DDM question

[Aries101]

Hello all.

 

 

I am trying to perfect my Mirage capabilities (A/G) but so far I suck.

I guess bombing can be perfected by repetition and that is all fine (getting better there). problem arose when I started to practise on server. Now there I cant see where enemy units on ground are (lacking radar i guess) so my first question is:

 

 

How the hell you see anything on ground, especially in late afternoon or evening?

 

 

Second question is for part when you need to GTFO there and I usually get hit by Tunguska (is is S3 system?) . As I then went to read a bit I realised that Mirage have missle detector as for radar missles so for IR ones if it can see heat signature. Also , does anyone knows how long is this system warming up ?

 

 

So i guess second question is more like, plea for help and tips on how not to get shot down by ground based missles. :(

I will try to get more precise if needed.

[jojo]

There is no miracle, the Mirage 2000C is a fighter first, and not a dedicated strike fighter.

 

So if you don't see your target visually, you need someone else to give you coordinates (Forwar Air Controller = FAC, other fighters with targeting pod = A-10C, Harriet, soon Hornet and Tomcat) or know where your target is at the briefing.

[Aries101]

I meant I did my best with trying to see dots but I did not saw a thing.

[Ramsay]

I am trying to perfect my Mirage capabilities (A/G) but so far I suck.

lol, it's normal. The Mirage isn't optimised for A2G, in that respect it's a very 70's aircraft.

I guess bombing can be perfected by repetition and that is all fine (getting better there). problem arose when I started to practise on server. Now there I cant see where enemy units on ground are (lacking radar i guess)

No, you are lacking GPS navigation and a targeting pod (long range IR TV). Only the Viggen can spot targets (ships) using it's radar.

 

my first question is: How the hell you see anything on ground, especially in late afternoon or evening?

By inputting INS coordinates for the target area and visually, either by smoke marker (player or CTLD) or pre-planning recon/description of the target location i.e. 200 ft south of the white hangar.

 

I haven't had much success at altitude A2G (unless targets are marked and enemy AA is light) - so use the Mirage like a Viggen, for low level/high speed strikes dropping snakeyes (one pass, haul ass).

 

Primary objective is to drop bombs and RTB, secondary to get bombs on target.

 

Note: the HUD is about 7 pixels 'out', so waypoints/targets need to be marked/weapons released when the piper is slightly in front of their position.

 

Second question is for part when you need to GTFO there and I usually get hit by Tunguska (is is S3 system?) . As I then went to read a bit I realised that Mirage have missle detector as for radar missles so for IR ones if it can see heat signature. Also , does anyone knows how long is this system warming up ?

 

So i guess second question is more like, plea for help and tips on how not to get shot down by ground based missles. :(

 

• Route planning for terrain masking/ SAM avoidance.

• Speed (>450 kcas) and altitude (< 500 ft) to limit the opportunity for SAM's to fire,

• Visual clues for target/SAM location.

• RWR, DDM and visual scanning for SA

• Counter measures before, during and after strike phase (to counter the IR missile you don't see).

• Speedy egress (don't re-attack)

 

At altitude - speed and SA are key, if a SAM on your RWR, locks/fires at you, assume you are about to be shot down and react 'immediately', don't try to assess who it's firing at until you are safe (unless you have visual on the smoke plume and can see it's been defeated).

 

Note: Moderate altitude (12,000 - 500 ft) and speed (< 350 kcas) will make you particularly vulnerable.

 

I meant I did my best with trying to see dots but I did not saw a thing.

It's normal as targets are often difficult to spot unless moving (dust cloud).

 

It's quite possible to recreate

in the Mirage but as you'll note, the target vehicles are in in the open, so easy to spot.

 

YMMV

Edited October 24, 2018 by Ramsay

[Aries101]

So I guess I picked wrong plane. Hmm, and i well I wont say hate but I do dislike A-10C so that leaves me with like nothing for A/G role? :(

[Lucas_From_Hell]

You picked fine, don't worry. It's just that the Mirage 2000 needs a little more work.

 

 

Would you mind telling about the details of missions you're flying? That will help figuring out what's going wrong :)

[Frederf]

DCS is a lot more lethal than the environment these tactics were made for. The air defenses react quicker and are more developed than perhaps could be expected in the real world.

 

As the threat increases the tactic is strictly lofted bombs on a pre-planned set of coordinates. See the target? You'll never see the target. Someone found coordinates by recon team or satellite and tell them to you.

 

You fly in on very carefully studied route at low altitude 500-600 knots and many bombs by several fighters are released in a ~4G pull up loft flinging your bombs 4-5 miles. Your exposure time above 100-400' is ten seconds or less having gotten no closer than 3 miles at any point. Countermeasures are spewing during the whole exposure. I think DDM is for ingress and egress phase to allow some reaction to SA-7 or SA-14 covering likely routes in. Rear seater (D model gets this strike task) can put out CMs in response.

 

I just did a test and got ~10km reach with the bombs and was down on the deck in about half the time it took for the bombs to sail to (near) the target. Would it work against SA-10 without good terrain? Probably not.

 

But I did put an SA-19 and SA-8 next to the Beslan outer NDB and tried to attack it. They didn't even get a shot off most times and if they did I turned around successfully. The hard part is accuracy because auto release isn't in and the lateral "wings" guidance isn't that great.

[jojo]

Let's say that Blue SEAD isn't quite what it should be.

We are missing stand off jamming (EA-6 Prowler) and fighter's countermeasures are quite simplistic.

 

In Bosnia, Mirage 2000N performed strikes with Mk-82 in visual attack mode.

One got hit by a MANPAD because he pulled up too low.

But they were protected from medium range SAM by SEAD.

[defeatist99]

So I guess I picked wrong plane. Hmm, and i well I wont say hate but I do dislike A-10C so that leaves me with like nothing for A/G role? :(

 

 

Hornet or harrier too. But the mirage is fine for a little A/G work. Spotting ground targets takes a little practice but is far easier than spotting air targets.

[FoxAlfa]

Visibility options/graphics settings also might impact your ability to spot units... I had fiddle a bit with them to get the optimal performance... once set correctly it became much easier to spot the enemy

[Auditor]

So I guess I picked wrong plane. Hmm, and i well I wont say hate but I do dislike A-10C so that leaves me with like nothing for A/G role? :(

 

Don't discount it just yet. It has an excellent CCRP capability. I've gotten good enough at it to land MK82s on tanks from a shallow dive. It just requires practice.

I think the Mirage is a great bomb truck, all things considered. Just takes patience and a little practice.