Strange Aim-120s

I was shot down online today by a pair of Aim-120C's. Now usually if I get shot down I generally know how they got me. But tonight I saw 2 missile trails barely streak by my canopy and was killed seconds later with no warning at all. It later showed I was splashed by 2 Aim-120s. I was curious as to which missiles got me as I had no warning, I figured there might have been another missile in the air, so I did that tacview workaround and played the track back...

Now what happened here? Did the game decide I should have been hit by either missile and tried to correct for it?. I've seen similar things happen in FC1 however the locations of those missiles was much more fine and precise (smoother line). I can try to find a tacview screenshot if you wish. As you can see my position and the position of the missiles was accurately recorded up to the point before they did a 180.

I know there is also a chance that tacview is trying to compensate for lack of information. But it still doesn't explain how 2 missiles passed me, didn't hit and a few seconds later I was killed by 2 missiles.

Might have very well have been a lag spike between you and the server.

I've had similar happen in DCS. Flying one second, the next I'm exploding. Wingmen told me there was a SAM launch, they got the warning tones and all, but I didn't. Just at that precise moment, some hop between the server and I decided it wanted to spike.

Offline in FC2, I've seen AIM-120s losing the lock and passing past the target, then waking up again, doing almost a 180 turn and scoring a hit, similar to the graph you showed. Perhaps the same happened to you, perhaps not.

So I'm not the only one experiencing that! On a squad night I had an AMRAAM making a barrel roll around me once, then it passed, turned around and it hit me!

Maybe, it's a random easter egg from the devs ?

hmmm....maybe if under certain situations, certain condtions happen....and the code reaches its "ups what i do here if this happens point" maaybe ..wierd stuff is happening ? :huh: :D

WOW

I've seen it happen in FC1.12 a few times. If I recall one of the a2a kills in the very first red flag event occurred like that. I've even seen an Aim-7 fired HOJ try to put on an airshow to hit its target. But I've never seen 3 missiles try to do it at the same moment of time.

What about it being a hack?? Is that possible, I've never seen anything like that before and I used tacview, and checked it out after every flight, not just mine but others too. Never seen that.

No, its not a hack, its an err in the seeker scan, unfortunately the uber behaviour of active missiles from 1.12 is still present in 2.0.

Oh well at least they fixed the ET.:music_whistling:

Actually not a seeker scan issue. Seeker gimbals are smaller now - this is looking like a network issue (note how smooth Grimes' flight track is).

Actually not a seeker scan issue. Seeker gimbals are smaller now - this is looking like a network issue (note how smooth Grimes' flight track is).

Well the missile trails are smooth too until they pass me. I watched the tacview again and noticed something that you might be interested in.

The missile that splashed my wingman "MAYK-F15-01" There was an approx 30,000 foot difference between the missile and my wingman's altitude.

Could you please tell me the angle from the missile to your wingman just before the missile started turning?

Could you please tell me the angle from the missile to your wingman just before the missile started turning?

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1719724/Mayk_F15_05.txt.acmi

Download link to the ACMI file. Its near the end at time 15:35:20. But the angle maxed to almost 45 degrees before it started to turn.

Ok, I am not at home right now - but 45deg is within the scan zone limit and if the distance is less than 7nm it'll pick something up.

What is the scan zone limit?

45 or 60, I forget which.

The missile that splashed my wingman "MAYK-F15-01" There was an approx 30,000 foot difference between the missile and my wingman's altitude.

This points to an out of sync type error over the network. It could happen in 1.12 sometimes. Maybe a lag spike etc.

Just watched the track. That 120 worked 'as advertised' for LO - ie. your wingman was withing gimbal limits and detection range. Unfortunately, the missile was outside of his RWR detection angle.

I think the actual scan rate has been slowed down, so such incidents should not be happening too often - but don't quote me on that.

Now what happens AFTER that ... huh? O.o

Do you have a track, and most importantly, can you get a track from the server?

Mind you, given the speed of the F-15 that got 'turned around on' at the time, those missiles should and would have hit head-on regardless. I'm thinking network issue right now.

What is the reason for it being so high, in RL the 120B has a +-25 deg seeker cone.

Because in reality it is actually that high. I wonder where you heard 25. The lowest I've ever seen has been 45.

Because in reality it is actually that high. I wonder where you heard 25. The lowest I've ever seen has been 45.

AIM-120 C6 and C7 both received seeker updates, the 120B has +-25deg(50deg) and the AIM-120 C4 and C5 have +-27deg (54deg).

So the AMRAAM's in lockon are 21st century incarnations.

Actually it's 55 off-bore, not FOR.

25 deg gimbals are old news; I would not expect to see any modern missile to be that restricted whasoever as far as AAMs go, let alone the 120.

AIM-120 C6 and C7 both received seeker updates, the 120B has +-25deg(50deg) and the AIM-120 C4 and C5 have +-27deg (54deg).

So the AMRAAM's in lockon are 21st century incarnations.

At what rate does the real AMRAAM scan, angle per second?

If it scans at 11 deg a second, to scan 55 deg on its nose (+-27.5deg) takes approx 5 seconds, this is nearing impact, it will already have a PN path to scan an area which should have the missile pointing directly at the target when it goes autonomous. These missiles in LO that fly dead are lost, really they should be flying a PN course to the data given to them and scanning that location but as they are, flying dead, to be able to aquire a target at gimbals of -55deg would be a probability of something like 10%. This seems to be more like 50% in LO.

At what rate does the real AMRAAM scan, angle per second?

I don't know, but it appears to be slower than it used to be (180 deg in 7 seconds).

If it scans at 11 deg a second,

to scan 55 deg on its nose (+-27.5deg) takes approx 5 seconds, this is nearing impact, it will already have a PN path to scan an area which should have the missile pointing directly at the target when it goes autonomous. These missiles in LO that fly dead are lost, really they should be flying a PN course to the data given to them and scanning that location but as they are, flying dead, to be able to aquire a target at gimbals of -55deg would be a probability of something like 10%. This seems to be more like 50% in LO.