EP-13 Sight in VR not very good sight wise?

[The_Nephilim]

Hi Guys,

'

I just got reinterested in the Viggen and currently use VR. I have looked for a similar topic just incase it was covered not mention of the issue with VR I think I am having.

 

I tried the Beachead and tank busting mission and I noticed the EP-13 sight for the maverick is terrible. I am unable to make anything out in it sight wise.. I see some really wavy lines in it that obscure my seeing what is there. I thought this sight had a Fresnel lens in it to help it work better visually.

 

In the beachead mission I can barely make out the Ships now before when I flew the Viggen with my Projector 3D Vision setup it looked much better then it does in VR.

 

I have tried making adjustments to the brightnes and contrast it helps but very little. it is as if the sight is broke in VR, I am really not sure how to explain it but I was just wondering is the EP-13 Sight really that bad IRL for Visual, I know it is not a sniper pod or similar but when I used it before on my Old setup it was way much clearer and looked like a Fresnel lens was in it..

 

I will not be able to get a screenshot. I tried it with NO Mods I get the same effect. this is a brand new Windows install and DCS Install. I have a Rift S and use a 1638x1776 res for it.. specs should be in my Signature.

[Hawkeye_UK]

i have to turn the contrast down and brightness, but i do not have an issue its very, very clear.  I do lean into the sight though to look at it also with my head just infront of the site.

 

I use 1024 for cockpit settings, textures high and a PD of 1.1 and MSAAx2 and either on my G2 or Quest 2 (running 1.7 72hz or 80hz) i do not have an issue with the sight optics.  What you may reference is that the zoom levels are not that of the TGP.

 

It is all about knowing where the target is and then shifting the site small distances to lock.  I actually fine the 75's on the viggen rediculous they are way to easy to lock and will jump on the target, about the best mav in game to be fair.

 

Hate to suggest it but i honestly think its your settingsm or headset.

[The_Nephilim]

OK well I matched your DCS settings but I am unclear as to what SS you set in the VR Headsets. Do you only have it at 1.1 PD in game and 1.7SS in the VR Headset software or SteamVR???

 

I am still getting tyhey look like scan lines or something in the Image it is not clear. will try and mess with some more settings but if you could post your Ingame setting that would be great..

 

I know the Rift S is a little lacking but everything else seems clear to me except the EP-13.. I will see if I can get a ingame picture of it through the headset..

[The_Nephilim]

Well I was looking at some videos on youtube and maybe what I am seeing is a residue if a CRT Screen. so is the EP-13 in the Viggen a CRT Monitor guessing fromn the age I am pretty sure it is..

 

So maybe what I see is a residual of a CRT Screen. When I get within an inch of the screen the image cleans up. 

I also tried increasing the SS but it just made the game run with a high Frametime.. I am probally seeing what I should see and maybe never noticed it with my Projector setup?

 

 

[The_Nephilim]

well it looks like wavy lines on the fresnel lens and not in the image. so it looks to be an undesired effect..

[The_Nephilim]

OK I found a picture of what happens to the EP-13 ingame in VR. This Post is a picture of a cellphone screen. now note the wavy lines going vertical. it looks like that but the wavy lines move with my headmovement very distracting..

 

So basically it is either the headset or the EP-13.

 

 

https://www.overclock.net/threads/can-one-of-you-gods-review-my-oc-please.1792789/

[Machalot]

That's called the Moire effect and is a result of spatial aliasing.  It occurs when your screen resolution is too low for the texture it's trying to display. 

[The_Nephilim]

4 hours ago, Machalot said:

That's called the Moire effect and is a result of spatial aliasing.  It occurs when your screen resolution is too low for the texture it's trying to display. 

Hey Wow so there is such a thing and I was not seeing things.. thank you for that explanation and telling me what it was called.. IS there anything I can do to fix it?

[Machalot]

I'm not really sure. A higher resolution display obviously.  But aside from that, maybe anti-aliasing?

[The_Nephilim]

Well I tried setting the rez higher in the Rift S and it seemed to have the opposite effect. when I was far away from the EP13 it looked fine but when I moved my head closer to it the wavy lines appeared. Wehn I have the normal rez the wavy lines are there far away but dissapear when getting closer to it..

 

I think I will just leave the rez where it is at and just move my head closer as that seemed to have made the wavy lines go away.. I tried with msaa x4 and there where still wavy lines so I dont think AA has any effect..

 

But I found a workaround for now thnx. 

[The_Nephilim]

Hey, I just bought a used Reverb G2 and I am going to see if I get the same effect on the EP-13 that I did with the Rift S. If it is still there in the G2 I will know it is something in the game which I think it is the Rift S lower res. or lenses or something.

 

So we shall see. 

[The_Nephilim]

Well with the G2 I get the same effect in the EP-13 lens.. I am wondering if it is supposed to look like this or is  it a weird lens issue with the EP13 Fresnel lens?

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

I am a Quest 2 user. It is very difficult to see an AFV-sided object through EP-13 until the object is pretty close to the aircraft and I see it from the cockpit (on VR Zoom). I notice the effect mentioned and my rig is not powerful enough to run G2 at full-res so I cannot compare. I take it as is for now and hope it gets better later.

 

Addition: I check the photos on Chuck's Guide and the weird colour lines are presence too. I guess it is "as is". I think G2 is more enjoyable flying in than Quest 2. Enjoy. 

Edited August 26, 2021 by VFGiPJP

[The_Nephilim]

well my rig is not powerful enough to run the G2 at native res I run SteamVR @ 50%..    but I had a rift S and thought it could have been the rez of it but that is not it..

 

I think it is some wierd effect with the Fresnel lens on the EP-13..

[MYSE1234]

9 hours ago, The_Nephilim said:

well my rig is not powerful enough to run the G2 at native res I run SteamVR @ 50%..    but I had a rift S and thought it could have been the rez of it but that is not it..

 

I think it is some wierd effect with the Fresnel lens on the EP-13..

There is no Fresnel lens in the EP-13, only regular lenses.
Most likely what you are seeing is a Moire effect between the scan line effect on the EP-13 image, and the display/pixels on the VR headset. I think it will be difficult getting rid of this problem as we have physics working against us.

I agree it's a bit problematic, the scan line effect is much more pronounced in VR than it is on a regular monitor.

The scan line size could work as a function of the display/monitor resolution, which might explain why it's more pronounced in VR.

[The_Nephilim]

4 hours ago, MYSE1234 said:

There is no Fresnel lens in the EP-13, only regular lenses.
Most likely what you are seeing is a Moire effect between the scan line effect on the EP-13 image, and the display/pixels on the VR headset. I think it will be difficult getting rid of this problem as we have physics working against us.

I agree it's a bit problematic, the scan line effect is much more pronounced in VR than it is on a regular monitor.

The scan line size could work as a function of the display/monitor resolution, which might explain why it's more pronounced in VR.

I just checked the manual and it states it has a collimated lens.. I thought it was a fresnel lens I was wrong. so maybe this collimated lens has some funny issues I am seeing.. it is more in VR but I can look past it I was just trying to determine what the artifacts cause was, that is all and if anyone else is seeing it in VR..

[Streicher]

I also sometimes see a very heavy moire effect in the EP13, using a Rift S. I think it happens more often when it is dusk or night time.
This is one of the more annoying graphics bugs in the Viggen. When it happens it's probably for the best to abandon the sight and switch to boresight and HUD.

[IronMike]

Thank you all, I tracked it for us to investigate if we can do something about that.

[MYSE1234]

@The_Nephilim If you still have the problem with the scan line pattern give this a try. This will completely removed the scan lines (and the chromatic aberration).
It also passes IC.

EP-13 - scan line remove.zip EP-13 - scan line remove and chromatic abberation.zip

Edited October 1, 2021 by MYSE1234