Graphics Card For DCS World

[Flyboy-Pumpz]

Hi everyone! I currently have a GeForce GTX 1660, and I want to know if this is a good graphics card for the game, or if I should try and upgrade my GPU. Thank you for any given information, and I hope everyone is doing well!

Edited November 14, 2021 by Flyboy-Pumpz

[Hector45]

It's not ideal, but it all depends on what you find acceptable. Have you tried it out yet to see how it performs and what graphic settings you have to compromise? What is your display resolution?

[Bossco82]

HI Flyboy,

Mate its not that simple, the GPU you require relies on the resolution you are going to run DCS at, IE the dots on the screen.

1920x1080 will be 2,073,600 pixels on the monitor, you would need for high settings in DCS, GTX 1070, 1080 or RTX 2060, 2070, 3060 maybe super versions when using high/ultra settings. For AMD probably a 5700 for high settings. Im not familiar with earlier AMD cards.

2560x1440 will be 3,686,400 pixels. This will require, GTX 1080 or 1080ti, RTX 2060 super, 2070 super, 3060ti, 3070. For AMD I know a 5700XT will do this at high settings. However your CPU and motherboard/DDR memory will be barely coping at this resolution. 

4k, 3840x2160 will be 8,294,400 pixels. At this point and I am not joking you will need a complete PC rebuild, because it takes a 3080, 3080ti or 3090 to cope with DCS on high settings using 4k.

The higher the resolution the more power the whole system needs. Not just the GPU.

Finally you need a decent PSU to runs these graphics cards. Preferable gold rated. You have to check the wattage and amps the GPU requires and make sure your power supply can provide that power under load. 

I know your system from another thread, that pretty much limits you to 1920x1080 resolution. Replacing anything in a PC is not exactly an off the shelf thing. Its one complete system and every components performance relies on the others. If I were you look what power supply you have and that will tell you if you can even upgrade your GPU or not. 

Your system,

i5 9400f, Asrock B360M, 8gb DDR4 (speed ???), Storage ???, Cooling ???, PSU ???, GTX 1660. You cant just change one thing. Decide what you want to do with DCS. For example you might want to fly using 1080p resolution on high settings with 4x MSAA to improve image quality. You can probably upgrade your machine for this. If you want 1440p resolution on ultra settings with super sampling for the best image quality. Buy a completely new system and start from scratch. 

This is all why I said in your other thread see if you can simply try the basic install of DCS on your current system first. Chasing graphic performance and eye candy on DCS can become a proper money pit. Some guys on here have spent thousands to get the best DCS experience.

[BitMaster]

^ He is 100% right !

[Flyboy-Pumpz]

On 11/14/2021 at 10:33 AM, Bossco82 said:

HI Flyboy,

Mate its not that simple, the GPU you require relies on the resolution you are going to run DCS at, IE the dots on the screen.

1920x1080 will be 2,073,600 pixels on the monitor, you would need for high settings in DCS, GTX 1070, 1080 or RTX 2060, 2070, 3060 maybe super versions when using high/ultra settings. For AMD probably a 5700 for high settings. Im not familiar with earlier AMD cards.

2560x1440 will be 3,686,400 pixels. This will require, GTX 1080 or 1080ti, RTX 2060 super, 2070 super, 3060ti, 3070. For AMD I know a 5700XT will do this at high settings. However your CPU and motherboard/DDR memory will be barely coping at this resolution. 

4k, 3840x2160 will be 8,294,400 pixels. At this point and I am not joking you will need a complete PC rebuild, because it takes a 3080, 3080ti or 3090 to cope with DCS on high settings using 4k.

The higher the resolution the more power the whole system needs. Not just the GPU.

Finally you need a decent PSU to runs these graphics cards. Preferable gold rated. You have to check the wattage and amps the GPU requires and make sure your power supply can provide that power under load. 

I know your system from another thread, that pretty much limits you to 1920x1080 resolution. Replacing anything in a PC is not exactly an off the shelf thing. Its one complete system and every components performance relies on the others. If I were you look what power supply you have and that will tell you if you can even upgrade your GPU or not. 

Your system,

i5 9400f, Asrock B360M, 8gb DDR4 (speed ???), Storage ???, Cooling ???, PSU ???, GTX 1660. You cant just change one thing. Decide what you want to do with DCS. For example you might want to fly using 1080p resolution on high settings with 4x MSAA to improve image quality. You can probably upgrade your machine for this. If you want 1440p resolution on ultra settings with super sampling for the best image quality. Buy a completely new system and start from scratch. 

This is all why I said in your other thread see if you can simply try the basic install of DCS on your current system first. Chasing graphic performance and eye candy on DCS can become a proper money pit. Some guys on here have spent thousands to get the best DCS experience.

So if I were to download it on HDD just to test and see how it runs, would that only affect the games loading speeds and make them slower, or will the HDD download also drop FPS? I’ve researched it and from what I know, downloading games basically only affects loading speeds. I’m not sure if this is true for DCS, but that is what I have heard. So should I just download it on my HDD, and then move it to my SSD when I have everything upgraded in my PC? Another thing is, my CPU and RAM does not meet the recommended requirements for those parts. Do I still download it anyway and see how it runs, because it will only be on the lowest system requirements? Thank you for your time! You have truly been amazing through all of this! Have a great day!

Edited November 16, 2021 by Flyboy-Pumpz

[Bossco82]

Hi Flyboy,

I have never ran DCS installed on a mechanical HDD. Its an educated guess it will only slow down loading times. You might have to let a mission settle down while the terrain loads up for a few seconds too.

Mate Im just saying try it. DCS can become a money pit because once you start flying you want more eye candy.

Also use this to see where your system struggles. Then you can make a properly informed decision on investing in what you might need to upgrade.

I went through this in lockdown. It was literally build a DCS PC or change my beat up old car. I picked DCS. So I know from experience. However some guys on here are much more knowledgeable than I am. Things like DCD settings etc.

[BitMaster]

It won't neccessarily temper fps but a HDD will cause some stutter here and there when it needs to load things. The less RAM/VRAM the more this happens...I think you get the idea.

Try it out.

[Flyboy-Pumpz]

9 hours ago, BitMaster said:

It won't neccessarily temper fps but a HDD will cause some stutter here and there when it needs to load things. The less RAM/VRAM the more this happens...I think you get the idea.

Try it out.

So could you explain a little more in depth about my RAM, and maybe the CPU. If you have the information, what is the affect of not enough RAM, and since my GHz of my CPU is .10 below the recommended amount, will my game still run fine, or no. (PS I only have 2.90 GHz on mu CPU, and 8GB of RAM installed)

[Bossco82]

You will have to lower the quality of graphics settings, especially the preload radius, and, the texture quality, to get a smooth framerate, FPS. So it looks smooth enough to fly around basically.

The 2.9Ghz is your base clock I think your cpu has a boost function. Flyboy seriously just try it and see what happens. 

What monitor screen are you planning on using for this?

 

[Flyboy-Pumpz]

2 hours ago, Bossco82 said:

You will have to lower the quality of graphics settings, especially the preload radius, and, the texture quality, to get a smooth framerate, FPS. So it looks smooth enough to fly around basically.

The 2.9Ghz is your base clock I think your cpu has a boost function. Flyboy seriously just try it and see what happens. 

What monitor screen are you planning on using for this?

 

You mean resolution or like 1 of my 2 monitors? I am planning to play 1080p and I am going to play on my display 1 monitor (the monitor right in front of me) is that what you were asking for? Also if you know this, how do I boost the GHz of my cpu from 2.9 to the recommended 3 if that’s possible?

Edited November 17, 2021 by Flyboy-Pumpz

[Bossco82]

Yeah the monitor you will play on. So you are going to play DCS at 1080p, that's 1920x1080 resolution. That a good place to start.

As for your CPU being 2.9Ghz. Turning it to 3.0Ghz will make almost no difference.

The games requirements are a guide not a rule, ok. The best way to work out what you need is to try it. Then see how well it works.

As for your CPU boosting. I would bet it's already doing that. Some pieces of software that will help you work out what your system is doing.

Cpuz, Gpuz, HWMonitor, MSI Afterburner. YouTube, Reddit and a  Google search will tell you more mate. I would also have a read of the manual for your motherboard.

DCS like a lot of games can take some tweaking to run properly. Involving changing settings in Windows, the game itself and "sometimes" the motherboards bios.

[BitMaster]

I am no fan of beating around the bush when it comes to Hardware capabilities.

There is a 5% chance that you will be able to get that PC to run DCS with smooth frame rates without spending considerable money.

Your RAM is too little, 8GB is more often than not not even enough to properly run Win10 or 11 in many scenarios, not even thinking about starting a serious simulation.

The CPU will hardly deliver what you ask for but may be up to the task if you play very easy missions, Single Player and are willing to accept some struggle with the game here and there.

Running all this off a HDD just makes it look even worse.

 

At least, you need double the RAM, better 32GB, a SSD ( ANY one will be fine ) and maybe a better CPU.   

I would save for a new PC and get some PC expertise till then, it will pay back if you understand more of this yourself. It's not that I like to tell people that their PC is meeh, it is easier to talk about what to change if the user himself already knows what his PC actually "is", out of his own knowledge. It saves us from being the bad guys and gives a better overall start.

Convincing people to accept our view ( administrators and PC Builders view ) is not easy but again, one can argue about taste and colours but not about measurable capabilities. 

[Art-J]

@Flyboy-Pumpz Just for comparison, when I bought my first SSD 5 years ago, even a cheap one, specifically for DCS, my mission loading times dropped from 9+ minutes down to 1:40'ish. I  also got rid of constant stuttering when clouds were loading or when I was zooming in. I suppose with todays DCS version situation would be similar.

[Bossco82]

Ok, Bitmaster has got to the point which I should have been more clear on.

I suspect it would be better and cheaper in the long run to simply setup a new PC for this. You will also need a bit more understanding of parts and how to fit them and change settings too. IF, and I mean IF you are really going to get into DCS this is the only way to go. That is why I have been suggesting for you to try it first and see if you like DCS in the first place. Have you got into and enjoyed any other flight sims? If you have which ones?

Do you have things like a hotas joystick and rudder pedals?

I would not encourage anyone to invest their own money into building a PC with a spec to run DCS even at 1920x1080 resolution. Without them having tried it to see if they like it first.

Your system might just have enough in it to run a free flight on low settings for you to get a feel for playing DCS. After that if you like it, it is a helpful forum. Come back and we can advise on the best way for you to go.

[Flyboy-Pumpz]

16 hours ago, Bossco82 said:

Ok, Bitmaster has got to the point which I should have been more clear on.

I suspect it would be better and cheaper in the long run to simply setup a new PC for this. You will also need a bit more understanding of parts and how to fit them and change settings too. IF, and I mean IF you are really going to get into DCS this is the only way to go. That is why I have been suggesting for you to try it first and see if you like DCS in the first place. Have you got into and enjoyed any other flight sims? If you have which ones?

Do you have things like a hotas joystick and rudder pedals?

I would not encourage anyone to invest their own money into building a PC with a spec to run DCS even at 1920x1080 resolution. Without them having tried it to see if they like it first.

Your system might just have enough in it to run a free flight on low settings for you to get a feel for playing DCS. After that if you like it, it is a helpful forum. Come back and we can advise on the best way for you to go.

Ok thank you for all of the information! I have IL2 Sturmovik and I love flying in that flight sim. I have the Logitech G rudders, and a Hotas T.Flight 4

[Flyboy-Pumpz]

18 hours ago, BitMaster said:

I am no fan of beating around the bush when it comes to Hardware capabilities.

There is a 5% chance that you will be able to get that PC to run DCS with smooth frame rates without spending considerable money.

Your RAM is too little, 8GB is more often than not not even enough to properly run Win10 or 11 in many scenarios, not even thinking about starting a serious simulation.

The CPU will hardly deliver what you ask for but may be up to the task if you play very easy missions, Single Player and are willing to accept some struggle with the game here and there.

Running all this off a HDD just makes it look even worse.

 

At least, you need double the RAM, better 32GB, a SSD ( ANY one will be fine ) and maybe a better CPU.   

I would save for a new PC and get some PC expertise till then, it will pay back if you understand more of this yourself. It's not that I like to tell people that their PC is meeh, it is easier to talk about what to change if the user himself already knows what his PC actually "is", out of his own knowledge. It saves us from being the bad guys and gives a better overall start.

Convincing people to accept our view ( administrators and PC Builders view ) is not easy but again, one can argue about taste and colours but not about measurable capabilities. 

Ok thank you so much! I think I will stick with IL2 Sturmovik (my current flight sim) at the moment, then I will save up to buy a new PC! Could you also maybe send me your PC specifications so I can research off of that and see what will be the best fit for me? Thank you for all of the help!

[Bossco82]

OK hang on there a sec, You play IL-2 Sturmovik? Which one? 

Flyboy if you can run I-L2 Sturmovik and its the latest "Stalingrad" version what settings do you use. Sturmovik "Stalingrad" is not as demanding as DCS but it is still fairly resource heavy.

My PC spec would be irrelevant because I use a 4k monitor so it needs to be much more powerful. You are going to use a 1080p monitor it makes a big difference.

I would still encourage you to try the DCS game for yourself first. However if I had your system and wanted to play DCS at 1080p spending the least money possible I would do this.....

I know you will need a SSD so I would buy a Crucial MX500 SSD on a SATA connection, you can also get Samsung, Sandisk etc etc. I would buy 1tb and put DCS on this. You could also put Sturmovik on it too. Your choice..... I dont know if you want one drive with Windows and your games on or just a drive for DCS on its own. My DCS folder is nearly 300gb and I "THINK" the DCS vanilla install is about 80gb. 

I would look in the bios of the motherboard and look to see if the boost function of my CPU was enabled. Refer to your manual or online guides. Then I would download HW Monitor to check the CPU speed and temps. At the same time I would download and use CPUZ to run a quick benchmark. This would force the CPU to work at its highest speed so I could check the speed and temp in HW monitor. 

Then "IF" I was using the stock Intel cpu cooler. I would buy a small/medium aftermarket air cooler with a single 120mm fan so that the CPU can run at its higher speeds for longer. For example during a gaming session.

I would go and buy 2x8gb "16GB total" of DDR4 probably 3200Mhz C16, fit that and see if it improved things.

Then I would install MSI Afterburner, I would go into the part called Riva tuner and click all the boxes I wanted shown in the overlay display. CPU, Dram and GPU usage. I would then load DCS in a mission, fly fairly low and use this information to see how high I can push the graphics settings without anything being maxed out to 100%. Look on Youtube for videos by "POINT BLANK" on DCS optimisation. Basically you will be doing the same thing.

The weak spot the is your GPU. I dont know what to advise because of the markets prices and shortages. again "IF" it was me I would look on eBay for something like a GTX 1070/1080, but I am not afraid of buying used to build a gaming PC. If it was new, maybe a RTX 3060 or 3060ti. The GPU you buy depends on the power supply you have mate. 

Flyboy I am telling you what I would do if your system was mine and I was spending my own money on it to play DCS. I am not a wealthy guy by any means and I often buy something on eBay used so I can buy something nicer elsewhere. If I was you that is what I would do because all of this is available in good used condition. That way if you dont like it you can sell it and it has not cost you much to try. 

Take it easy mate...

[BitMaster]

2 hours ago, Flyboy-Pumpz said:

Ok thank you so much! I think I will stick with IL2 Sturmovik (my current flight sim) at the moment, then I will save up to buy a new PC! Could you also maybe send me your PC specifications so I can research off of that and see what will be the best fit for me? Thank you for all of the help!

I am happy you took it easy. I know it wasn't what you wanted to hear.

 

By the time you have saved enough money all HW things may have changed to such an extend that any recommendation I/we do now is likely obsolete.

The general rule of thumb, as the HW topology looks right now, you cant go wrong with either AMD or Intel as long as you dont pick the smallest one they have. Any Ryzen 5000 ( 5600, 5800, 5900, 5950 ) will be OK, so are the 12thgen Intel 12600k/12700k/12900k. There are plenty boards and most of them are really OK, it's not the tough part to find the right board.

It will be A LOT harder to find a performance wise sufficient GPU for acceptable money. No one can tell you what the market looks like in 6 months, 9months or a year down the road.

 

The rest is easy.   

SSD ( any will do but some are better in quality and speed but for DCS that wont matter that much )

Case, check for good good airflow

PSU, dont cut corners here, If you cant afford a Seasonic Prime PX or TX you can safely pick a Seasonic Focus and still be assured it's a top notch product for a fair price. WEattage wise you will end up somewhere between 750W-1kW, depending on the GPU hunger for watts.

 

Once you got the money together, check back in and we can guide you through.

 

PS:  Now download that installer and give it a try, you can loose time, that's all you risc.  See if you like it and how far your system will take it. Nothing will break.

[Thinder]

On 11/18/2021 at 5:44 PM, BitMaster said:

It will be A LOT harder to find a performance wise sufficient GPU for acceptable money. No one can tell you what the market looks like in 6 months, 9months or a year down the road.

I couldn't agree more.

Especially since it seems that AMD shot themselves in the foot when all AMD players were waiting for them to release the equivalent of an 3080Ti at lower price... Dream on, and that was was before Covid and all the mehem it caused to the industry.

I was a strong advocate of an all AMD or all NVIDIA solution and I run a 5600X but I don't think I will upgrade my 1080Ti to an AMD GPU, I still don't have the budget so I'll have to wait (which might be a good thing after all), a GPU of choice would be something like the MSI GeForce RTX 3080 Ti SUPRIM X 12G, when I was looking at building a mid-range system, there is no way around the need for a very strong GPU for playing DCS at higher settings.

But... NO stock. And the price!!!!

Edited November 20, 2021 by Thinder

[CrashMeTwice]

On 11/18/2021 at 12:05 PM, Bossco82 said:

OK hang on there a sec, You play IL-2 Sturmovik? Which one? 

Flyboy if you can run I-L2 Sturmovik and its the latest "Stalingrad" version what settings do you use. Sturmovik "Stalingrad" is not as demanding as DCS but it is still fairly resource heavy....

Totally agree! Could not have it said better. I am running a 2080 Super and struggle in most maps on 1440p. Trying to get my hands on a Nvidia 3090 or AMD 6900 XT without any luck.

[Bossco82]

For 1440p a 6800xt or a 2080ti/3080 is just about perfect. I had a MSI 6800xt Gaming X Trio and it was pretty much perfect for 1440p@60fps, before that I had a 2080ti. I got a 3090 FE for my 40th, although I love it. Its total overkill for 1440p. I really mean that, a 3080ti would be required for 4k on high settings but a 3090 is total overkill.         

[Hector45]

3 hours ago, Bossco82 said:

For 1440p a 6800xt or a 2080ti/3080 is just about perfect. I had a MSI 6800xt Gaming X Trio and it was pretty much perfect for 1440p@60fps, before that I had a 2080ti. I got a 3090 FE for my 40th, although I love it. Its total overkill for 1440p. I really mean that, a 3080ti would be required for 4k on high settings but a 3090 is total overkill.         

Beautiful beautiful overkill, congrats on the 3090

[Bossco82]

Thanks Hector, I'm not gonna lie I love having the 3090 Fe in my case. Especially now I have done the thermal pad mod. The GDDR6X gets hot! Over 86-90 Deg C! It's now in the low 70's.

To put the overkill into perspective. DCS maxed out minus SSAA at 1440p 60fps. Flying low level over Syria with a sunset near Ramut David. GPU clock is about 1150mhz and it's using .737mv on the core. Vram is at about 15000mb usage. I'll test with 4k if I can borrow my neighbours TV, he's a fellow tech head.

It was picked up for proper Mrsp too.

[Burt]

Hey Bossco82 I just gotta ask but did you mean GPU clock @ 1950 mhz ? I was just wondering  if it’s a misspell or a down clock for some reason it being so low. 
 

Edited February 10, 2022 by Burt

[Bossco82]

Hi Burt,

No worries. Yeah when I try to measure an undervolt I try to find out what a game needs first. So I run with optimal power and a 60fps limit and sort of see where the GPU numbers settle.

The 3090 needed about 1150mhz in a free flight in the fa-18. It was using idle voltage but was pulling 135w. This does go up if you fly low in a built up area.

I setup an undervolt of 1600mhz using 0.775mv. For 1440p 60fps maxed out minus SSAA. So far that my DCS undervolt! Hence massive overkill for 1440p 60fps.

I imagine you would find its limits if you started upping the resolution. I'll test that later on in the week