Debunking RVE MOD myths.

[A.S]

Hey, I have a question. In reading the PDF you guys say you all realized that LOMAC will not be patched any further. Are you guys just making a very educated guess or has ED specifically said this?

 

 

..just a guess..further questions about this may be pointed to ED please.

[RvEYoda]

Most probably should change that to "wont be patched within any foreseeable future"

 

RvE and 104ths server are using it fully.

RAF i believe are testing parts of it

 

Now I am interested to see anyone saying "ED did not intend for things to work like this".

How do you know that? How do you know that it was not simply a call of "this will take too much

time to make" or "not worth the effort" or simply "oh we didn't think about that".

 

It's just everyday at a time and you deal with what you see. Some parts are much easier to find after the product

is released, but by that time the development focus may already have shifted to another product.

 

The mod deals with exploits. These are naturally something that are extremely hard to find before the

product is released...and ways of playing that was not anticipated or intended. Nevertheless after many

years online Lo bvr turned into not who was using proper tactics or methods of engagement, but rather who

knew the most about the game code and could exploit it.

 

That is the core that LRM attempts to change.

The person who reads most theory and exploits his opponents weaknesses

(rather than exploiting unforseen weaknesses in the game code) wins.

 

That is also how you can bring this knowledge with you to the next gen flight sims that will

undoubtedly require more realistic tactics and approaches to engagements.

Edited October 6, 2008 by =RvE=Yoda

[RedTiger]

..just a guess..further questions about this may be pointed to ED please.

 

Gotcha! ;)

[RedTiger]

For the record, I think this is some good work. I wish there was a way to make this work with single player! The ECM changes are great. It makes it more like Falcon where jamming denies you a lock until you are very close. I voted in favor of it because I would have no problems flying online with this. In fact, I'd rather fly online with these changes!

[RvEYoda]

I am hoping for RvE to organize some LRM event in the near future.

It could be a simple side vs side game without respawn...

or.....an even where it takes 5-10 minutes to rearm or respawn

 

First team to land at enemy home base wins. Any thoughst? :)

[A.S]

Nevertheless after many

years online Lo bvr turned into not who was using proper tactics or methods of engagement, but rather who

knew the most about the game code and could exploit it.

 

That is the core that LRM attempts to change.

The person who reads most theory and exploits his opponents weaknesses

(rather than exploiting unforseen weaknesses in the game code) wins.

 

That is also how you can bring this knowledge with you to the next gen flight sims that will

undoubtedly require more realistic tactics and approaches to engagements.

 

NICE ONE :thumbup:

[Mustang]

People are may break into camps.

This could hurt the community.

 

LOL i think you'll know by now that this has been the case LONG before the LRM work came along, i cannot see it making things any different :)

 

If anything this work brings more variety into the MP scene, and i'm sure there will be other servers that will not use this mod, end result being the player has the choice of 'vanilla' lockon and, well, 'real'.

 

Everyones a winner! :thumbup:

[Boneski]

Bro no diss here...but no member of the combat aviation community is going to share life and death data so lets end that myth now.

 

Also don't get so bent. Just because someone does not agree it's not the end of the world.

 

You like the mod. You should use the mod. One opinion should not have any bearing on your point of view.

 

As for theory, we can compare logbooks any time...

 

Enjoy the mod, GGT.

 

 

Thanks for dissing long hours of checking with source material from USAF and Russian Airforce, talk with pilots who flew at least some of those machines, and the effort it took to actually create this mod.

 

You're just like everyone else who comes in with their 'you're just speculating' theory. No, we are not. The goal was to enforce more realistic BVR combat as hinted at or directly described by those source materials and said pilots, and it worked.

[Boneski]

AirTito,

 

You are right. People should like this mod if it fixes what they want fixed. It's great work. It puts on display the skills of the mod's creators as well the flexibility of the program.

 

The opinion shared is based on the idea that it changes the way the game operates. Now if the developers say that this type of mod fixes something they feel is broken then all is well. But if they feel like nothing is wrong then what is the mod really fixing? Making two elements more balanced based on what user feel??? That's cool too

 

But Fellas please enjoy the good work. Do not take this in a negative way. It's just one observation.

 

 

The 104th runs it too.

 

 

 

May I ask on what you base this statement because as I posted above, there hasn't been any negative feedback from people who have tried it. On the opposite- everyone agrees it totaly improves gameplay.

Edited October 6, 2008 by Boneski

[Pilotasso]

The community has been split in half ever since Flamming cliffs came along. AMRAAM was turned into a mach 2.5 missile, ECM burn through was brought down to 13 miles in order to use HOJ features and people fond out about missile seeker gimbal limits omni search patterns. ED did not forsee that the feature that makes the radars loose lock when someone engages ECM also enables players invulnerable to radars when they clycle it repeatedly. Lua script interface with the game increased giving players the ability to develop their own custom avionics suite (à lá F-35)...they opened pandoras box realy.

 

I dont say this is the way ED intended, infact it seemed to me that the game was continuously being further broken because ED added features without having ironed out old bugs and other basic features that were never brought back from their ommited/unfinished status ever since the SIM was released.

 

This MOD is server based (I have always been against client based SA scripts that are shared among finger tiped chosen individuals) wich makes every player stand in equal terms in a more realistic enviroment.

Edited October 6, 2008 by Pilotasso

[A.S]

yoda (unleashing the devils. hihi ) ...that idea to improve that mod to an anticheat-tool ( oh yess this is directed to the guys who fight vs "oh Enemies-look like a B-52 bombers" visually without using radars and over miles) is more and more making me smile :music_whistling:

 

PS: nope ...i dont explain what im talking bout....but many know !

 

tumm ti tumm ...la laa :poster_oops::hehe:

[DarkWanderer]

Lua script interface with the game increased giving players the ability to develop their own custom avionics suite (à lá F-35)...they opened pandoras box realy.

wich makes every player stand in equal terms in a more realistic enviroment.

Don't you forget the first point is impossible when someone's not looking for the ephemeral second one?..

[Pilotasso]

Sorry...didnt get it... ^^^^ :huh:

 

To me it would make more sense to say the second point is impossible when people are looking for the first one.

Edited October 6, 2008 by Pilotasso

[DarkWanderer]

Sorry...didnt get it...

I mean LUA exporting (=scripting) is disabled in multiplayer by default, and RvE's mod requires it on. Or did they do a workaround?..

[A.S]

I mean LUA exporting (=scripting) is disabled in multiplayer by default, and RvE's mod requires it on. Or did they do a workaround?..

 

they did :)

 

export.lua is OFF on server ..( no tacview or similar possible for clients)

 

my mentioning bout anti-cheat tool was a push on yodas shoulders and a hint for the rest ,)

Edited October 6, 2008 by A.S

[Pilotasso]

^^^^^^

 

Edited October 6, 2008 by Pilotasso

[RvEYoda]

Bro no diss here...but no member of the combat aviation community is going to share life and death data so lets end that myth now.

 

Also don't get so bent. Just because someone does not agree it's not the end of the world.

 

You like the mod. You should use the mod. One opinion should not have any bearing on your point of view.

 

As for theory, we can compare logbooks any time...

 

Enjoy the mod, GGT.

 

 

I will disagree with you Boneski.

There is a lot information both available from talking to pilots,

SAM system operators, engineers, mechanics,

but also in flight manuals and test data from multiple systems.

 

The question is only how much we have on, but you see there

is an abundance on older system data. when it comes to 80s it gets

scarcer, and for 90s weapon systems you must dig pretty deep,

but I assure you there is more available than you think.

 

Don't diss it before you see it, because, yes, it is what you are doing.

[PoleCat]

I think most will end up embracing this Mod. Well those who want a more realistic experience at least. If balance and more realistic tactics are the desired out come for you, rest assured LRM delivers on both of these key points. With the realease of LRM I think we now have two versions of LockOn as Mustang said, LockOn "Light" and LockOn "Real". IMHO most will choose the latter. It really shines the light on those who would use exploits and nullifies them as an unfair advantage.

 

Big thanks to Yoda for all the hard work on this great gift for the community. Excellent!

 

Out

Edited October 6, 2008 by PoleCat

[X-man]

The LRM will split the community, it's just a matter of how many in each camp. Just look at the intense HL discussion the other day.

 

Im for the LRM, but I dont like these "lockon lite" and "lockon real" expressions...

[A.S]

i never feared changes..... the only thing what will be always a constant ..is chance.....but ignorance is deadly.

 

what is the point in getting stuck... ?

 

there was a saying for pilots:

 

the day you stop trying to get better....thats the day you stop being good...

 

same for sims i guess :smilewink:

[PoleCat]

The LRM will split the community, it's just a matter of how many in each camp. Just look at the intense HL discussion the other day.

 

Im for the LRM, but I dont like these "lockon lite" and "lockon real" expressions...

 

41-5 is not much of a split. I don't think it will be such a big jump for most people. They can learn real tactics and apply them much better with LRM. That is why I think it is fair to call them light and real. Don't know why any one woud be offended by this. It is true isn't it that LRM is more relaistic then 1.12? We could call them LockOn "A" and LockOn "B" if you want. It really changes nothing.

 

They are just too different to be the same.

 

Out

Edited October 6, 2008 by PoleCat

[PoleCat]

i never feared changes..... the only thing what will be always a constant ..is chance.....but ignorance is deadly.

 

what is the point in getting stuck... ?

 

there was a saying for pilots:

 

the day you stop trying to get better....thats the day you stop being good...

 

same for sims i guess :smilewink:

 

"Change has no Constituents"

 

Niccolo Machiavelli

[X-man]

41-5 is not much of a split.

Well, I dont think 46 people make up the whole community, nor do I think that everyone that plays LO comes to these forums...It seems though, that the one that DO come here, votes for the LRM...

That is why I think it is fair to call them light and real. Don't know why any one woud be offended by this. It is true isn't it that LRM is more relaistic then 1.12? If so we could call them LockOn "A" and LockOn "B" if you want. It really changes nothing.

The way this whole thread is going towards is; If you dont fly with LRM, you're nothing more than a stupid gamer who can go fly with xbox instead. Call it what it is, Lockon with or without LRM.

 

Tell me how realistic it is to get punished for maddogging an amraam? Good for gameplay, yes! Realistic no...

 

Again, Im for the LRM, I just dont like the tone of this discussion...

[RvEYoda]

Xman that was me making the comment about xbox.

Never wrote it comparing lockon to lockon lrm.

 

I wrote it because the guy I was speaking to threw a truckload

of sarcasm at us, so I dumped some back at him. He was speaking about

things that weren't true whatsoever, not having read documentation or

anything else, simply stating "game balance will be ruined" (which it btw

isn't), but if all he cares about is game balance and have no interest

in realism in the combination with balance, then is when he should

try xbox instead imo.

 

I've already pointed out multiple times in the documentation that

the mod includes both direct and indirect methods to enforce a more

realistic engagement atmosphere. That is the goal of the mod.

Edited October 6, 2008 by =RvE=Yoda

[X-man]

Yoda, I wasnt refering to your post...