DCS does not like hyperthreading?

[huppel]

Hi,

 

I was experiencing some FPS problems (please see my specs and settings below). Normally my FPS was quite okay (around 60) but in some missions I noticed quite some stuttering and low and jumping FPS numbers. For example in the enemy within campaign mission nr. 2 FPS dropped at start already to < 20 and if I just started the "create fast mission" (A10C, all defaults besides summer, clear and 12:00) then FPS < 10. As I could not understand this (GPU and CPU's seemed not even being used to the max) I started investigating. After disabling hyperthreading suddenly the stutters were gone, FPS numbers more stable and higher in the missions I had problems with. For example in the "create fast mission" I now get around 60 FPS stable.

When doing a search on the forum I could not find much info on this. Am I correct and does DCS not like hyperthreading or is that just on my system?

 

One question, I'm thinking on upgrading to a 3440 x 1440 monitor. Would that be doable with my system? Is there a big performance drop when coming from a 1920x1080 monitor?

 

My system: I7-5930K (running @4,6), 16Gb memory, GTX 980 (overclocked)

 

settings: all high except

- vis range: ultra

- civ traffic: medium

- 1920x1080

- res. cockpit dis: 1024

- MSAA: 16Q

- HDR: On

- Depth o f: Off

- Lens effect: dirt + flare

- clutter/bushes: 0 (I don't like the effect when flying helo's)

- tree visibility: 15990

- preload radius: max

- anisothropic: 16x

- Flat shaddows: On

 

Best, Marcel

[PondLife]

There are reportedly some problems with i7's clocked at over 4.6Ghz and HT affecting game performance on single threaded games. HT enabled would not have increased performance in DCS anyway as it would not utilize all those threads (cores) It's nothing really to do with DCS not liking HT, it can't use it. (I cant think of a single game or sim that utilises HT...)

 

Your system should be more than fine with an increase in screen resolution to 3440 x 1440, you may see some decrease in frame rates but not much as the GPU is utilised more now by the new graphics engine.

[rajdary]

Hi huppel, today i turned Hyperthreading off and i got a nice boost in fps! At least 20% which is very welcome, thanks, it was on my to do list, but your post reminded me :)

Rep for you

[j0nx]

No difference for me on vs off so I left it on. The OS should handle this natively anyway so not sure how you guys are seeing a boost?

[Wolf Rider]

Hi,

 

~

 

When doing a search on the forum I could not find much info on this. Am I correct and does DCS not like hyperthreading or is that just on my system?

 

~

 

 

 

Yet others say they have HT enabled and find all is good/ better with it running at stock cpu speeds

Edited January 12, 2016 by Wolf Rider

[BitMaster]

You can turn it either way, if 1 core is not enough to pull DCS and your OS kernel "thinks" it needs to offload some work to another instance you are always in trouble, stutter wise.

 

The handing over the process in HT got better over the years but it still cuts in and seamless is something else, still.

 

Anyway, base line, get 1 core fast enough to avoid flooding 1 core and forcing offloading.

Turning off HT will only take that option of offloading away but wont fix the actual cause, ther not-fast-enough core that is about to go through the roof ;)

 

I think DCS starts to run ok somewhere from 4.2-4-4GHz on imho.

[Wolf Rider]

runs fine here @ 3.5GHz (stock speed) :) Core Parking/ Throttling/ and Turbo disabled, HT enabled, as well as unnecessary Running in the Background thingies set to Manual/ Disabled

Edited January 14, 2016 by Wolf Rider

[BitMaster]

runs fine here @ 3.5GHz (stock speed) :) Core Parking/ Throttling/ and Turbo disabled, HT enabled, as well as unnecessary Running in the Background thingies set to Manual/ Disabled

 

 

may I ask why you turned Turbo off ?

[gazmonalpha]

I dont believe its anything to do with hyperthreading, im on an i7 OC 4.2 with hyperthreading on

 

I had stutters which i have fixed

 

Its more of whats running in the background , run as administrator helped, adjust your game settings slightly, visibility is a killer on max

[Wolf Rider]

may I ask why you turned Turbo off ?

 

Because I just want the CPU running constant... ie not "boosting", not "throttling", not "parking" - just all cores running constant and consistent

 

If that makes sense?

 

 

@ gazmonalpha...

 

Yes... what is or isn't Running In The Background makes a huge difference

 

How did you fix your stutters? (Personally, everything here is installed as Run As Administrator, then gone back into to set the Root Folder security to [ User] Full Permissions.

I find Running as Administrator (the desktop short cut) and setting the Root Folder Security level as two very different conditions

Edited January 16, 2016 by Wolf Rider

[BitMaster]

Because I just want the CPU running constant... ie not "boosting", not "throttling", not "parking" - just all cores running constant and consistent

 

If that makes sense?

 

END QUOTE ))

 

 

 

 

No, sorry it plain makes no sense, telling you as someone who sells those Intel CPU's.

 

HT is neither "throttling" "parking" nor "boosting" any of your 4 cores.

 

 

A: Boosting ( factory overclock ) is done by "TurboBoost feature" in Bios or maybe your Mobo

vendor's Software as a GUI in Windows

 

B: Parking is managed by C-states and CPU Energy seetings, usually only Bios

 

C: Throttling is done by either : a: settings in power control GUI Windows ( min & max % )

b: fixed setting in your CPU panel in Bios

 

 

You should read some more as you are wasting power and turning the wrong knobs to some degree for certain scenarios.

 

If HT makes your CPU tilt you should invest in one or both of the follwing:

 

Better cooling

Better and more stable PSU

 

or clock it down until HT works and see where you end up and what you can achieve from there.

[Wolf Rider]

Because I just want the CPU running constant... ie not "boosting", not "throttling", not "parking" - just all cores running constant and consistent

 

If that makes sense?

 

END QUOTE ))

 

 

 

 

No, sorry it plain makes no sense, telling you as someone who sells those Intel CPU's.

 

HT is neither "throttling" "parking" nor "boosting" any of your 4 cores.

 

 

A: Boosting ( factory overclock ) is done by "TurboBoost feature" in Bios or maybe your Mobo

vendor's Software as a GUI in Windows

 

B: Parking is managed by C-states and CPU Energy seetings, usually only Bios

 

C: Throttling is done by either : a: settings in power control GUI Windows ( min & max % )

b: fixed setting in your CPU panel in Bios

 

 

You should read some more as you are wasting power and turning the wrong knobs to some degree for certain scenarios.

 

If HT makes your CPU tilt you should invest in one or both of the follwing:

 

Better cooling

Better and more stable PSU

 

or clock it down until HT works and see where you end up and what you can achieve from there.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~

 

 

 

 

No, sorry it plain makes no sense, telling you as someone who sells those Intel CPU's.

 

From someone who buys these CPU's it make a lot of sense...

 

 

HT is neither "throttling" "parking" nor "boosting" any of your 4 cores.

 

I never said, or intimated, that HT did anything of the sort... and you "sell" these CPU's? and unless I'm greatly mistaken, or being mislead by the local supplier, the Intel i7 5930K CPU, is a 6 Core Processor

 

A: Boosting ( factory overclock ) is done by "TurboBoost feature" in Bios or maybe your Mobo

vendor's Software as a GUI in Windows

 

BIOS, or MOBO, is basically the same the thing, so I can see what you're saying there.. but I don't know of any "turbo" feature contained within Windows (at least up to Windows7)

Could you clarify where this feature is located please?

 

B: Parking is managed by C-states and CPU Energy seetings, usually only Bios

 

Core Parking is managed by Windows, registry setting - are you really sure you sell these CPU's in a knowledgable manner?

 

C: Throttling is done by either : a: settings in power control GUI Windows ( min & max % )b: fixed setting in your CPU panel in Bios

 

EIST "Throttling" is engaged at BIOS level ( C.b ). Turn it OFF there and C.a isn't applicable

 

You should read some more as you are wasting power and turning the wrong knobs to some degree for certain scenarios.

 

I do quite a lot of research, thank you... and I'm running a PC NOT a Laptop on battery (which I can see what you're probably on about, but I never said I was running a laptop either... my PC Specs have been listed below, and have been for a while, and at least, prior to your current reply...

Now, I may be "turning the wrong knobs" to you, yet I have no complaint with the sim's running... compared it seems, to those who by you, are 'turning the right knobs", who appear to be having endless problems.

 

If HT makes your CPU tilt you should invest in one or both of the follwing:

Better cooling

Better and more stable PSU

 

Cooling is well sorted thank you (one of those Corsair H100 280 dual fan water cooling thingies. No Corsair "polling" software installed, just the fans for it controlled by a Zaltec fan controller gizmo. I also have the (normally yellow) RPM cable plugged into the mobo CPU fan header connector so the system knows something is doing the right thing), and seeing as my PSU isn't listed - how would you know what it is?? FYI, Corsair AX860. Apparently they are rather stable and fed from an Eaton 1600va UPS (overkill, yes... but it was at a good price and very gracefull shutdown time - is this stable enough?

 

 

or clock it down until HT works and see where you end up and what you can achieve from there.

 

sorry... never said anything about I'm running overclocked... always only ever run stock speeds, and only ever said so

HT, has always worked for me... never said it hasn't

 

As I offered to your question... I don't want my CPU (which I do my own research on, not listening to "salesmen") slowing down or speeding up, I just want it running constant and consistent - cooling sorted

and my years old now X58 performs just as well now, as she did when I first put her together.. the Intel 520 SSD being installed and migrated across to (using Intel supplied software to do so), from the original HDD, being a Godsend.

My new system, as listed below VVVV, is performing admirably as well... so well infact, I feel comfortable retiring the X58 to the workshop for stock tracking duties

Edited January 20, 2016 by Wolf Rider

[rrohde]

Because I just want the CPU running constant... ie not "boosting", not "throttling", not "parking" - just all cores running constant and consistent

 

If that makes sense?

 

 

@ gazmonalpha...

 

Yes... what is or isn't Running In The Background makes a huge difference

 

How did you fix your stutters? (Personally, everything here is installed as Run As Administrator, then gone back into to set the Root Folder security to [ User] Full Permissions.

I find Running as Administrator (the desktop short cut) and setting the Root Folder Security level as two very different conditions

 

How does one turn these things off that you describe? Thank you! :)

[Wolf Rider]

@ rrohde...

 

Best thing to do is to get on the interwebs and research the different settings. Some are contained in BIOS and others in the Windows Registry - be aware that getting some settings incorrect can cause grief.

 

So, find your motherboard series and look for information relating from there... this way you make an informed decision and understand, to a degree, what is happening

You also then have the resources to correct anything which may appear wonky - this is important

Edited January 21, 2016 by Wolf Rider

[BitMaster]

Well, if you know so much about computing, bioses and hardware comparibility i ask myself why this thread ? Iwas just trying to give you hints, i dont do the work for you, the sorting of input, evaluating gained knowledge to make it useful is up to you.

 

Your ups is ok as long as it produces a clean sinuswave, somewhere beyond 1000€ for a device of said VA. Usually we take APC Smart Ups 1500 VA to not fry our hardware over time.

 

Never heard of eaton ups, might be ok, i honestly dont know.

 

860ax (i?) is ok, hope it is of better quality than my 1200AXi, about to return for replacement ( thermal sensor DOA )

 

Take it easy, just want to help.

 

And yeah, selling cpus works, but these days i usually sell complete Dell systems, Servers-rack-ups-utm-routers-switches and clients. The time of nailing them together is long gone, only family and good friends, too little time and it doesnt pay.

 

Anyway, i hope you understood my point

and excuse me for not knowing it all ad hoc.

 

Off to enjoy dcs @ 144hz stutter-free :)

 

 

Gesendet von iPhone mit Tapatalk

[Wolf Rider]

@ BitMaster...

 

Didn't mean to be taken as being rough on you... just hoping to cool your heels a bit regarding assumptions.

Oh! and something to help you EATON :) they are rather well known and reliably dependable

 

I still don't know what "point" it was you were trying to make... if you were just "trying to say things to the general community", then you should have made that bit clear

Edited January 22, 2016 by Wolf Rider

[BitMaster]

When I read Post #7 and also " installed as Admin..." I said....that makes no sense unless your win-installation is far off. If that would be true, it would apply to all or most of us because who uses an restricted account in Windows for gaming. That just made me think if you are maybe on the wrong path... just my point of view.

 

Also working NTFS access rights dor DCS, ala bit 777, is another thing I dont go par with. If that was true, it would apply for all or your Windows is nuts and turned inside out.

You definitely dont need to redo folder access rights, inherited permissions, security and what not else if everything was intact before, which I doubt now.

 

Thats why I said " wrong knobs maybe "

 

I dunno, I am 46 and building my own rigs since my 2nd PC and that was a 486DX50, ever since I also overclock, made hobby to a business and have put many many rigs together myself, fixed hundreds of foreign brands too, home, industry, insurances & banks etc... I pretty much know my way around Computers, no matter if Windows, Dos, Linux, Apple or even some IBM Mainframe OS. I usually dont need long to find an error or "the hook" to get on the right path.

 

That experience I try to give along, nothing else. Some gladly pick it up, others need to find their own findings and wont built up on others expertise but start from square 1 on again.

 

I am always happy if I find a guy that teaches me things that I have been looking for a long time and never found the correct answers and I have no hesitation to admit that I might have been wrong, partly wrong or whatever for 1, 2 5 or even 20 years with something.

I am willing to pick up stuff fast and I am always willing to spread it again, to make Ying and Yang equal, very simpel

 

Background stuff, yes, maybe, but there are many cores around, DCS uses 2 of them, why should I turn anything OFF, Antivir, TIR, MSI Afterburner, iCloud, Gefore Exp...

 

I leave it all ON and have no issues and still have constant 100-150fps in WWII online in any WWII bird. No need to turn it off, just configured for concurrent workloads to some extend, enough ram, ssd, enough cores and some experience.

 

See it like 420, same seed, different outcome despite same light, nutes, soil etc...

the difference is the hand feeding it ! I have seen that as long as I compute and there are great similarities there. You either turn the right knobs and leave the wrong ones alone or you just dont LoL.

 

No offense Wolf Rider, just answering why I wrote that :)

 

420

[Wolf Rider]

PM sent mate... let it rest here except for; I get fps210 :) and you said I was turning the wrong knobs

[BitMaster]

Because I just want the CPU running constant... ie not "boosting", not "throttling", not "parking" - just all cores running constant and consistent

 

If that makes sense?

 

 

@ gazmonalpha...

 

Yes... what is or isn't Running In The Background makes a huge difference

 

How did you fix your stutters? (Personally, everything here is installed as Run As Administrator, then gone back into to set the Root Folder security to [ User] Full Permissions.

I find Running as Administrator (the desktop short cut) and setting the Root Folder Security level as two very different conditions

 

 

210 fps but stutter. ???

 

..I dunno,,turn it either way, it either runs fine or it doesnt, regardless of 100 or 200 fps.

 

Anyway, 144Hz is the limit, none yet is faster..LoL and for sure not the slightest sign of any stutter

 

please. stay away from sending me such another PM again..... ( the next one will be FW to moderator )

[Weltensegler]

stutter or frame drop? because 210fps is impossible to display without unless your monitor has a 210 Hz refresh rate (doesn't exist)

 

On another note...Is it still advisable/possible to put DCS's sound engine on another CPU to balance the load?

[Wolf Rider]

stutter or frame drop? because 210fps is impossible to display without unless your monitor has a 210 Hz refresh rate (doesn't exist)

 

On another note...Is it still advisable/possible to put DCS's sound engine on another CPU to balance the load?

 

 

 

DCS sound was put to a 2nd Core a while back mate and as such, the sim uses 2 Cores.

 

dunno about "impossible"...Turn Vsync off, and watch the numbers displayed

Edited January 28, 2016 by Wolf Rider

[msalama]

Turn Vsync off and watch screen tearing plus irregular stutters? No thanks, I'll rather keep mine capped at 60 if it's all the same to you Sir...

[Wolf Rider]

Turn Vsync off and watch screen tearing plus irregular stutters? No thanks, I'll rather keep mine capped at 60 if it's all the same to you Sir...

 

^^^ sometimes it pays to just read through the thread... unclear bit fixed

[msalama]

^^^ sometimes it pays to just read through the thread... unclear bit fixed

 

What's with the failed attempt at sarcasm? It's just that sometimes it pays to observe how the quest for absolute maximum framerate may affect other aspects, such as the smooth running of the sim, negatively. Which was my point.

[Wolf Rider]

What's with the failed attempt at sarcasm? It's just that sometimes it pays to observe how the quest for absolute maximum framerate may affect other aspects, such as the smooth running of the sim, negatively. Which was my point.

 

 

certainly no "sarcasm" intended this end mate (perhaps, it was just the way you read it which failed )...just something many would consider to be helpful advice - saves getting things taken out of context

I do understand your point of "quest" though, which reinforces; everything needs to be kept in context.

Edited January 29, 2016 by Wolf Rider