NO VIDEO, NO EVEN PICS?!?!???

[RvETito]

Ka-50 hydraulics is unlike EXPORT Ka-32 hydraulics.

RS-80 actuator complex have one-channel boosters with ability for switching between two hydraulic lines: main and common. This happens automatically when main line pressure is falling less than swicther limit.

Existing Ka-27 RS-60 was same, but it was replased by two-channel boosters when Ka-32 was re-designed for export and in Canada licensing.

 

The EXPORT Ka-32 you mentioned is the Ka-32A11BC which is, as you said, to meet FAR 25 certificate which imposes to have two-chamber boosters and this is the RS-60F actuator complex. The Ka-32T/AO I'm maintaing have the RS-60 with single-chamber boosters :D That's because all Ka-32 of our company are actualy Ka-27s which have been converted in civil variant Ka-32 during overhaul, so I know the original RS-60 quiet well :) I supposed that the Ka-50 would have also "рулевая система" similar to the RS-60, I just didn't know it's name. Thanks for that RS-80.

By common subsystem I believe you mean "дублирующая гидросистема", in our english documentation it's called stand-by system, which I think describes precisely it's main function.

 

Both lines have pumps which are actuated from main gearbox, so in the autorotation mode the pumps are actuated.

 

Yup, like any other helicopter- the hydraulic pumps are gearbox driven, thus you have full control even if both engines are down.

 

Also, common subsystem may be actuated from turbine unit, which can be actuated from APU.

 

Sorry, I didn't get that. What has the АИ-9(В) anything to do with hydraulics? I can only interprete this 'common' here as "вспомагательная гидросистема" which has electricaly driven pump, which motor can be power supplied by the СТГ-3 28V DC starter-generator of the APU. Is this what you meant? If so, then it's just like the Ka-32 system logics, with the defference that Ka-32 has АИ-9 APU without generator and the pump(насосная станция НС46-6) is driven by the main ГТ40ПЧ8Б 208V AC generators.

 

Here are the logic scheme of the Ka-32 hydraulics plus a picture of the PC-60 and the main system. I suppose for the Ka-50 we can remove the LPG-300 external hoist operation and the lowering/lifting of the nose and the tailboom.

 

P.S. Make sure you model the lamp "Клапаны ГС" on the light warning panel when RS-80 switches from main to stand-by supply :D

[Yo-Yo]

As far as I know (I have not taken it into development yet :) so I prefer to eat an elephant biting pieces from it as JimMac says) AI-9 feeds aux. turboengine with hot pressured air. When we begin model it we will just switch the hot air from turbostarter to turboengine as in RL.

In this project we use the new engine model that simulates the physics of gas turbine to achieve "live" behavior of the engine in regard of ambient conditions including even gun gas aspiration into the engine.

[nscode]

Wow! :beer: keep it up! :icon_supe

[Shaman]

Just a question about Ka-50 development.

How much information about the Ka-50 itself (construction, systems, avionics, performance.. etc and so on) and weapons it uses is actually publicly available (not-classified). If something is unavailable because of some reasons in what parts of Ka-50 you as developers need to make educated guess?

[RvETito]

As far as I know ... AI-9 feeds aux. turboengine with hot pressured air.

 

AI-9 IS the aux. turboengine. It has only one function- to bleed air for running the air-turbine SV-78BA starters of the main TV3-117VMA engines.

 

When we begin model it we will just switch the hot air from turbostarter to turboengine as in RL.

 

Yes, this is how it works IRL. I'll describe it in details for the crowd, it might interes somebody.

The AI-9 APU has been designed to constantly bleed air from the combustion chamber inlet- i.e. the airflow of the single-stage centrofugial compressor is greater than the burning process needs. When you start it up, the air is bled from the automatic KP-9V bleed valve and reaches the main engine starter's, whose air valve is closed and the air builds pressure quiet fast, reaching the value of the KP-9V's inlet. This equalizes the pressures on the both side of the valve and a spiral spring closes it and air preassure in the bleed air tube is restricted to a small hole in the valve. The air is then directed through another valve of the KP-9V into another tube which bleeds the air in the atmosphere. The compressed air waits on 'stand-by' on the starter's air valve. When the pilot presses the main engine start button a solenoid opens the air valve and the air begins to drive the starter's turbine. This causes quick drop of pressure in the starter's feeding tube and the KP-9V again directs the bleed air to the starter and seize bleed it in the atmosphere. The SV-78BA starter is switched off either from a switch in the NR-3VMA engine control unit or by the APD-78 engine start program unit after completing the 55sec cycle. When the solenoid closes the air valve the cycle turns again and the air is again released outside the helicopter. The process of bleeding air for the main engines start complicates the working conditions of the AI-9. The MGT is increasing and should be monitored to not go over 650'C. There should be made 1 min break before start the second engine and let the AI-9 to run for 1 min more after the second engine is started up in order to cool before shut it down. Which BTW produces very interesting noise:)

 

In this project we use the new engine model that simulates the physics of gas turbine to achieve "live" behavior of the engine in regard of ambient conditions including even gun gas aspiration into the engine.

 

I really hope you'll model it that way. And also hope that you didn't start dealing with it now and it's on let's say early beta stage...

 

Here's a picture of the AI-9 engine that shows the KP-9V location.

[Chizh]

Just a question about Ka-50 development.

How much information about the Ka-50 itself (construction, systems, avionics, performance.. etc and so on) and weapons it uses is actually publicly available (not-classified). If something is unavailable because of some reasons in what parts of Ka-50 you as developers need to make educated guess?

We have enough info for development thanks to the fact that we have a several very competent consultants and helicopter pilots.

[Yo-Yo]

AI-9 IS the aux. turboengine. It has only one function- to bleed air for running the air-turbine SV-78BA starters of the main TV3-117VMA engines.

 

 

The AI-9 have been modelled exactly as you wrote... I do have all info about TV3-117 and APU (not turboengine) AI-9. Now the main energy block (APU - turbostarter - engine) is modelled and tuned "in vitro" and the components are being imported step-by-step into the project now.

 

But APU can feed not only starters... 24 kW of free energy... not bad. ;)

[169th_Crusty]

The AI-9 have been modelled exactly as you wrote... I do have all info about TV3-117 and APU (not turboengine) AI-9. Now the main energy block (APU - turbostarter - engine) is modelled and tuned "in vitro" and the components are being imported step-by-step into the project now.

 

But APU can feed not only starters... 24 kW of free energy... not bad. ;)

 

I`m not a rotorhead but all this is geeting interesting. Why don`t you

guys include one of these manuals with BS (on CD in PDF), I mean a

"sanitized" version:)

[nscode]

There's a Mi-8 manual out there, you can see that. Don't know if sistems are similar, but it's enough for you to see if you would ever want to learn something like that :D

[RvETito]

The AI-9 have been modelled exactly as you wrote... I do have all info about TV3-117 and APU (not turboengine) AI-9. Now the main energy block (APU - turbostarter - engine) is modelled and tuned "in vitro" and the components are being imported step-by-step into the project now.

 

That's a good news, keep up the good work.

 

But APU can feed not only starters... 24 kW of free energy... not bad. ;)

 

That answers one of my questions- so the Ka-50 has the AI-9V APU which has STG-3 24KW DC starter-generator.

As for the Mi-8- variants Mi-8MT/MTV that features TV3-117VM engines have also AI-9V APU. Eralier versions like Mi-8T/P have TV2-117 which is totaly different engine which instead of air-starter has GS40 DC starter-generator so it doesn't have an APU at all. Instead it has six 12SAM28 batteries.

[nscode]

Yes, this one i've got has TV2-117A. Don't know what russian designation is for it (the chopper), since its designated HT-40 (where HT is "Helikopter Transportni", I guess) by our airforce.

[bnepethomas]

Well

I want to notice some other points on which we worked in this week.

 

- Hydraulics system of chopper. The full design of that system is not easy deal. We calculated fluid consumption, pressures and forces in various elements of the complicated hydraulic system of Ka-50. All hydraulic actuators and other consumers will be accounting fluid flow and pressure. In the event of combat damages and loss of fluids will immediately affect on helicopter controls.

 

- Lag hinge of rotor blades. With the feathering hinge and flapping hinge it will be able the rotor blades to make very complex movement as in the real rotors.

 

- Implemented onboard lights. The chopper has a two moving search-landing lights (main and reserved), standard navigation lights (10%-30%-100%-code), one anti-collision light and four formation light (not implemented yet). Also in cockpit we implemented three type of illumination – for instruments, panels and NVG compatible. I hitherto can not remember all switches for all these lights. :)

 

Awesome stuff, are we going to see any of the new systems exported in LUA? Got a toy where I can drive most of the guages today. But wouldn't mind seeing information on things such as cabin light status.. to link with cabin lights in the pit. ... and for the fixed wing craft Gear/Flap/Brake status... please :)

 

[EvilBivol-1]

Oh Jesus...

 

!!

[badaboom]

WOW...........That system is incredible!!!!!!..........my wife would kill me!!!

[diveplane]

electric bill must be a night mare man lol

[Yo-Yo]

I`m not a rotorhead but all this is geeting interesting. Why don`t you

guys include one of these manuals with BS (on CD in PDF), I mean a

"sanitized" version:)

 

Because it requires to translate too much text in English... :) Speaking seriously we plan to describe how to handle the powerplant in the game as detailed as it possible to avoid flight accidents in missions.

[Yo-Yo]

That's a good news, keep up the good work.

 

 

 

That answers one of my questions- so the Ka-50 has the AI-9V APU which has STG-3 24KW DC starter-generator.

Not exactly. The shaft power of ai-9 is much less than 24 kW. The good idea is to use its main energy - THE ENERGY OF PRESSED AND HEATED AIR.

Imagine the device like turbostarter that utilises this energy.

[RvETito]

Not exactly. The shaft power of ai-9 is much less than 24 kW. The good idea is to use its main energy - THE ENERGY OF PRESSED AND HEATED AIR.

 

Yes, I know what the main function of the AI-9(V) is. I later thought about those numbers and figured out the the STG-3 had something about 3KW electrical power. It's just not in my area- airframes and powerplants- and I have to check with the manuals for these numbers, unlike the engines/gearbox and a/c systems(except electrical:)) whose parameters I know by heart :D

[Trident]

Because it requires to translate too much text in English... :) Speaking seriously we plan to describe how to handle the powerplant in the game as detailed as it possible to avoid flight accidents in missions.

 

It still is a very good idea. I can see how translating the complete manual would be impossible, but I'd say the illustrations and diagramms would be very useful. They'd lend your simulation-manual a unique touch of credibility and atmosphere, not to mention the fact that creating new ones would be akin to reinventing the wheel ;)