It's a Long Road!

[Enduro14]

This is indeed the Perfect time for the AJS 37 as well.

 

Since first it will get all the users that have any interest in the Viggen what so ever.

 

But since its also the first Fast attack aircaft (Supersonic with a dedicated strike role and guided air-ground munitions) it will likely get plenty of sales from there.

Then it also has Anti-ship functionality and the air-ground radar which might also interest some people.

 

So all in all the Viggen is bringing so many features to the game that no other aircraft available has that it will likely cause alot of people to try it for those features alone.

Atleast untill some other aircraft with those features come along and by that point they might be hooked already ^^.

 

 

If any number of other Fast Attack/Strike aircraft had been in the game

(Sepecat jaguar/Tornado/Su-17/22/Mig-27 or multirole aircraft like the F-4/F-16/F/A-18 etc) then i think less people

(those who are not interested in the Viggen itself but rather the features it brings)

would get the Viggen but since the Viggen is first then anybody who wants those features and abilities are likely to buy it.

 

 

Oh i feel the same way but in the same token the aircraft module is done to a wonderful standard only to have weapon systems and effects of those not modeled to the same standard. Same with the damage models.

Hence why i have floated the question around to the devs how is the BK90 going to function? Is going to be like the the Beluga on the mirage waiting for ED to put in a proper function of the weapon system or in this case did Leatherneck being a very good 3rd party get that all done in house so on the 27th we have a fully functional weapon system?

 

This is a COMBAT simulator....

Edited December 30, 2016 by Enduro14

[mattebubben]

Oh i feel the same way but in the same token the aircraft module is done to a wonderful standard only to have weapon systems and effects of those not modeled to the same standard. Same with the damage models.

Hence why i have floated the question around to the devs how is the BK90 going to function? Is going to be like the the Beluga on the mirage waiting for ED to put in a proper function of the weapon system or in this case did Leatherneck being a very good 3rd party get that all done in house so on the 27th we have a fully functional weapon system?

 

This is a COMBAT simulator....

 

The Mig-21 was delivered with all its Weapons fully functioning (even its Cluster bombs some of whom were new)

 

So i dont see why the Viggens weapons would not be fully functional on release.

 

Different Dev teams have different skillsets and different development priorities etc

so the state of Razbams Mirage 2000 and what it can and can not do has very little effect on the Viggenand its weapons

(For Example Leatherneck have developed their Own Air-Ground Radar for the Viggen where as Razbam are waiting for ED to finish theirs)

So unless/until they tell us otherwise i think we can expect that the BK 90 (and the other Weapons for the Viggen) to be functional on release.

Edited December 30, 2016 by mattebubben

[AdurianJ]

The next Grudge match i expect BK90's to hit the enemy flight line :D

[Enduro14]

The Mig-21 was delivered with all its Weapons fully functioning (even its Cluster bombs some of whom were new)

 

So i dont see why the Viggens weapons would not be fully functional on release.

 

Different Dev teams have different skillsets and different development priorities etc

so the state of Razbams Mirage 2000 and what it can and can not do has very little effect on the Viggenand its weapons

(For Example Leatherneck have developed their Own Air-Ground Radar for the Viggen where as Razbam are waiting for ED to finish theirs)

So unless/until they tell us otherwise i think we can expect that the BK 90 (and the other Weapons for the Viggen) to be functional on release.

 

Not doubting anybodies ability but i do agree with you that i hope we see something soon on the functionality of these more ADVANCED weapon systems and how they can be of use in the Current DCS environment. :D

[AG-51_Razor]

Don't stone me for saying this, but I could not possibly be less interested in the Viggen. I am quite sure it is a very capable attack fighter and very interesting as an example of what the Swedish defense industry came up with during the cold war to combat it's perceived threats. The canard and reverse thrust alone are enough to attract even the most jaded flight sim enthusiast like myself. But like I said, I have no interest in it and I will purchase it anyway, for no other reason than to show my support for LNS and vote with my wallet. If it's half as good as the Mig-21, it will be awesome! I am still patiently waiting for the Turkey and Corsair to arrive. :pilotfly: Tail hooks are what get me excited!:joystick:

[SFC Tako]

Don't stone me for saying this

 

LOL, I'm sort of with you on this one but I won't say it publicly ;)

I'm getting Viggen simply because of the great build quality on the Mig-21.

Tailhooks...a thing that we've yet to experience in DCS. I mean sure, one of them toybirds in FC3 has a tailhook and it does work but it sure doesn't "feel" right. Hell, the tailhooks in "IL-2 1946" are more realistic and that was made over a decade ago.

[mattebubben]

LOL, I'm sort of with you on this one but I won't say it publicly ;)

I'm getting Viggen simply because of the great build quality on the Mig-21.

Tailhooks...a thing that we've yet to experience in DCS. I mean sure, one of them toybirds in FC3 has a tailhook and it does work but it sure doesn't "feel" right. Hell, the tailhooks in "IL-2 1946" are more realistic and that was made over a decade ago.

 

You have to be very careful with you statements ^^

since as a Swede im pretty sure its high treason to talk ill about or not be excited about

the Viggen ^^.

 

And one of the first things im looking forward to trying with the Viggen will be Carrier ops ^^ since with Thrust reverser its just possible you might be able to land on the Admiral Kuznetsov and takeoffs should not be an issue (alteast not if you back up to give yourself enough "runway")

^^.

[boedha68]

Hahaha.. i buy it all. Not to say i fly everything. Just supporting everybody who is responsible for making DCS bigger, better and greater!!!:D:pilotfly::thumbup:

[2-niner]

Don't stone me for saying this, but I could not possibly be less interested in the Viggen. I am quite sure it is a very capable attack fighter and very interesting as an example of what the Swedish defense industry came up with during the cold war to combat it's perceived threats. The canard and reverse thrust alone are enough to attract even the most jaded flight sim enthusiast like myself. But like I said, I have no interest in it and I will purchase it anyway, for no other reason than to show my support for LNS and vote with my wallet. If it's half as good as the Mig-21, it will be awesome! I am still patiently waiting for the Turkey and Corsair to arrive. :pilotfly: Tail hooks are what get me excited!:joystick:

 

I think that's really cool that you'll still buy it. Not everyone can get excited about every aircraft. I'm super excited about it myself but then I'm Swedish so... :)

 

And actually - and I'll probably (definitely) get stoned for this - it's really NOT a very capable attack aircraft in my opinion, it's got a very limited loadout, no internal countermeasures, very basic RWR, no gun, and so on... BUT I love it and is as excited as can be about it, and I think that working within the limitations of an aircraft is a big part of the fun anyway.

[renhanxue]

Well, capable compared to what? As a delivery platform for unguided bombs and rockets, sure, whatever, the later F-4 Phantom versions could do the same thing better around 1970 (disregarding that it's a twin engine two-seater with all the cost issues that implies). But what other medium fighter-bomber could deliver standoff ASM's in 1970? I'm pretty darn sure there weren't any.

 

Now, by the 1990's the AJS 37 was certainly showing its age compared to the later models of the 80's digital era aircraft like the F-16, F/A-18, MiG-29 and Su-27 since it never really got much in the way of mid-service upgrades, but everything is relative.

[mattebubben]

I think that's really cool that you'll still buy it. Not everyone can get excited about every aircraft. I'm super excited about it myself but then I'm Swedish so... :)

 

And actually - and I'll probably (definitely) get stoned for this - it's really NOT a very capable attack aircraft in my opinion, it's got a very limited loadout, no internal countermeasures, very basic RWR, no gun, and so on... BUT I love it and is as excited as can be about it, and I think that working within the limitations of an aircraft is a big part of the fun anyway.

 

Well its no less capable then any other Attack aircraft developed in the same timeperiod (late 60s/early 70s)

 

Comparable aircraft like the A-7D/E,Sepecat Jaguar,Su-17 and Mig-27 are not really any more advanced / capable then the AJ/AJS 37 is.

(the Viggen is just as good in most areas and better in some)

And while all of those aircraft does have Internal guns they are not really Significantly better in the other compartments

(For example i dont think and of those aircraft listed had Internal Countermeasure dispensers when they entered service)

 

If you try to compare it with the F/A-18,F-16C or other 4th Gen Multirole aircraft then its less advanced yes

but those are more modern aircraft that entered service atleast a decade later letting them take advantage

of all the advances in technology that occurred during the 1970s where as the Attack Viggen is built using 1960s tech.

 

The AJ 37 was amongst the most capable strike / Antiship aircraft in the world when it entered service in the 1970s

its was still a very capable strike / Anti-ship aircraft in the 1980s.

By the 1990s it started to very much show its age but due to delays

on the aircraft that was due to replace it (Jas 39 Gripen) it had to soldier on untill the late 90s

(That was the reason for the limited AJS 37 modifications).

 

The AJS 37 will be very capable in the types of missions it was designed to undertake.

That is Anti-ship missions and attacking ground targets using low altitude high speed approaches before launching all weapons in a single pass before getting out of the Area.

 

And in those missions there are Few 1970s or 1980s aircraft that would do it better then the AJS 37.

 

Sure when it comes to killing as many tanks as possible while loitering in a low threat environment (Lighter Sam Coverage and no Enemy fighters about)

the A-10C and Su-25T might still be better but if you need to get in and out fast before enemy fighters (or Sams) can intercept you then the AJS 37 will be the best

thing for it available in the game (Untill the F/A-18C is released).

 

And i foresee that the AJS 37 will prove itself usefull on MP servers like Blue Flag and Open Conflict (where Enemy fighters are a real risk).

Edited January 2, 2017 by mattebubben

[Pikey]

I'm sure they forgive you! Tailhooks get me excited too, but i need something to play with until then!

Don't stone me for saying this, but I could not possibly be less interested in the Viggen. I am quite sure it is a very capable attack fighter and very interesting as an example of what the Swedish defense industry came up with during the cold war to combat it's perceived threats. The canard and reverse thrust alone are enough to attract even the most jaded flight sim enthusiast like myself. But like I said, I have no interest in it and I will purchase it anyway, for no other reason than to show my support for LNS and vote with my wallet. If it's half as good as the Mig-21, it will be awesome! I am still patiently waiting for the Turkey and Corsair to arrive. :pilotfly: Tail hooks are what get me excited!:joystick:

[Pikey]

Viggen has a slot in general MP for DCS no doubt about it. Of course, we will see people try to do a SEAD role and cringe, like we all did with the A-10C because there was no other choice and we wanted to play that other flight sim. And there will be tears. But also successes. And she can run away, which is good, since defeating SAM's that suddenly pop up in an A-10C means you lose all that altitude you spent 30 minutes trying to achieve! And hiding from fighters in an A-10C, that's a miserable experience, you can at least choose to run in the Viggen, whereas A-10C pilots tend now to bring the nose round and it all gets messy!

 

I think a lot of people get confused with the apparent age of the aircraft when they look at the external...Which is a sign it's lasted well.

 

Well its no less capable then any other Attack aircraft developed in the same timeperiod (late 60s/early 70s)

 

Comparable aircraft like the A-7D/E,Sepecat Jaguar,Su-17 and Mig-27 are not really any more advanced / capable then the AJ/AJS 37 is.

(the Viggen is just as good in most areas and better in some)

And while all of those aircraft does have Internal guns they are not really Significantly better in the other compartments

(For example i dont think and of those aircraft listed had Internal Countermeasure dispensers when they entered service)

 

If you try to compare it with the F/A-18,F-16C or other 4th Gen Multirole aircraft then its less advanced yes

but those are more modern aircraft that entered service atleast a decade later letting them take advantage

of all the advances in technology that occurred during the 1970s where as the Attack Viggen is built using 1960s tech.

 

The AJ 37 was amongst the most capable strike / Antiship aircraft in the world when it entered service in the 1970s

its was still a very capable strike / Anti-ship aircraft in the 1980s.

By the 1990s it started to very much show its age but due to delays

on the aircraft that was due to replace it (Jas 39 Gripen) it had to soldier on untill the late 90s

(That was the reason for the limited AJS 37 modifications).

 

The AJS 37 will be very capable in the types of missions it was designed to undertake.

That is Anti-ship missions and attacking ground targets using low altitude high speed approaches before launching all weapons in a single pass before getting out of the Area.

 

And in those missions there are Few 1970s or 1980s aircraft that would do it better then the AJS 37.

 

Sure when it comes to killing as many tanks as possible while loitering in a low threat environment (Lighter Sam Coverage and no Enemy fighters about)

the A-10C and Su-25T might still be better but if you need to get in and out fast before enemy fighters (or Sams) can intercept you then the AJS 37 will be the best

thing for it available in the game (Untill the F/A-18C is released).

 

And i foresee that the AJS 37 will prove itself usefull on MP servers like Blue Flag and Open Conflict (where Enemy fighters are a real risk).

[mattebubben]

One of the first mission types i will try out with the AJS 37 will be DEAD

and it will be interesting to see how viable it will be.

 

Using its speed together with AGM-65s and maby BK 90s and Rocket Pods etc

(BK 90 could be usefull if you know the location of the Sam site beforehand but would be less effective for snapshot attacks).

 

The Optimum loadout for such a mission type probably depends on how the Jammer and RWR are implemented but it will probably be a interesting mission type to test out and it should be better at it then the A-10 for sure ^^

(Since Approaching at high speed popping up just long enough to get off a AGM-65 before getting on the deck again should give you a decent chance of Success without eating a Sam).

 

And sure you might only be able to get 2-4 Sam/AA vehicles per sortie (unless they are so close together for the Splash to get multiple)

but getting to and from target at mach 0.9 (or Supersonic if you can spare the Fuel) should allow for pretty quick follow up attacks.

Edited January 3, 2017 by mattebubben

[Boris]

second try AdurianJ

 

Saw the title and immediately wanted to post this song :P

[Schmidtfire]

I have a feeling that the AJS37 will be great for almost anything!

 

Greet enemy convoys with cool looking rockets? - Check

Drop a bunch of bombs on whatevers bothering you? - Check

Destroy enemy airfields with awesome stand-off cluster munitions? - Check

SEAD? - No worries. We got swedish-made ecm pod. And yeah, BK90...

Anti-Ship role? - Oh yesss!

Intercept and CAP against fighters? - No problem, we have missiles... and ejection seat. :thumbup:

[Pocket Sized]

And sure you might only be able to get 2-4 Sam/AA vehicles per sortie (unless they are so close together for the Splash to get multiple)

 

There's a very box shaped bomb that would like to have a word with you