Rudder trim on extra key

[Fanki 17]

Since the hind has the possiblity to set the rudder trim on a extra key which makes flying since then a lot easier, atleast for me, why shouldnt the hip

have that option.

[Schlomo1933]

The Mi-8 don’t have a rudder microswitch in real life. Also the rudder don’t trim

Edited September 24, 2023 by Schlomo1933

[MAXsenna]

3 hours ago, Schlomo1933 said:

The Mi-8 don’t have a rudder microswitch in real life. Also the rudder don’t trim

 

True! It actually doesn't have rudder at all.

@AlphaOneSix Is this true? The torque pedals don't have micro switches?

Cheers!

[MAXsenna]

3 hours ago, Schlomo1933 said:

The Mi-8 don’t have a rudder microswitch in real life. Also the rudder don’t trim

 

From the manual.

Directional Control System

The directional control system is operated by the pilot or copilot pedal assemblies. From the pedals to the directional servo, the control linkage consists of a system of push/pull rods and bellcranks. Cables are used to pass control inputs to the tail rotor gearbox. The pitch change mechanism for the gearbox consists of a chain, sprocket, and worm gear, which extends or retracts the pitch control rod. Rod movement is transmitted via the pitch change links to the blade grips, resulting in a change of blade angle. Pushing the left pedal forward causes the pitch control rod to retract. The blade pitch angle decreases and the helicopter turns to the left. Pushing the right pedal forward extends the pitch control rod, increasing the blade pitch angle, and the helicopter turns to the right. Right pedal movement is limited by СПУУ-52-1 (SPUU-52-1) moveable stop (pitch limiter) system which uses air density and temperature to adjust the maximum tail rotor pitch angle and prevent overloading of the tail rotor and drive system.

The pilot's pedals are mounted on a bracket on the cockpit floor in front of the seat. Pedal adjusters are provided to adjust the pedal distance for individual comfort. Microswitches are mounted in each sub-pedal assembly to allow the pilot to introduce directional control inputs while the autopilot yaw channel is engaged.

Force Trim System

Force centering devices are incorporated in the cyclic and directional control systems. These devices are installed in the control linkages routed along the left forward bulkhead in the cargo cabin. The devices furnish a force gradient or "feel" to the cyclic sticks and pedals. The farther the control element is deflected, the more force is applied. A TRIM DISENGAGE button is located on the pilot and copilot cyclic stick grips. Pressing and holding the TRIM DISENGAGE button will immediately reduce the forces on stick and pedals to zero. Releasing the button reengages the trim.

Automatic Flight Control System (AFCS)

The helicopter is equipped with the AP-34B autopilot system. The autopilot stabilizes the helicopter in pitch, heading, roll, altitude, and airspeed. The autopilot interfaces with the helicopter navigation equipment to hold a selected course. The AFCS includes the four-channel autopilot system and an airspeed correction unit.

AP-34B Autopilot System

The autopilot system is designed to stabilize control of the helicopter while taxiing, during takeoff, while hovering, in flight, and during landing. Under normal operating conditions, the yaw, pitch, and roll channels are engaged before beginning to taxi and remain engaged throughout the flight and landing. The altitude channel is engaged as needed to maintain the selected barometric altitude. The autopilot system includes an integrated control panel for the yaw, roll, pitch, and barometric altitude channels; a trim indicator unit; an amplifier/control unit; pitch and roll compensation transducers; and yaw, pitch, and roll rate gyros. The control panel and trim indicator unit are located on the center console. The hydraulic flight control servos apply autopilot corrections to the flight control surfaces and provide feedback signals to the autopilot channels. Autopilot roll, pitch, and altitude correction signals are limited to a maximum of 20% of control travel for flight safety in the event of false signals or system failure. The pilot may intervene at any time while the autopilot is engaged to make manual corrections by operating the flight controls. The autopilot channels are engaged by pressing the green ON buttons at the top of the control panel on the Center Console. The roll and pitch channels are designed to work together continuously, while the yaw and altitude channels can operate independently. The yaw and altitude channels can be disengaged individually using the red OFF buttons on the control panel. Each channel has a trim indicator which shows the relative displacement of the flight control servo spindle. The control panel has centering knobs for the yaw, pitch, and roll channels which allow the pilot to introduce small corrections (±10°) by turning the knob for the channel requiring correction.

[AlphaOneSix]

9 hours ago, MAXsenna said:

True! It actually doesn't have rudder at all.

@AlphaOneSix Is this true? The torque pedals don't have micro switches?

Cheers!

Looks like you already found your answer.

 

But yes, the pedals have microswitches and yes, the rudder trims.

[Schlomo1933]

Thank you for teaching me better . I was wrong. I thought the microswitches was just a special thing in the hind. 
 

than we need them asap

[MAXsenna]

Thank you for teaching me better . I was wrong. I thought the microswitches was just a special thing in the hind. 
 
than we need them asap

No problem! I learned this even before the Hind was announced, and have been waiting for a keybind for the switches. I was so sure we would get them after the Hind, so please ED, give us!

Cheers!

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk

[admiki]

22 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

No problem! I learned this even before the Hind was announced, and have been waiting for a keybind for the switches. I was so sure we would get them after the Hind, so please ED, give us!

Cheers!

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk
 

Reason we don't have them and don't quite need them is flight engineer doing his stuff and twisting knobs as needed.

[MAXsenna]

Reason we don't have them and don't quite need them is flight engineer doing his stuff and twisting knobs as needed.

Yeah, if you enable it in the special settings, while the heading hold won't always come back on for me, even when I keep the pedals steady.

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk

[AlphaOneSix]

My personal preference is to just leave the heading channel off unless I am specifically wanting to hold my heading. Same with altitude channel.  Those two channels do not provide a SAS function like the pitch and roll channels do. This mirrors how we fly in real life, since our pilots never take their feet off the pedals. So even with the heading channel engaged, it is always interrupted and not active.

[MAXsenna]

My personal preference is to just leave the heading channel off unless I am specifically wanting to hold my heading. Same with altitude channel.  Those two channels do not provide a SAS function like the pitch and roll channels do. This mirrors how we fly in real life, since our pilots never take their feet off the pedals. So even with the heading channel engaged, it is always interrupted and not active.

Yeah, I know. But I'm lazy, and I bugs me when doing minor corrections to keep pressing it.

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk

[AeriaGloria]

IMO the real reason that microswitches aren’t as needed in Mi-8 vs 24

1. in 24, microswitches make yaw channel go into a sort of dampening mode, so it still smooths you out 

2. In 24, lifting vertical stabilizer changes center point of pedals with speed much more drastically than with 8. So the “release microswitch by return pedals to center” works better for the 8 then the 24, as center point doesn’t change nearly as much 

In addition to answer the original question, 

On 6/17/2022 at 1:18 PM, Fanki 17 said:

Since the hind has the possiblity to set the rudder trim on a extra key which makes flying since then a lot easier, atleast for me, why shouldnt the hip

have that option.

You can bind “z” and “x” on the keyboard to your HOTAS, these buttons move the pedals left/right when pressed but when released they leave the pedals in that spot, basically trimming them in that position 

So if you need more right pedal trim, tap the “x” button or whatever is bound to it until it is trimmed where you like 

[Havner]

I second this request. Another thing where it would be nice to raise the Hip up to the level of Hind (including all the options for rudder trimming and microswitch behaviour as well).

 

On 9/30/2023 at 7:49 PM, AeriaGloria said:

So the “release microswitch by return pedals to center” works better for the 8 then the 24, as center point doesn’t change nearly as much

Yeah, unless you use non centering pedals.

Edited March 21, 2024 by Havner

[AeriaGloria]

42 minutes ago, Havner said:

I second this request. Another thing where it would be nice to raise the Hip up to the level of Hind (including all the options for rudder trimming and microswitch behaviour as well).

 

Yeah, unless you use non centering pedals.

 

What I meant isn’t spring center, but the needed pedal deflection for straight flight, the “center” needed for coordinated flight at one power setting 

I use springless pedals. I always found Mi-8 Microswitch implementation easier then Mi-24 with “disable by return to nuetral” not only because you don’t have a tail that changes power to pedal relationship with airspeed, but a few other reasons 

the nuetral zone for Microswitch disable is 5% in Mi-8, 9% in Mi-24. In Mi-24, this zone is fixed at the center. For Mi-8, this zone is centered based on where pedals are at when yaw channel is turned on or pedals trimmed. Which I personally think means springless pedals work better for the 8 then 24 with disable by return to nuetral, especially if you turn AP off then back on to adjust it for cruise. But that’s just me