from the front would be appreicated to confirm that indeed the windscreen is thinner than it should be.


Edited by Kev2go

 

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Windows 10 64 bit Pro

Case/Tower: Corsair Graphite 760tm ,Asus Strix Z790 Motherboard, Intel Core i7 12700k ,Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 64gb ram (3600 mhz) , (Asus strix oc edition) Nvidia RTX 3080 12gb , Evga g2 850 watt psu, Hardrives ; Samsung 970 EVo, , Samsung evo 860 pro 1 TB SSD, Samsung evo 850 pro 1TB SSD,  WD 1TB HDD

 

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Well, did a little search, and without big surprise, here are pictures of several F-86F-35NA to prove that the windshield is wrong, at least from the outside.

 

Further to that, the windshield seems to be the same as every other model of F-86, so the conclusion that follows is that the internal cockpit shape is also wrong, according to the other pics posted in this thread.

 

 

http://www.aeropaixao.com/F86FAP.htm

 

Edit: pictures don't show here for some reason, check the link ;)

5320 (fake registration) ex-5338 - F-86F-35-NA c/n 191-900 MDAP 52-5204

L

this is the pit, just to show the LABS switches and prove, once again, this is an -F35

?q=id:27117&rows=6

 

5361 - F-86F-35-NA c/n 202-133 NOR 53-1204

?q=id:21081&rows=6


Edited by bkthunder

Windows 10 - Intel i7 7700K 4.2 Ghz (no OC) - Asus Strix GTX 1080 8Gb - 16GB DDR4 (3000 MHz) - SSD 500GB + WD Black FZEX 1TB 6Gb/s

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@bkthunder

 

Playing devil's advocate, but the pics in that link prove nothing. There's no picture I can see from inside the cockpit looking out.

 

Plenty of pics of the externals, but no close up of the windshield, and it's not the external model that's potentially wrong.

 

Also:

Further to that, the windshield seems to be the same as every other model of F-86
Careful, that's a spurious comment to make as there's plenty of pictures of F86's with a square front windshield, like so for this F86-A:

 

1071874.jpg

 

Personally, from all the pictures I've seen of various F86's, I'm inclined to believe the DCS model is incorrect, but there's oddly not that many in cockpit shots for the '86 around.

From what I have seen, it's not the shape of the screen is wrong either, more that the DCS version is lacking some inner metal work which appears to be supporting and covering the glass.


Edited by Buzzles
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it doesnt say the exact block number.

 

 

there are many block within the F86F series.

 

It would only be fair to be 100% certain by comparing F86F35 real life cockpit to in game cockpit model.

 

 

The picture you show looks is for sure pre block 35 you can tell by the different cockpit panels type used and the fact it lacks labs switches.

 

 

 

 

this is a real F-86F-35 cockpit and looks to about what we have in game

 

F-86F-5.jpg

 

the image is not at a good angle so you cant quite see the windscreen thickness ,so anyone providing a shot of the block 35 from the front would be appreicated to confirm that indeed the windscreen is thinner than it should be.

I found another picture of the exact same cockpit you posted (same airplane, same museum, same photographer). As you say, it is a -f35, you seem pretty sure of that, and I agree.

Now I think we can also all agree that the windshield does indeed look different from what we have in Dcs no? Go in game a get in the same position as the picture, I think there is definitely a difference.

 

So to sum it up:

 

-We have pictures of -f35 from both outside and inside

-the geometry is different from both outside and inside

 

Did belsimtek model a very special and unique version of the -f35, that has a thin windshield frame? If so, can any of you defending the accuracy of the current 3D model find a picture of that very same cockpit, to prove it is correct? (It would be easier if bst shared that picture actually)

 

Thanks

Windows 10 - Intel i7 7700K 4.2 Ghz (no OC) - Asus Strix GTX 1080 8Gb - 16GB DDR4 (3000 MHz) - SSD 500GB + WD Black FZEX 1TB 6Gb/s

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On the one hand, I think it is pretty obvious that the windscreen 3d model needs to be fixed. On the other hand, if that is the only thing wrong with the F-86F, I can live with it. I have been thoroughly enjoying this module since its original release. The correctness or incorrectness of the frame had never even bothered me until I saw this thread. Now that I know, it will bother me a little, because the whole point of DCS is to be as realistic as practical on a PC and getting the 3d model right is the first, and perhaps easiest step in the process.

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

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Here's another one. again, same airplane as before.

 

 

great job, finding what i myself and many others were trying to find.

 

guess that 100% settles it once and for all 3d model is indeed wrong.

 

Hopefully beslimtek fixes this, and doesnt just say "meh but we already made our money and we want to not worry about it and move onto other projects"

 

Build:

 

Windows 10 64 bit Pro

Case/Tower: Corsair Graphite 760tm ,Asus Strix Z790 Motherboard, Intel Core i7 12700k ,Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 64gb ram (3600 mhz) , (Asus strix oc edition) Nvidia RTX 3080 12gb , Evga g2 850 watt psu, Hardrives ; Samsung 970 EVo, , Samsung evo 860 pro 1 TB SSD, Samsung evo 850 pro 1TB SSD,  WD 1TB HDD

 

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Well, it's marked as "reported" so at least it seems that they recognize the issue. Hopefully it'll get fixed, this is a sim and everything should be as accurate as possible.

 

What baffles me is that it took literally 10 minutes to find those pictures; no offense to anyone but I'm wondering if it's my google search skills that are above average, or the advocates of the "you have to prove it" are just talking the talk, but not walking the walk.

 

Why did BST model it the way it is, even though every picture of F-86F shows it looks different from what we have in game? Wrong drawings? Bad pictures? Lack of research?

That's what I'd like to know...

Windows 10 - Intel i7 7700K 4.2 Ghz (no OC) - Asus Strix GTX 1080 8Gb - 16GB DDR4 (3000 MHz) - SSD 500GB + WD Black FZEX 1TB 6Gb/s

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What baffles me is that it took literally 10 minutes to find those pictures; no offense to anyone but I'm wondering if it's my google search skills that are above average, or the advocates of the "you have to prove it" are just talking the talk, but not walking the walk.

 

Why did BST model it the way it is, even though every picture of F-86F shows it looks different from what we have in game? Wrong drawings? Bad pictures? Lack of research?

That's what I'd like to know...

 

I've searched multiple times (generally, everytime it's come up) and I've never seen the pictures you posted when searching for F86 cockpit shots fwiw.

Google search terms are a fickle beast though.

 

Also, "having to prove it" is because devs only fix stuff if you can present hard information to back up a claim.

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Why did BST model it the way it is, even though every picture of F-86F shows it looks different from what we have in game? Wrong drawings? Bad pictures? Lack of research?

That's what I'd like to know...

 

Hard to say.

 

When researching the A-4, I've found thousands of conflicting pictures showing a scattered hodge-podge of upgrade history. Even within a single squadron of 12-24 aircraft, there's a lot of reports of equipment upgrades only making it into 2/3 of the airframes. Every aircraft has a unique upgrade log.

 

Given that history, I wouldn't doubt that there's truly no 100% standard F-86, and BST's version is certainly plausible.

 

--gos

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Given that history, I wouldn't doubt that there's truly no 100% standard F-86, and BST's version is certainly plausible.

 

--gos

 

To me it's just common sense that if 99% of F-86F pictures and material show that the windshield looks that way, then they either have material about an extremely rare aircraft (in this case BST would have probably said which exact serial number by now), or I think it's just something that was overlooked, in which case there's nothing to "prove".

In the end, if they bought the base 3d model from someone, they probably supposed the geometry was correct and didn't look into it too much.

 

Anyway the thread is marked as [REPORTED] so it means that it is indeed a bug and i hope it'll get fixed soon, because the windscreen is literally "in your face" most of the time. :thumbup:

Windows 10 - Intel i7 7700K 4.2 Ghz (no OC) - Asus Strix GTX 1080 8Gb - 16GB DDR4 (3000 MHz) - SSD 500GB + WD Black FZEX 1TB 6Gb/s

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COOL! Finally fixed, thanks :thumbup:

 

P.S. Did the geometry change only inside or also in the external model? It seems only inside for now.

Windows 10 - Intel i7 7700K 4.2 Ghz (no OC) - Asus Strix GTX 1080 8Gb - 16GB DDR4 (3000 MHz) - SSD 500GB + WD Black FZEX 1TB 6Gb/s

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