Large Impostors

[gavagai]

Why are we using them for WW2 multiplayer? I see that the two more popular servers have them. Is it a VR thing? For me the large impostors are just so bad I can't fly with them.

 

Obviously, anyone is free to run his server with whatever settings he likes. I haven't hosted in a long while but I might start again.

 

No impostors is just impossible to see for WW2, but small is a workable compromise.

 

Sorry if this is technically the wrong forum, but in the multiplayer forum this will be lost in 10 seconds amidst the discussion of multiplayer jet combat.;)

[Solty]

Why are we using them for WW2 multiplayer? I see that the two more popular servers have them. Is it a VR thing? For me the large impostors are just so bad I can't fly with them.

 

Obviously, anyone is free to run his server with whatever settings he likes. I haven't hosted in a long while but I might start again.

 

No impostors is just impossible to see for WW2, but small is a workable compromise.

 

Sorry if this is technically the wrong forum, but in the multiplayer forum this will be lost in 10 seconds amidst the discussion of multiplayer jet combat.;)

Cause we do not want to loose our sight during a few game sessions. Even with large it is sometimes hard to spot a target when its flying low over the ground because of a lacking contrast in the game.

 

Small are too small. And annoying. I am happy that ACG keeps it on Large before something even better shows up.

 

Also it depends on many factors, such as your monitor and resolution or as you said VR.

[Talisman_VR]

Why are we using them for WW2 multiplayer? I see that the two more popular servers have them. Is it a VR thing? For me the large impostors are just so bad I can't fly with them.

 

Obviously, anyone is free to run his server with whatever settings he likes. I haven't hosted in a long while but I might start again.

 

No impostors is just impossible to see for WW2, but small is a workable compromise.

 

Sorry if this is technically the wrong forum, but in the multiplayer forum this will be lost in 10 seconds amidst the discussion of multiplayer jet combat.;)

 

Very much agree with you Gavagai :thumbup:

 

Very much dislike the imposter system anyway and large is just a grey cloud of awful horrible mess which is a total immersion killer IMHO. It is one of the reasons I don't fly DCS MP as much as I would like to.:(

[Custard]

Agreed, medium is much more sensible. Large is ridiculous, it even makes it hard to judge distances owing to how large everything is at every range.

[Knock-Knock]

Should really be optional, along with a string of other settings, that the host 'forces' on the client. Like the impostor. Large possible, but if one prefers small, they should be able to select that. Same goes for tool tips. If I dont want to see them, my own settings should decide, and not the servers. There are many small annoyances like that, which the server/mission, has complete control over, but shouldnt.

 

And Large isnt really a VR thing. Cant see shit once they are within medium/close range anyway :). Has like a 1.5 to 5 miles deadzone, where its really hard to spot targets, even contrasted against the clear blue sky.

Edited August 21, 2016 by Knock-Knock

[eekz]

I think with latest patch and ability to force marker settings by server, i'll ajust markers for BS server according to visual detection charts for WWII planes. I would be glad if you could give me a link for such a chart. Once it is done, i'll gladly turn large impostors off on the server, as they are awful :)

[HeadHunter52]

I dislike Large for the reason that it throws off my estimation of how far I need to fly to target. I'm better at it now, but it's no exact science.

 

On the other hand.... without it, my sight, further set back by my monitor I believe, made it difficult to see anything meaningful before imposters came along. Other players would find me before I did them, so it's largely my problem. But the imposters helped me a bit there.

 

I plan on a 40" 4K monitor, when the budget allows. Some say it will help, others say not - but my lil 24" has a matte finish that I believe makes things worse than they should.

[LuSi_6]

medium is good with the Rift CV1 and (powerfull PC) pixel density to 1.5

[Solty]

I think with latest patch and ability to force marker settings by server, i'll ajust markers for BS server according to visual detection charts for WWII planes. I would be glad if you could give me a link for such a chart. Once it is done, i'll gladly turn large impostors off on the server, as they are awful :)

How do you plan on doing that? Do you have set of monitors from 15' to 40' and calibrate it?

 

Cuse you know... each monitor will have it diferently. If you set it right for you, on your, lets say 24' monitor with high contrast to see easily a Bf109 at 5km, at 17'inch monitor that airplane can be invisible up to 1km.

 

This is not as easy as people think. Graphics are subjective depending on hardware. What we should have is proper LOD scalling which would automtically adjust to the monitor to achieve the same result on all monitors. But we have impostors, which depending on the resolution change dramatically.

 

If I set my 21' display at 1920x1080p, I can't see the enemy well. If I set it to 1680x1050 I see fine.

[eekz]

How do you plan on doing that? Do you have set of monitors from 15' to 40' and calibrate it?

 

.

 

I'll google for wwii charts for visual detection range of single engine aircraft and tune labels to show dark grey . or ' symbol at detection range. Simple as that. In latest patch there is an option to force same labels settings from server, so every client will have same labels. There is no need to calibrate, labels don't depend on dpi

[Knock-Knock]

Came across this article some time ago, 'Predicting Visibility of Aircraft'.

 

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0005594

[karlmeyer25]

Coming late to this conversation, but since I fly on both monitor and VR (VR is far better btw) I agree with the consensus here that medium to small imposter settings is preferred. I think it gives equal advantage to all pilots.

 

The fundamental issue has to do with the type of game play common on the servers. While most of the WWII servers try to include some objective based play, inevitably most players seek out 1v1 encounters simply due to the realities of the WWII MP community of DCS. Putting together the historical missions between the Allies and the Luftwaffe appropriate for the time period aircraft just seems impossible in a casual MP setting, and I honestly can't see this happening even with the Normandy map. 1v1 encounters seems to be the preferred juice pilots seek out. I don't see anything gained by trying to discourage that by making adversaries harder to spot. I do agree its up to the pilot while in the fight to maintain visual, but helping players make contact seems to be encouraging fun, rather than endlessly flying about the map.

 

With a note to VR and hi-def monitors, I think medium imposters is a fine compromise. I also think the ranking/score system in Burning Skies will encourage more players across all the servers (minus the airquake) to diversify their game play.

 

-SLACK

[eekz]

Came across this article some time ago, 'Predicting Visibility of Aircraft'.

 

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0005594

 

Thanks you for the link! Incredibly solid article.

[Knock-Knock]

Was looking around a little more yesterday, and came across this study:

- Granted, that is viewed from the ground, but still gives some idea of how hard it actually is to spot an aircraft, that you have no idea is there, or maybe know is there, but just not where.

 

https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_memoranda/2006/RM4562.pdf

[iLOVEwindmills]

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2869267&postcount=170

 

Probability is pretty meaningless when either nothing/barely anything is being drawn by the game in the first place, or the contrast is arbitrarily reduced to the point of practical invisibility.