>>> TRACK IR at the rescue <<<

[Francous]

I wanted to make a post about a subject of the flight sims and the TrackIR product.

 

I was flying this evening on Flaming-Cliff server ( 169th ) and after some fun missions with the Su-25T .. Well the funny thing is that i was going to just do some training aerobatics with the Su-25 ( AFM ) when i just tagged along with some other 25's, i asked if the virtual pilots around me had this cool product that i enjoy since the early time of the TrackIR-2 and many other do as well.

All the pilots were flying with out it.... i was quite surprised ! many of the guys really couldn't afford to get it and they all wished to have one.

Flying with a TrackIR is definitely a much better flight experience and i couldn't fly with out it now .

So since many pilots had the TrackIR3 ( with or with out vector ) and went to the newer version 4, why not give the opportunity for our friends to have the same fun with your older version 3 of the TrackIR.

What do you think if you could sale for cheap or just make the future Trackir owner pay for shipping, Trade, Donate, Exchange anything would be great for many members virtual pilots.

 

Please add to this post your ideas, opinions and ... which model you can give/sell(cheap ) here.

It's almost 2009 and Xmas is not too far back..

For addresses and deals keep it on pm's .. Thank you greatly

 

S~

Moderator please move this post where you think it should go .. maybe a sticky for a week ? ;)

Edited December 31, 2008 by Francous

[Guest Bearcat99]

I think thats a great idea. I gave my TIR 2 to a squaddie last year when I got my TIR-4.

[Teapot]

Human nature is profound; I am deeply moved ... silly as it sounds.

 

Reps for the both of you ...

 

Cheers!

[Grodin]

Or people could spend 15 dollars and use freetrack wich works just as well... :)

 

 

And it has 6DOF.

[Teapot]

Yup, I'll be setting up freetrack over the hols.

 

Love your sig mate! :)

 

Cheers!

[4c Hajduk Veljko]

I gave my TIR 2 to my squad mate.

[Scif]

i would like to get track ir, but the cost is abit too much i think at the moment... how easy is it to make a freetrack compatible device?

[McVittees]

I've got a track IR 2 unit in one of my cupboard. Will it work with BS/Vista? Aside from the 6DOF stuff, is it as good as the later models?

[Francous]

Yes Track IR 2 will work :) Thx

[Grodin]

i would like to get track ir, but the cost is abit too much i think at the moment... how easy is it to make a freetrack compatible device?

 

 

There are complete tutorials on the freetrack site, but basically all you need is a webcam, 3 leds connected to any power source to light them up, and a cap to attatch them into so they move with your head.

 

To make it work better, you should use IR leds, remove IR filter from your camera and replace it with negative film that lets only IR light thru (From old floppy disk example)

 

For flawless results you could follow the given dimensions for them leds, u can find them from their site too.

 

If you do it well, it works just as well as trackir, and only costs 1/5 of it.

[*Rage*]

I have a TIR 2 (free obviously) if anyone wants it?

[Winder]

I wanted to make a post about a subject of the flight sims and the TrackIR product...

...Please add to this post your ideas, opinions and ... which model you can give/sell(cheap ) here.

It's almost 2009 and Xmas is not too far back..

For addresses and deals keep it on pm's .. Thank you greatly

 

S~

Moderator please move this post where you think it should go .. maybe a sticky for a week ? ;)

:clap_2:

 

Very nice gesture, and a great idea! Rep inbound!

 

Or people could spend 15 dollars and use freetrack wich works just as well... :)

 

 

And it has 6DOF.

:puke:

You guys are flipping incessant with this misinformation. Why are you so determined to steer people into a crappy counterfeit? Do you even own a TrackIR 4? There's no comparison in hardware specs (except with TrackIR 1, which is ancient, and wasn't even designed for gaming). $15 is going to get you a webcam with a horrible frame rate and 30+ ms latency. Both are the death sentence for accurate tracking.

 

This guy is trying to get a cool technology into the hands of people who'd like to try it, and the FreeLoaders just can't help but break into the conversation like a spoiled little kid. I feel like I want to have a dialogue with another adult, but my 4 year old niece just won't stop tugging on my sleeve so I'll look at the turd she just dropped in the living room.

 

I've got a track IR 2 unit in one of my cupboard. Will it work with BS/Vista? Aside from the 6DOF stuff, is it as good as the later models?

TrackIR 2 will work in mouse emulation mode (i.e. 2 DOF). It isn't as good as TIR 3 or 4 from a spec standpoint though. 2's resolution and sample rate is worse than both, and like the 3, the FOV is 33 degrees (compared for 4's 46 degrees). Still, with a higher combination of FPS and sensor resolution than just about any webcam or Wiimote, it's a start!

[redtail]

I upgraded from TIR2 to 4 last year.......so I gave my 2 to a co-worker. He wanted to pay me but I refused. I just wanted someone to get some use out of it, because once I used TIR4 with 6 deg,,,, I'll never fly with less! TIR4 rulz..........baby!!!

[Winder]

i would like to get track ir, but the cost is abit too much i think at the moment... how easy is it to make a freetrack compatible device?

I think that what the OP is suggesting is that you might be able to get a cheap/free TrackIR from a generous fellow BS player. :) You might ask him about the details via PM. :) Then, you wouldn't be stuck with a substandard hack that violates copyrights on TrackIR text strings. :beer:

 

For your sake, do your research on this. Look at the hardware specs. Look at the difference between sensor resolution and sub-pixel resolution. (Or, better yet, the combination of pixels/degree + field of view.) Look at sample rates and how important they are in addressing phase shift. Don't get suckered into investing "$15" (HA! More like $50-$75 by the time you're done) into something that won't like it should. Especially if you have access to something better for cheap/free from someone that doesn't need it any more.

 

If you do it well, it works just as well as trackir, and only costs 1/5 of it.

Untrue. (Very.)

 

Do you own a TrackIR 4? I own two, and I've also used two different FreeTrack setups. (Trying my third right now, with a Wiimote, though I'm having some Bluetooth stack issues that are holding the process up... got a new dongle on order that should help.) I'm still trying to optimize my FreeTrack setups, but as of now, there's little comparison. FreeLoad running with a top of the line Logitech QuickCam is far less crisp than a TrackIR's responsiveness. The FT software "accounts" for this by increasing smoothing, which their lead dev claims is necessary for steady headtracking. All you need for steady headtracking is a slight deadzone while your brain acclimates to controlling a TrackIR. In order to mask its latency and phase shift problems, FreeTrack forces you to "smooth" your tracking. You will never be able to have a responsive experience with that kind of "solution."

 

Basically, FreeTrack starts you out behind the curve, then blurs all of the brain's sensations that would normally indicate this, in order to fool you into thinking the experience is the same as a TrackIR.

 

I've used both. They are not the same.

 

Even a TrackIR 3 PRO will give you much higher FPS and sensor resolution than either a Wiimote or a good webcam. Or, if you want to talk about "sub-pixel resolution" (which Wiimote fanboys are obsessed with--thus the purported "1024x768" resolution), the gap in performance gets even larger. (TrackIR 4 can resolve up to 1/20th a pixel, compared to the Wiimote at 1/8th... this means that TrackIR 4 has sub-pixel capabilities of up to a whopping 7100x5760!)

[Teapot]

Woa! Wait a bit ...

 

This guy is trying to get a cool technology into the hands of people who'd like to try it,

 

Indeed he is ... I agree totally with you on this point.

 

...and the FreeLoaders just can't help but break into the conversation like a spoiled little kid. I feel like I want to have a dialogue with another adult' date=' but my 4 year old niece just won't stop tugging on my sleeve so I'll look at the turd she just dropped in the living room.[/quote']

 

Sir, your opinion is very uncool!

I believe some people are anxious to share something that works for them ... your metaphor is unkind and un-called for ... and considering you used your 4 y.o. niece to populate your metaphor, I think that your attitude lacks a certain ... maturity :(.

 

From my own position, I cannot afford TrackIR 4 ... but I would NEVER accept charity, however well meant. I would prefer to junk any flight-sim hobby first! Therefore I welcome suggestions that allow me to enhance my personal experience @ an expense rate comparison that I can afford.

 

For the other guys who suggested Freetrack, my thanks to you for making me aware that this option exists.

 

Lest it be misunderstood, I still think that those who are giving theirs away at a nominal price are very gracious human beings!

 

Cheers!

[Tango]

Why are you so determined to steer people into a crappy counterfeit?

??!!!

 

I use FreeTrack with very bright blue LEDs and a cheap £15 webcam. No mods required to the camera, and it rocks. I can't fly BS without it - I lose too much SA.

 

Why the hell would anyone want to spend £140 ($200) on TrackIR Pro to get the same thing??? Before you ask, yes, I can afford TrackIR, but why throw money away when I've got a perfectly good soldering iron???

 

"Poor mans TrackIR" it certainly isn't.

 

Best regards,

Tango.

Edited January 1, 2009 by Tango

[Grodin]

Humm, not going to argue about it since it works just fine for me, dont really want to spend over 100 bucks just to get a bit faster tracking. Maybe if it was something fast paced it might matter, but not in BS.

 

I just don't see how someone can make out 50-70 dollars from:

 

Webcam, VX-1000 does well, used ones around 5-10 dollars?

3 Leds, around 25 cents each?

1 Meter of wire... 50 cents?

1 Old diskette, lol?

 

and either:

Some batteries..

or

USB Wire + fuse + resistor...

 

+ A bit work putting it all together.

 

With this you get something that does its job, smooth 6DOF head tracking around 30fps with most webcams, give or take few FPS, but those are some really expensive frames you want if you go for TIR4.

 

Ok yes it needs some tweaking, i had to calibrate it for some hours to get it respond right since everyone has different kind of cap, takes a while to get it set up allright, but if its about money and one is handy with electronics, that should not be an issue?

 

 

Don't get me wrong, this thing about giving old TIRs for cheap is very generous.

 

Just letting ppl know this option incase they cant get that TIR they want, but some people seem to have something against DIY stuff, hello, some people actually enjoy building stuff.

 

It's like you are saying "People must buy simulator cockpit X or Y for thousands of dollars instead of making one of wood themselves.

 

 

And if those people who make TIR are so concerned about people using freetrack, how about try selling/making some of them instead of crying about them having some competition... i waited mine for about 40 days before i learned about freetrack and cancelled my order, stocks STILL show negative numbers, more sold than theres coming... so..

Edited January 1, 2009 by Grodin

[Quarrion]

Since 'Winder's post this thread will be locked in 3... 2....

[Shrubbo]

Nice idea Francous and hats off to yah :)

[Tango]

$15 is going to get you a webcam with a horrible frame rate and 30+ ms latency. Both are the death sentence for accurate tracking.

Have you actually ever managed to get FreeTrack running properly?? Hmm?? I can't help but think your real beef is that you were suckered into paying way over the odds and can't stand the idea that others are getting the same for 1/10th the price.

 

Or, better yet, the combination of pixels/degree + field of view.

Utter nonsense! I'm sat 4 feet back from my webcam. In order to fall outside the field of view, I'd have to move laterally about 2 feet either side of center. Tracking is also very precise. I can't actually move my head in small enough steps! I suggest that you don't really understand what you're on about.

 

Tango.

[Ewt]

And if those people who make TIR are so concerned about people using freetrack, how about try selling/making some of them instead of crying about them having some competition... i waited mine for about 40 days before i learned about freetrack and cancelled my order, stocks STILL show negative numbers, more sold than theres coming... so..

I bought a Track IR from www.naturalpoint.com/trackir/ in the US a few days ago on Christmas, it was delivered in the Netherlands yesterday :)
Edited January 1, 2009 by Ewt

[JDski]

The Naturalpoint server seems to be down. I can't access thier web site or do updates.

[ZG77_Lignite]

I just recieved my new TIR 4 a few days ago, and while I thought my old TIR 2 was the best thing since sliced bread (actually a LOT nicer than sliced bread even), this new unit is utterly amazing.

 

Well, when I found out BlackShark wasn't going to use my old TIR2, I was upset, and started researching alternatives. I bummed a webcam off of my cousin, got some leds and spent 2 USB cables and all day getting it to work. What a sense of accomplishment I felt when it would finally go! After flying around in FS2004 for awhile though, I wasn't as happy as I thought I would be with the performance, so I spent all day the next day tweaking and adjusting, what a sense of accomplishment! Well, then I accidentally ran my old fs2004 batch that starts up all my TIR2 gear, so I just tried it and low and behold; it was smoother and much more natural for me.

 

So I started researching. Better webcam, better LED's. Better connections. Better placement. I like to research and compare things like that. While researching, I found out about some great offers for TIR4. In my opinion, TIR4 is still unbeatable performance and cost effectiveness wise. I love it.

[aledmb]

freetrack ftw!

 

recording at 30 fps and outputting at 60 fps, mine works just fine.

i know 120 would be a lot better, but i would invest that money to

buy some rudders, instead... no way!

[NaturalPoint - Seth]

I bought a Track IR from www.naturalpoint.com/trackir/ in the US a few days ago on Christmas, it was delivered in the Netherlands yesterday :)

I'm glad you were able to receive your TrackIR quickly! We've had some terrible weather here on the West Coast of the US, so shipping has been slow at times. I hope you enjoy your new unit! :)

 

The Naturalpoint server seems to be down. I can't access thier web site or do updates.

The server went down last night, as we lost power in a huge wind storm. I'm in the office right now, and it appears that everything has been restored, so you should be able to access trackir.com without any problem.

 

I just recieved my new TIR 4 a few days ago, and while I thought my old TIR 2 was the best thing since sliced bread (actually a LOT nicer than sliced bread even), this new unit is utterly amazing.

 

Well, when I found out BlackShark wasn't going to use my old TIR2, I was upset, and started researching alternatives. I bummed a webcam off of my cousin, got some leds and spent 2 USB cables and all day getting it to work. What a sense of accomplishment I felt when it would finally go! After flying around in FS2004 for awhile though, I wasn't as happy as I thought I would be with the performance, so I spent all day the next day tweaking and adjusting, what a sense of accomplishment! Well, then I accidentally ran my old fs2004 batch that starts up all my TIR2 gear, so I just tried it and low and behold; it was smoother and much more natural for me.

 

So I started researching. Better webcam, better LED's. Better connections. Better placement. I like to research and compare things like that. While researching, I found out about some great offers for TIR4. In my opinion, TIR4 is still unbeatable performance and cost effectiveness wise. I love it.

Funny story! I hope you really love your new TrackIR 4. Since we recently lowered the MSRP by $50 (down to $129.95), we hope that even more people can access a new TrackIR. Plus, as you alluded to, there are some deals floating around the Internet that can make it even more affordable. ;)