Jammer priority

[PiedDroit]

Hello devs and all.

 

I'd like to know about the status of and thoughts about ECM priority.

Currently jammer priority is not implemented.

When I see topic like INS alignment time being so hot, I though jammer priority would be extremely hot as well.

I added a little poll, to see people's opinion about that.

I'm all for more realism, within the bounds of what can be implemented / complexity of ECM model.

 

For those who don't know what it is, it's a setting of the jammer, [] or PCM (Priorité Contre Mesure) which allows the jammer to emit at full power (or full time), which results in jamming the Mirage own's radar.

 

edit: Maybe it will be best someone explains better the whereabouts of this feature before you guys make a vote. Because the end result will be an ECM of different efficiency compared to the current one.

Might be less powerful. Or less in [] mode but more in PCM mode, I can't tell.

 

Thanks!

 

To operate the jammer you only need to turn it on (click the switch to the M position). That's it. The jammer is working,

 

The switch priority is something that is not enabled and we've been debating amoung ourselves if we should.

 

In the real aircraft the jammer is so powerful that it jams its own radar. So the priority switch is there to control that. If it is on radar priority, jamming signal is weak so you can use your radar. On jammer priority your own radar is useless.

 

As I said, we can enabled that "problem" but some team member say don't because nobody else have that weakness (but they should have it) and it will give them an unfair advantage in MP (He was specifically talking about SU-27 and F-15).

Anything about ECM is WAGuess. We only got that tidbit of info in an offhand manners as in "Oh! that switch is because the jammer jams our own radar."

 

What are the effects, how it works, why there are two switches (the same switch is in the throttle, but this seems to be a spring loaded one), we will never know.

Edited January 8, 2016 by PiedDroit
Added quote from initial discussion

[TomCatMucDe]

I vote for Jammer priority over INS alignment. However, I find the Radar vertical elevation and RWR to be higher

[spiddx]

The question is: with the very simplified ECM model in DCS is it even possible to simulate different Jammer power outputs?

[jojo]

What people need to understand is that all we know is the button's name...the rest is wild guess !

[LuSi_6]

nah, it's a little better than a wild guess. ECM right now is general DCS thing, it's a "here I am, shoot me! " sign ;)

[Ultra]

I'd say implement it, but I probably won't use it much. ECM modeling is too simplistic to be totally helpful.

[jojo]

nah, it's a little better than a wild guess. ECM right now is general DCS thing, it's a "here I am, shoot me! " sign ;)

Yes, DCS ECM is simplified. This is precisely why such feature is futile in current environment.

[Sarge55]

I'm good either way,whatever RAZBAM thinks is appropriate. It's mostly "voodoo" anyway without real info on ECM.

[Azrayen]

The question is: with the very simplified ECM model in DCS is it even possible to simulate different Jammer power outputs?

 

What people need to understand is that all we know is the button's name...the rest is wild guess !

 

Agreed.

Razbam wishing to implement it is simply not enough ;)

[QuiGon]

Jammer isn't a high priority for me, so I voted against it. I would prefer a working INS and other stuff gets fixed first before the jammer.

[PiedDroit]

Jammer isn't a high priority for me, so I voted against it. I would prefer a working INS and other stuff gets fixed first before the jammer.

The question is not about wanting it more than feature X, question is about wanting it or not as it stil not sure it will be added (as per last dev comments about it).

[Fishbed-21]

Jammer isn't a high priority for me, so I voted against it. I would prefer a working INS and other stuff gets fixed first before the jammer.

 

In the poll is not specified if the jammer will be developed before or after the other systems (like INS). The poll is about an "absolute" opinion. You want or not.

[jojo]

In the poll is not specified if the jammer will be developed before or after the other systems (like INS). The poll is about an "absolute" opinion. You want or not.

 

There is a jammer, the remaining question is how to operate it.

[Fishbed-21]

There is a jammer, the remaining question is how to operate it.

 

 

Yep sorry, I mean the jammer priority (jammer over radar or vice-versa).

 

 

 

Inviato dal mio iPhone utilizzando Tapatalk

[TomCatMucDe]

Jammer priority

 

I think radar has a higher priority. It is one of the key combat advantages of the mirage and is missing:

- vertical elevation to cover 60 degrees

- auto lock in close combat mode

- magic seeker slaving to radar locks

[QuiGon]

The question is not about wanting it more than feature X, question is about wanting it or not as it stil not sure it will be added (as per last dev comments about it).

 

Alright, then I missunderstood the poll. Of course, I want a jammer :)

[Fishbed-21]

I think radar has a higher priority. It is one of the key combat advantages of the mirage and is missing:

- vertical elevation to cover 60 degrees

- auto lock in close combat mode

- magic seeker slaving to radar locks

 

Yeah I agree with you. Radar has the priority together with other things like INS, improved CCRP radar ranging (TAS), a decent FM for the Super 530D and the MagicII.

 

 

Inviato dal mio iPhone utilizzando Tapatalk

[TomCatMucDe]

Yeah I agree with you. Radar has the priority together with other things like INS, improved CCRP radar ranging (TAS), a decent FM for the Super 530D and the MagicII.

 

 

Inviato dal mio iPhone utilizzando Tapatalk

 

the CCIP isnt working well either. Currently, you can't really use the Mirage for A2G missions.

[Fishbed-21]

the CCIP isnt working well either. Currently, you can't really use the Mirage for A2G missions.

 

Yes the CCIP doesn't work well, but at least you can hit something using the radar altimeter.

 

 

Inviato dal mio iPhone utilizzando Tapatalk

[NeilWillis]

What makes you think Razbam were ever going to neglect this?

 

I think all this talk is a little premature when we all know a lot of stuff is still to be implemented, and at no point have Razbam said it won't be done.

 

ASM means something of this nature, and the INS systems cannot be neglected. We just have to wait until the final release, which will naturally have a comprehensive feature list - secrets etc notwithstanding.

[AussieGhost789]

I think radar has a higher priority. It is one of the key combat advantages of the mirage and is missing:

- vertical elevation to cover 60 degrees

- auto lock in close combat mode

- magic seeker slaving to radar locks

 

As far as I'm aware jammer priority is a function of the aircraft itself. The poll is about whether people want said function, not whether the jammer, from a development perspective, should have priority over other elements.

[TomCatMucDe]

As far as I'm aware jammer priority is a function of the aircraft itself. The poll is about whether people want said function, not whether the jammer, from a development perspective, should have priority over other elements.

 

the poll options have changed. they were formulated differently at the opening of the thread.

 

Anyways, the strengh of the jammer is not in the hand of Razbam as far as I understood, it has to be a feature of DCS itself.

[spiddx]

What makes you think Razbam were ever going to neglect this?

 

This thread has the initial discussion with zeus:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=156676

[PiedDroit]

This thread has the initial discussion with zeus:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=156676

FYI I edited the first post of this thread and added that quote:

To operate the jammer you only need to turn it on (click the switch to the M position). That's it. The jammer is working,

 

The switch priority is something that is not enabled and we've been debating amoung ourselves if we should.

 

In the real aircraft the jammer is so powerful that it jams its own radar. So the priority switch is there to control that. If it is on radar priority, jamming signal is weak so you can use your radar. On jammer priority your own radar is useless.

 

As I said, we can enabled that "problem" but some team member say don't because nobody else have that weakness (but they should have it) and it will give them an unfair advantage in MP (He was specifically talking about SU-27 and F-15).

[TomCatMucDe]

So that means that they can model the Mirage radar to be not operation when the jammer is on max, however, the jamming itself wont be stronger and it would do nothing to other bandits. Doesnt it become obsolete then?