AIM-120 Strange Notches and Not Reacquiring

[777coletrain]

Over the last month or so I've noticed that AIM-120s have been acting strangely. I have some good examples on Tacview however, they are server side. 

 

SUS11 No Notch Loss:

   Shooter SUS 1-1|Coletrain

Hostile aircraft doesn't notch the missile after going pitbull. The missile doesn't go for chaff and the aircraft turns hot inside the radar cone with no reacquisition.

 

SUS12 Vertical Notch:

   Shooter SUS 1-2|Nightwolf in ACM

Missile is notched while pointing around 60 degrees up. The second shot goes straight off the rail then suddenly pulls 30Gs and overshoots the target. After that it continues pulling 19Gs past the vertical. 

 

SUS12 Doesn't Reacquire:

   Shooter SUS 1-2|Nightwolf

20nm shot to force them defensive. Missile lofts and looses track, hostile aircraft flies right in front of the seeker without it reacquiring.

 

SUS12 Weird Notch

   Shooter SUS 1-2|Nightwolf

AI flies straight up and notches the missile on the horizon. This one is the most understandable but still strange.

SUS11 No Notch Loss.acmi SUS12 Vertical Notch.zip.acmi SUS12 Doesn't Reacquire.zip.acmi SUS12 Weird Notch.zip.acmi

[Nightwolf]

I should note, aside from the vertical notch one, my shots were in RWS ST SAM, which seems to be acting kind of strange recently. Not sure what happened with the one called Vertical Notch, but I was in ACM STT for both. I do have a track replay, unfortunately it's 180MB and 2 hours long since this is from a normal multiplayer session.

[Coxy_99]

Working as intended i believe. 

[Cmptohocah]

23 hours ago, Coxy_99 said:

Working as intended i believe. 

You know what they say: if at first you don't succeed...
How many Mega G's were involved in this "fish hook" maneuver?

[Krippz]

23 hours ago, Coxy_99 said:

Working as intended i believe. 

Can you post a track and not a gif and state which version of open beta this was done on. The reason for the request is that some people have been sharing old gif's that aren't representative of the current open beta. 

[Coxy_99]

This was tested after beta  patch release:

, Yes we test after each release, we dont troll in testing missiles we troll what we find  

Edited February 5, 2021 by Coxy_99

[Nealius]

Was......did that pull a 180 turn? 

[Blinky.ben]

7 hours ago, Nealius said:

Was......did that pull a 180 turn? 

Yep Aim-120’s been doing 180’s for along time now. Due to a big problem with a bug that effects the SD-10 a quick solution from ED was to give the SD-10 the same API to the SD-10 but with some tweaks (longer burn motor and down graded counter measure resistance) due to them being so similar until ED can fix the root cause. So now the SD-10 shares the same benefits (doing 180’s) as the Aim-120 and also the disadvantages. Although the SD-10 falls like a meteor under 200knots. 120 strangely falls down but the seeker will keep turning and tracking so there is another value changed somewhere to make this difference, but it’s of no benefit either way.

Edited February 6, 2021 by Blinky.ben

[Coxy_99]

7 hours ago, Blinky.ben said:

Yep Aim-120’s been doing 180’s for along time now. Due to a big problem with a bug that effects the SD-10 a quick solution from ED was to give the SD-10 the same API to the SD-10 but with some tweaks (longer burn motor and down graded counter measure resistance) due to them being so similar until ED can fix the root cause. So now the SD-10 shares the same benefits (doing 180’s) as the Aim-120 and also the disadvantages. Although the SD-10 falls like a meteor under 200knots. 120 strangely falls down but the seeker will keep turning and tracking so there is another value changed somewhere to make this difference, but it’s of no benefit either way.

 

Correct because SD10 is using 120 seeker 120 is also known as 120C-X

[GGTharos]

On 2/5/2021 at 11:57 AM, Cmptohocah said:

You know what they say: if at first you don't succeed...
How many Mega G's were involved in this "fish hook" maneuver?

 

Zero, if you understand the relationship between g and speed.  The SD-10 is a 38g missile (claim from manufacturer IIRC), so pulling a huge turn with no speed at the end is not surprsing.  What is surprising is its ability to track through this (not completely but eeeeh) since the seeker should be gimbal-limited.   There may be some issues with radar memory being less 'memory' and more 'fake the lock for this amount of time'.

[TaxDollarsAtWork]

When the launch is sus!

Spoiler

 

[nighthawk2174]

5 hours ago, GGTharos said:

less 'memory' and more 'fake the lock for this amount of time'.

This is my suspicion as well hence why it doesn't re-acquire after being chaffed.

[Cmptohocah]

6 hours ago, GGTharos said:

 

Zero, if you understand the relationship between g and speed...

I did an entire post on kinematics of turning, but can't find it now after the forum update. The gist of it, is that in a turn, the "G"s provide the radius of a turn. The higher the Gs for a certain speed, the smaller the turn radius. In short, for the missile to turn, it needs Gs to pull it into a turn. No Gs, no turn.

[GGTharos]

3 hours ago, Cmptohocah said:

I did an entire post on kinematics of turning, but can't find it now after the forum update. The gist of it, is that in a turn, the "G"s provide the radius of a turn. The higher the Gs for a certain speed, the smaller the turn radius. In short, for the missile to turn, it needs Gs to pull it into a turn. No Gs, no turn.

 

That's great.  The moment it pulls max g it starts losing speed, but it's still pulling plenty of g to keep the radius small.  It's designed to out-perform aircraft that have a turn radius that's pretty small.