How do I designate a CCRP target using the TGP post update

[FoxOne007]

So as long as DTOS isn't in, we're stuck with the current system of only being able to bomb steerpoints?

You're not bombing steerpoints, you're bombing your SPI, which in the Vipers case is always being passed to the jet, unlike in the A-10C where you can set a SPI via TMS Up Long and then bomb it.

Edited August 24, 2020 by FoxOne007

[fjacobsen]

I doubt that it isn´t possible to to designate targets of opportunity with the Litening and have the HUD steering line guide You.

 

Can some one, with RL knowledge, confirm that the real Litening / F-16 combo works like it does now ?

[SCPanda]

Personally, I won't touch CCRP right now until ED finishes working on TGP. It is confusing and possibly creates bad habits in the Viper, such as the zero to boresight function we had in the previous build, which was not realistic (although super easy to use).

 

I will stick to CCIP bombing for now.

[kengou]

Tested a bit yesterday and things seem to work well enough bombing things near a steerpoint. In point track it stabilized to the ground position I pointed to and remained there after maneuvers and masking. Cursor zero brings it back to the steerpoint. Snowplow mode seems to be nonfunctional though. It will snap to the right position roughly and let you slew around in front of you, but it doesn't seem to be updating the SPI position, and there is no box on the hud representing its position (possibly the DTOS function).

[Viking 1-1]

So the Tpod is with the new features now less useable then before regarding CCRP that used to be inaccurate before?

Edited August 25, 2020 by Viking 1-1

[Frederf]

I doubt that it isn´t possible to to designate targets of opportunity with the Litening and have the HUD steering line guide You.

 

Can some one, with RL knowledge, confirm that the real Litening / F-16 combo works like it does now ?

It's pretty intuitive.

 

In CCRP if you move SPI by any of the sensors (HUD, FCR, TGP) the other sensors are slaved to the priority sensor (SOI, tracking). Move TD box in HUD? The other sensors break track and follow. Move TGP? The other sensors break track and follow. Move FCR? The other sensors break track and follow. Everything looks in the same direction.

 

In snowplow SPI floats ahead of you at half FCR range until you designate. There is no SOI (there's nothing to cursor slew and no sensor to select, airplane is waiting for TMS forward to plant the SP point down). What do TGP and HUD do during pre-designate SP? I'm pretty sure HUD has no box (how can it have a target designator box, there's no target!) and TGP is standby or maybe it stares at the roving pre-designate point I dunno (doesn't sound that useful). After designate the roving point is planted on the ground and it works similar to non-snowplow. You can do DTOS or CCIP or CCRP or whatever. It's a temporary steerpoint.

 

In DTOS FCR is AGR (I think GM/GMT/SEA is available but reduces accuracy). LOS of everything is along the FPM until designate and then it works similar to CCRP/snowplow.

 

CCIP works similar to DTOS with FCR AGR, TGP LOS along pipper LOS to facilitate laser ranging and there is no TD box on HUD because it's CCIP.

[mvsgas]

I understand how to slew the TGP and do point and area tracks. How do I find a target of opportunity and say I want to do a CCRP attack on that target? I can do a point track on it but I don’t know how how designate it for the aircraft. Thank you!

 

 

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https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4465444&postcount=5

[fjacobsen]

It's pretty intuitive.

 

In CCRP if you move SPI by any of the sensors (HUD, FCR, TGP) the other sensors are slaved to the priority sensor (SOI, tracking). Move TD box in HUD? The other sensors break track and follow. Move TGP? The other sensors break track and follow. Move FCR? The other sensors break track and follow. Everything looks in the same direction.

 

In snowplow SPI floats ahead of you at half FCR range until you designate. There is no SOI (there's nothing to cursor slew and no sensor to select, airplane is waiting for TMS forward to plant the SP point down). What do TGP and HUD do during pre-designate SP? I'm pretty sure HUD has no box (how can it have a target designator box, there's no target!) and TGP is standby or maybe it stares at the roving pre-designate point I dunno (doesn't sound that useful). After designate the roving point is planted on the ground and it works similar to non-snowplow. You can do DTOS or CCIP or CCRP or whatever. It's a temporary steerpoint.

 

In DTOS FCR is AGR (I think GM/GMT/SEA is available but reduces accuracy). LOS of everything is along the FPM until designate and then it works similar to CCRP/snowplow.

 

CCIP works similar to DTOS with FCR AGR, TGP LOS along pipper LOS to facilitate laser ranging and there is no TD box on HUD because it's CCIP.

 

Your explanation sounds right, but this is not how it works now.

When TGP is SOI, the HUD Target box does not move to where You slew the TGP.

 

ONLY if the the active steerpoint is within the HUD, it kind of works.

[mrmat01]

I guess what I’m saying is That you can’t randomly skew around find a target it designate it a system target and then ccrp attack it without making the new target a steerpoint. You used to be able to look at anything at all TMS up short and get parameters to drop ordinance on it.

 

 

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Worked great was loads of fun. Now its been changed. Why ?

That was one of my favorite thing about the F-16.

I've just had months of negative training.

Edited August 27, 2020 by mrmat01

[mrmat01]

Once we have DTOS mode it may help

 

DTOS places a designation cursor on the HUD that the player can slew over a target and designate for attack.

 

Thanks

 

& this is done how? Please.

Thanks for the information.

Edited August 27, 2020 by mrmat01

[Morten RAC]

It's pretty intuitive.

 

In CCRP if you move SPI by any of the sensors (HUD, FCR, TGP) the other sensors are slaved to the priority sensor (SOI, tracking). Move TD box in HUD? The other sensors break track and follow. Move TGP? The other sensors break track and follow. Move FCR? The other sensors break track and follow. Everything looks in the same direction.

 

In snowplow SPI floats ahead of you at half FCR range until you designate. There is no SOI (there's nothing to cursor slew and no sensor to select, airplane is waiting for TMS forward to plant the SP point down). What do TGP and HUD do during pre-designate SP? I'm pretty sure HUD has no box (how can it have a target designator box, there's no target!) and TGP is standby or maybe it stares at the roving pre-designate point I dunno (doesn't sound that useful). After designate the roving point is planted on the ground and it works similar to non-snowplow. You can do DTOS or CCIP or CCRP or whatever. It's a temporary steerpoint.

 

In DTOS FCR is AGR (I think GM/GMT/SEA is available but reduces accuracy). LOS of everything is along the FPM until designate and then it works similar to CCRP/snowplow.

 

CCIP works similar to DTOS with FCR AGR, TGP LOS along pipper LOS to facilitate laser ranging and there is no TD box on HUD because it's CCIP.

 

FCR (Fire controlled radar) isn't that still, only availible for Air to Air purposes? How can this be slewed in snowplow mode without TGP is the sensor of interest? I can only see the SP function availible when I have my TGP up on my MFD. Sorry for the dumb questions, but I'm trying to learn from how to use the features

 

Cheers :):smartass::smilewink::book:

[Frederf]

Fire control radar. No AG FCR in DCS yet. You don't slew SP before designate, you have to fly the airplane. After designate SPI initializes grounded at the SP offset point and you slew from there.

 

As it is right now in DCS? It's a bit weird right now so don't use it or be aware it can get really cross eyed. My best luck was making sure never to SOI HUD slew in SP and TGP was SOI when I TMS right to area. But messing with it I got the TD box and TGP hopelessly decoupled.

[CBenson89]

Do you have to be at a certain altitude for the snowplow mode to move the target designator box to wherever you are facing? I was using snow plow earlier and couldn’t get it work and all of a sudden I got higher than 5000 feet hit the snowplow mode button and the hud targeting box appeared on my hud and was slewable after I initiated an area track.

 

 

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[Emmy]

Do you have to be at a certain altitude for the snowplow mode to move the target designator box to wherever you are facing? I was using snow plow earlier and couldn’t get it work and all of a sudden I got higher than 5000 feet hit the snowplow mode button and the hud targeting box appeared on my hud and was slewable after I initiated an area track.

 

 

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The lower you are, the more the fixed angle in snowplow mode will be below your nose so I’d say yes, you have to get higher to get it farther in front of you.

[CBenson89]

Well what I’m saying is snow plow mode would work for the TGP but it wouldn’t bring the HUD targeting box onto my hud until I got above a certain altitude. We all know the HUD targeting box is locked to your current steerpoint but entering snow plow mode enables you to move the hud box around. It doesn’t work every time and I don’t know if it’s because it’s buggy or there are certain things I’m not doing.

 

 

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[Frederf]

Snowplow isn't a fixed angle, but a fixed range. If FCR is 80nm then it's 40nm. If FCR is 40nm then it's 20nm and so on.

 

HUD TD box should be over the SPI or target point. Target location is commonly steerpoint plus system slews. SP creates a temporary steerpoint (pseudosteerpoint) so the same logic applies. You can move the HUD TD box is all (almost all?) modes, snow plow or not. Really you're moving SPI and the box is a passive reflection of changing SPI position but intuitively it will feel like direct TD movement by cursor.

 

You should find that moving FCR cursors, TGP, or slews in the HUD will move the TD box always and the other sensors will follow (stopping tracking if necessary). Later when there are such things as offset aimpoints or VIP/VRP then the TD will be over the notional target which can be different than the SPI.

[crcr7]

As it is right now in DCS? It's a bit weird right now so don't use it or be aware it can get really cross eyed. My best luck was making sure never to SOI HUD slew in SP and TGP was SOI when I TMS right to area. But messing with it I got the TD box and TGP hopelessly decoupled.

 

 

+1 Seems buggy unless there's something I'm doing that I can't figure out.

[Emmy]

So I guess I don’t get the problem.

 

I’ve flown to an airbase with the SP in the middle of the runway but I’ve CCRP’d GBU-12s all over the base by simply putting the bomb fall line in the middle of the VV and pickled.

 

Lasing at roughly 15 seconds TTI and I’ve never missed. I don’t think I’ve ever even worried about whether the target box was on the HUD or not.

[CBenson89]

Right but what if you’re trying to ccrp attack a point with cluster or dumb bombs. That’s why we have to use the buggy sp work around.

 

 

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[Frederf]

So I guess I don’t get the problem.

 

I’ve flown to an airbase with the SP in the middle of the runway but I’ve CCRP’d GBU-12s all over the base by simply putting the bomb fall line in the middle of the VV and pickled.

 

Lasing at roughly 15 seconds TTI and I’ve never missed. I don’t think I’ve ever even worried about whether the target box was on the HUD or not.

 

I could easily generate a situation where the TGP was looking at a target straight ahead (area track, SOI) but the TD box and CCRP aiming symbology was a completely different direction in the current DCS version. The real plane doesn't do that and it's impossible to deliver an LGB to your TGP target from such a state.

[Emmy]

But if the bomb fall line has moved relative to where you were looking while slaved to the steerpoint, then hasn’t the target box moved as well? Doesn’t the bomb fall line track the system target as defined by the target box?

[fjacobsen]

Problem now is that initially the TD box on the HUD is set to the active steerpoint.

If the steerpoint / TD box is within the field of view of the HUD, then You can slave it via the TGP.

But if the active steerpoint is outside the HUD FOV, then it won´t slave and keeps staying at the steerpoint.

[Emmy]

Ok, now that’s a limitation that makes sense I guess.

[Frederf]

I don't know if limitation is a good word since it's not something with real airplane does. TD being within the HUD display area or not doesn't change what cursor does.

 

To answer your question, yes TD box CCRP aiming etc. are all together but TGP is pointed a completely different direction. That shouldn't happen and is a problem when you want to define target by TGP.

 

One thing I noticed is that in DCS it's possible to HUD-cursor the TD box into the sky which makes no sense. The cursor slews I believe should be constricted to the ground surface. Cursor movement on HUD should be adjusting latitude-longitude of TD box and not in "HUD space".

[Danzig]

I don't know if limitation is a good word since it's not something with real airplane does. TD being within the HUD display area or not doesn't change what cursor does.

 

To answer your question, yes TD box CCRP aiming etc. are all together but TGP is pointed a completely different direction. That shouldn't happen and is a problem when you want to define target by TGP.

 

One thing I noticed is that in DCS it's possible to HUD-cursor the TD box into the sky which makes no sense. The cursor slews I believe should be constricted to the ground surface. Cursor movement on HUD should be adjusting latitude-longitude of TD box and not in "HUD space".

 

 

 

 

 

 

is it like this?

 

 

 

I switch between SP and CZ -> works fine.

 

Suddently it doesn't ....

 

--> i made a video