DCS: MiG-21 Preliminary Changelog

[Buzzles]

People seem to forget that World is on the cusp of a very big update, there's already been previous posts stating there's fixes in the 2.0 branches that can't be backported to the 1.2.10.x branch.

 

Hell, we weren't even going to get a 1.2.10 at one point, so I suspect ED really don't want to be doing releases (and all the testing/QA associated with them) unless they really have to at the moment, especially after the last update going awry.

[statrekmike]

People seem to forget that World is on the cusp of a very big update, there's already been previous posts stating there's fixes in the 2.0 branches that can't be backported to the 1.2.10.x branch.

 

Hell, we weren't even going to get a 1.2.10 at one point, so I suspect ED really don't want to be doing releases (and all the testing/QA associated with them) unless they really have to at the moment, especially after the last update going awry.

 

 

Since we still don't really know when EDGE is actually coming out, it does not really make good business sense to let a module that has had such anticipation build around it pre-release to remain in a rather buggy state for a rather undetermined amount of time.

[fjacobsen]

Since we still don't really know when EDGE is actually coming out, it does not really make good business sense to let a module that has had such anticipation build around it pre-release to remain in a rather buggy state for a rather undetermined amount of time.

 

Hmm . buggy state ?

 

I know another DCS 3rd party developer that has kept their modules in an unfinished and buggy state for much much longer.

 

At presentI don´t feel the Mig-21Bis to be that buggy and it has not been available for such long time.

 

But offcourse I too want to get hands on the update as soon as possible .

 

 

FinnJ

[cz_jc]

Hmm . buggy state ?

 

I know another DCS 3rd party developer that has kept their modules in an unfinished and buggy state for much much longer.

 

At presentI don´t feel the Mig-21Bis to be that buggy and it has not been available for such long time.

 

But offcourse I too want to get hands on the update as soon as possible .

 

 

FinnJ

I'm pretty sure they're still buggy so 'kept' is not exactly accurate. On the other hand I see a third party developer here acknowledging issues and fixing them. Also the mig is really fun to fly as is for me. Some of these issues might be real nuisances but at least in this case I feel like if I fell asleep for 5 years I'm pretty sure I'd wake up to a fixed mig. Thanks Leatherneck for looking into these issues !

[eyusuf]

I don't believe its buggy, I believe its in a 'nerfed' state.

[cichlidfan]

I don't believe its buggy, I believe its in a 'nerfed' state.

 

In what way is it 'nerfed'?

[jackmckay]

>Greeaat!<

[statrekmike]

Hmm . buggy state ?

 

I know another DCS 3rd party developer that has kept their modules in an unfinished and buggy state for much much longer.

 

At presentI don´t feel the Mig-21Bis to be that buggy and it has not been available for such long time.

 

But offcourse I too want to get hands on the update as soon as possible .

 

 

FinnJ

 

 

You are right that there are indeed other modules that have to wait a long time to get bugs fixed and I am not being critical of Leatherneck for the bugs that the MiG has, I understand that it is simply how development of such a complex piece of software goes and as such, I am not upset over having to wait for some fixes.

 

That said, some of the bugs that we have with the MiG are pretty big and can have a very real effect on the sale to potential customers (the FPS issue being a big one) and as such, it is my hope that ED does not hold the process up by making Leatherneck wait for a big update in order to roll out their patches as it could have a very negative effect on how people view Leatherneck's bug-fixing even when it was not their fault.

 

To put it simply, the fixes for some of the MiG's bugs are pretty critical and it is my hope that Leatherneck can release patches when they are actually ready and not when ED decides to release it's larger updates.

 

Without really knowing the patching policy for sure, I can't help but be a little worried, I really hope that ED gives it's 3rd parties (note, I dd not say 3rd party partners like belsimtek) the ability to patch when they want and not when ED wants.

[Dejjvid]

The new patching system was supposed to enable ED and its partners to push minor updates fast. But currently only ED use this method, and it is extremely rare. One of the biggest issues with the 21 now is model related. Very easy to test and push out, and it won't break other systems. But we still have not seen a patch.

[fjacobsen]

I agree that it seems weird that 3rd party developers cannot push their updates via the autoupdater.

Sounds very restrictive that it´s only ED who can do this.

 

FinnJ

[eyusuf]

In what way is it 'nerfed'?

 

It's supposed to be a simulation and watching videos of a REAL mig in ACTION is always a good comparison.

 

So watch those videos of a real Mig; external and in-cockpit and make a (albeit subjective) comparison. Compare takeoff, landings, general performance keeping a close (left or right, it doesn't matter) eye on gear dynamics and also Cockpit instruments when you are in-cockpit, etc. This Mig does not do a very good job of 'simulating' its real world counterpart (at the moment). [oh and if you looks at the change-log for the upcoming patch you can see some of the reasons why].

 

It's nerfed.

[theGozr]

ETA ?

[Flagrum]

It's supposed to be a simulation and watching videos of a REAL mig in ACTION is always a good comparison.

 

So watch those videos of a real Mig; external and in-cockpit and make a (albeit subjective) comparison. Compare takeoff, landings, general performance keeping a close (left or right, it doesn't matter) eye on gear dynamics and also Cockpit instruments when you are in-cockpit, etc. This Mig does not do a very good job of 'simulating' its real world counterpart (at the moment). [oh and if you looks at the change-log for the upcoming patch you can see some of the reasons why].

 

It's nerfed.

The term "nerfed" refers to a deliberate decision to tone down some aspects of a game element, if I am not totally mistaken. It is usually used to counter balancing issues in computer games so that one party has not an "unfair" advantage over the other.

 

Do you really believe, LNS decided to consciously release the 21 in such a "crippled" state? :huh:

[swe_badger]

Why would one need to nerf the MiG-21 anyway? Isn't it's obsolescence enough of a default nerfing? I don't think for a minute that LN have nerfed it, I do think though that it was released earlier than what they would have liked. Remember how many times they stated that they wanted it to be released in an almost bug-free state? It's not even near bug-free, although it can -and is being- be enjoyed in it's current state, which indicates to me that it was released maybe earlier than they would've wished? Who knows! patch is coming, as always when it is ready. Dates are arbitrary and only lead to disappointments.

[FSKRipper]

It's supposed to be a simulation and watching videos of a REAL mig in ACTION is always a good comparison.

 

So watch those videos of a real Mig; external and in-cockpit and make a (albeit subjective) comparison. Compare takeoff, landings, general performance keeping a close (left or right, it doesn't matter) eye on gear dynamics and also Cockpit instruments when you are in-cockpit, etc. This Mig does not do a very good job of 'simulating' its real world counterpart (at the moment). [oh and if you looks at the change-log for the upcoming patch you can see some of the reasons why].

 

It's nerfed.

 

Sorry but how can you use some Youtube videos to judge the simulation level of this module? I'm aware that there are some problems with high altitude performance but the most (when looking at the further development steps) are minor system modifications like SAU or navigational equipment. The suspension is already known as under construction so in my minor opinion this is the best fixed wing simulation after the A-10C.

 

Some "nerfs" to keep it competitive with other planes are surely existing but what do you want? There is simply no better MiG-21 Simulator on the market. I would ask my father how it feels for him to fly this bird but his last flight was 36 years ago for the East German Air Force.

 

I would say give it some time but in my eyes this module makes a damn good Job :thumbup:

[zaelu]

The worst bug is the red cockpit lights bug that makes you restart the missions ad nauseam. The rest are tolerable. :)

[statrekmike]

The worst bug is the red cockpit lights bug that makes you restart the missions ad nauseam. The rest are tolerable. :)

 

I can deal with a aesthetic bug like that, it is the oxygen bug that I can't really deal with at the moment, it pretty much ties one hand behind your back since the MiG works best at 30,000 feet or so and with the oxygen system the way it is, you can't stay up there long enough to complete a patrol.

 

Now, again, before anyone gets the wrong idea, I am not saying this with any sort of anger or whatever, I love the MiG-21 module, it is actually my favorite module for DCS since it is clearly built to a very, very high standard but that oxygen bug is really tough to ignore and severely limits what one can do with the aircraft.

 

I really, really, really hope that the oxygen bug gets fixed in the first patch, I did not see it on the patch notes and I am kinda hoping it was just a simple oversight, everything else that I noticed seems to be fixed in that patch so I am confident that considering the huge problems that oxygen bug produces, it will get fixed in that patch as well.

[ff4life4]

The worst bug is the red cockpit lights bug that makes you restart the missions ad nauseam. The rest are tolerable. :)

 

Look at the key bindings for the light dials. Once you move them with keyboard commands then they work properly

[zaelu]

Oh... sorry... I was unclear. It's worst because in my case the plane is unflyable... not aesthetically but FPS wise.

 

Once I power up the battery and the light goes on I go to 2FPS. If the bug does not manifest... like if I choose ground commander first then Mig21... lights work OK and no FPS problem. But the trick does not work always.

[cichlidfan]

It's supposed to be a simulation and watching videos of a REAL mig in ACTION is always a good comparison.

 

...

 

It's nerfed.

 

The term "nerfed" refers to a deliberate decision to tone down some aspects of a game element, if I am not totally mistaken. It is usually used to counter balancing issues in computer games so that one party has not an "unfair" advantage over the other.

 

Do you really believe, LNS decided to consciously release the 21 in such a "crippled" state? :huh:

 

Since I agree with Flagrum's definition of 'nerfed', my question still stands.

[chanurr]

I would ask my father how it feels for him to fly this bird but his last flight was 36 years ago for the East German Air Force.

 

 

Hi,please share the impressions of your father,would be interesting to know their points of view...

 

thx in advance for you and your father... :smartass:

[eyusuf]

Since I agree with Flagrum's definition of 'nerfed', my question still stands.

 

I also agree with the assessment, but not with the implementation of the definition. The implementation is somewhat bugged.

Edited October 5, 2014 by eyusuf

[Flagrum]

I also agree with the assessment, but not with the implementation of the definition. The implementation is somewhat bugged.

What? Err ... pardon ... what are you trying to say here exactly? What do you mean with "implementation of the definition"? And how can an "implemented definition" be buggy?

 

Again: "nerf" = by choice, "bug" = by accident. There are some bugs in the implementation of the 21, yes. But I can see no evidence that LNS tried to "nerf" something - for what? What would they want to "balance" with a "nerf" here!?

[Corrigan]

Just ignore him.

[Mainstay]

Comms went silent it seems...