Airport procedures

[simo-dj]

Since I'm a "veteran" of flight sims i am very new with airport procedures.

This lack of knowledge is remarkable with MSFS2020 (specially in big civ airports) but i think that, maybe,  IMO, it would be helpful knowing where to taxi, what lines to follow, where to stop, where to go, what taxiway to take and so on even in DCS...

Or do you think it's useless in a mil-sim?

 

[razo+r]

You can always look up some charts and try to learn the procedures. It's totally up to you.

Problem is though, do not expect the AI and especially not other players to obey the same procedures. So while you can perfectly fly and do the procedures, you might have to do some improvising due to lack of proper ATC, lack of procedure-following AI and especially lack of willingness to adhere to procedures by most other players.

[simo-dj]

10 minuti fa, razo+r ha scritto:

You can always look up some charts and try to learn the procedures. It's totally up to you.

Problem is though, do not expect the AI and especially not other players to obey the same procedures. So while you can perfectly fly and do the procedures, you might have to do some improvising due to lack of proper ATC, lack of procedure-following AI and especially lack of willingness to adhere to procedures by most other players.

Thanks @razo+r

you're right and i have plenty of charts found on internet when MSFS2020 came out. I don't play MP so I am not worried about other players' behaviour on taxiway and runway.

What i'd like is to achieve a basic knowledge of what to do before/after a mission. Where to enter a runaway, what taxiway to follow etc. I could enter a runaway through rough terrain instead of following a taxiway and still be able to take off.

I repeat, it's just a matter of knowing what to do, for my personal knowledge.

[razo+r]

In that case treat every airfield in DCS as an uncontrolled airfield, meaning taxi at own discretion, look at wind to know which runway to use etc.

We have to wait for ED to update their ATC to be able to get taxi instructions and everything else.

[Gary]

This might be of some small help or contain bits of what you are looking for? (from 13 min mark onwards)

Regards,

Gary

Edited December 13, 2022 by Gary

[fagulha]

I use charts/checklists in a real kneeboard (VR user), and do the procedures by the book as possible within DCS. There´s no proper ATC as mentioned above, so, since i´m no longer in a virtual squadron (and we used always procedures for Take Off/Landing) i talk to myself as if i was talking to a real ATC to keep profiency. 

And in DCS many of the airports and airbases have airport signals. Personally i taxi always using charts and following the airport signals as they should be followed. Same thing when deployed on aircraft carrier.

 

[simo-dj]

Thanks @razo+r @Gary and @fagulha

18 ore fa, razo+r ha scritto:

In that case treat every airfield in DCS as an uncontrolled airfield, meaning taxi at own discretion, look at wind to know which runway to use etc.

We have to wait for ED to update their ATC to be able to get taxi instructions and everything else.

TBH i always do that way and real-life-like atc isn't at top of my priorities, but  It's quite like i'm missing something in not knowing these procedures.

...abiding that rules it's another matter...

[WinOrLose]

20 hours ago, razo+r said:

In that case treat every airfield in DCS as an uncontrolled airfield, meaning taxi at own discretion, look at wind to know which runway to use etc.

We have to wait for ED to update their ATC to be able to get taxi instructions and everything else.

I mostly fly on human controlled atc airfields but I am pretty sure that the ATC AI comms gives the runway in use when you request taxi to runway.

[simo-dj]

4 minuti fa, WinOrLose ha scritto:

I mostly fly on human controlled atc airfields but I am pretty sure that the ATC AI comms gives the runway in use when you request taxi to runway.

Yes. of course. But what i was asking for is a tutorial for airport procedures. So, when i been given a runaway to take off, how i can go to that runaway? Through what taxiway? What lines i have to follow (the yellow ones i know...) where i have to stop and give precendece to incoming/taking off planes (more or less what used to happen in Falcon4 AF). In case of more runways/taxyways where i have to go?

I know it's quite useless at this point in dcs. But this wish was only for knowledge purpoese.

Thanks @WinOrLose

 

[=DROOPY=]

What's the busiest civil airport to your location?   https://www.liveatc.net/

Look up the 4 letter ICAO Identifier and enter it into the search box...  If you are near an airport that sees a regular flow of traffic, you *should* be able to pull it up. In my case, KOKC.. I can listen to all the Freq's in use:

Tower

Ground 

Clearance delivery

Approach/Departure 

Each airport has a diagram chart that pilots use to navigate the movement areas. You can find those pretty easily with a Google search using the 4 letter Identifier.

If it's the taxiway/runway signage, and ground markings you are wanting to learn, let me know and I'll post a 'cheat sheet' of that as well. 

[simo-dj]

38 minuti fa, =DROOPY= ha scritto:

What's the busiest civil airport to your location?   https://www.liveatc.net/

Look up the 4 letter ICAO Identifier and enter it into the search box...  If you are near an airport that sees a regular flow of traffic, you *should* be able to pull it up. In my case, KOKC.. I can listen to all the Freq's in use:

Tower

Ground 

Clearance delivery

Approach/Departure 

Each airport has a diagram chart that pilots use to navigate the movement areas. You can find those pretty easily with a Google search using the 4 letter Identifier.

If it's the taxiway/runway signage, and ground markings you are wanting to learn, let me know and I'll post a 'cheat sheet' of that as well. 

 

North of my town there's LIDE. It's a single runway for small planes like Cessna. There's also a parachute school, but it's not real busy...

I'll try to look over internet if i found something..

Thanks @=DROOPY=

[=DROOPY=]

Try using 'LIRF' on LiveATC.net... 

Usually the 'flow' is:

Clearance Delivery Frequency: Pilot requests/receives flight plan clearance. Once ready to taxi, switches to Ground frequency. 

Ground: Pilot requests/receives permission to taxi to runway (via specific taxiways instructed by Tower controller)

Runway: Upon reaching end of runway, pilot switches to the Tower frequency and reports to Tower controller, who then provides further instructions, i.e 'hold short' , 'position and hold', or 'cleared for takeoff', based on traffic volume. 

Once in the air and reaching a standard altitude, tower will then usually instruct pilot to switch to 'Departure'. 

Edit: Forgot to add, whenever a ATC/TRACON gives you instructions, you almost always have to repeat back what they instructed. It's a safety thing, to eliminate any confusion as to what you, as the pilot are supposed to do. 

 

Edited December 14, 2022 by =DROOPY=

[WinOrLose]

On 12/14/2022 at 1:47 PM, simo-dj said:

Yes. of course. But what i was asking for is a tutorial for airport procedures. So, when i been given a runaway to take off, how i can go to that runaway? Through what taxiway? What lines i have to follow (the yellow ones i know...) where i have to stop and give precendece to incoming/taking off planes (more or less what used to happen in Falcon4 AF). In case of more runways/taxyways where i have to go?

I know it's quite useless at this point in dcs. But this wish was only for knowledge purpoese.

Thanks @WinOrLose

 

There a quite a lot of youtube videos explaing everything from start up, taxi, take off, approach plates etc etc. They are pretty much all civil but military pretty much has to follow the same rules so still relevent. 

[Zeagle]

While I am sure that there must be a good youtube video out there somewhere, I would steer clear of YT for aviation knowledge. 

A good source for this info is the AIM (formerly the airman's information manual, before the woke crowd took over)Aeronautical Information Manual - AIM (faa.gov)

[simo-dj]

thanks a lot @Zeagleand @WinOrLose

 

[Moxica]

I clearly rememeber I got a "Mission is aborted! You did not use proper ATC procedures" in some A10 campaign. (Allthough I did)

Edited December 19, 2022 by Moxica