reported Su-25T. cheating with external fuel tanks and airbase resources, and some bugs with TF-51D

[Riddick]

Hello.

        When I reload my Su-25T with external fuel tanks, the amount of fuel at the airbase does not decrease. This fact allows cheating (Su-25T becomes a fuel factory, and maybe any other aircraft with external fuel tanks too):
1. Put external fuel tanks on an empty plane.
2. Order to drain all fuel from aircraft (drained fuel willl added to base resources).
3. Order to reload aircraft with external fuel tanks.
4. Order to drain all fuel from aircraft (drained fuel willl added to base resources AGAIN), and so on.

        And following errors with TF-51D:

1. I can't open the cockpit by using the keyboard: pressing Shift + C, or Ctrl + C only opens cockpit.

2. Flap position lever does not correctly display the position of the flaps. After the running engine has built up sufficient pressure in the hydraulic system, pressing the keys Shift + F or F, immediately moves the lever to the extreme lower or extreme upper position, while the position of the flap on the wings of aircraft on the outside view, changes by only 10 degrees.

If the flaps are up, the first two mouse clicks, have no effect on the position of the flaps. And only the third click causes the flaps sligtly down. A similar effect is observed with fully extended flaps.

3. The blower mode switch is always in the auto position. I can't switch it with mouse clicks to High or Low position. I can only open, close or slightly open the protective cover of this switch.

 

A good game, but I found too many bugs in the first days of testing it.

 

[Flappie]

Hello Riddick, it's very nice of you to report bugs after your first days.

2 hours ago, Riddick said:

        When I reload my Su-25T with external fuel tanks, the amount of fuel at the airbase does not decrease. This fact allows cheating (Su-25T becomes a fuel factory, and maybe any other aircraft with external fuel tanks too):
1. Put external fuel tanks on an empty plane.
2. Order to drain all fuel from aircraft (drained fuel willl added to base resources).
3. Order to reload aircraft with external fuel tanks.
4. Order to drain all fuel from aircraft (drained fuel willl added to base resources AGAIN), and so on.

Nice bug to start with! It seems the standard Su-25 is also able to refill an airbase at no cost.

Issue reported.

2 hours ago, Riddick said:

        And following errors with TF-51D:

1. I can't open the cockpit by using the keyboard: pressing Shift + C, or Ctrl + C only opens cockpit.

2. Flap position lever does not correctly display the position of the flaps. After the running engine has built up sufficient pressure in the hydraulic system, pressing the keys Shift + F or F, immediately moves the lever to the extreme lower or extreme upper position, while the position of the flap on the wings of aircraft on the outside view, changes by only 10 degrees.

If the flaps are up, the first two mouse clicks, have no effect on the position of the flaps. And only the third click causes the flaps sligtly down. A similar effect is observed with fully extended flaps.

3. The blower mode switch is always in the auto position. I can't switch it with mouse clicks to High or Low position. I can only open, close or slightly open the protective cover of this switch.

A good game, but I found too many bugs in the first days of testing it.

Next time you report bugs, please, please, create one thread per bug. It's way easier for us to follow.

• Issue 1 was reported earlier and the report was bumped some days ago.
• Issue 2 has just been fixed internally. The fix should be in the next OB update.
• Issue 3 is now reported.

Thanks!

[Riddick]

It appears that the refueling scam issue is related to all aircraft with external fuel tanks.

Yesterday I twice sent a flight of four MiG-29S for refueling and reloading from the Krymsk airfield to Nalchik. 
Both times they flew along the same route, but when they flew with hanging tanks, they took only 5 tons of jet fuel from Nalchik. 
And when they flew without external tanks, they took almost 9 tons of fuel from Nalchik.

[razo+r]

On 3/1/2023 at 7:39 PM, Riddick said:

3. The blower mode switch is always in the auto position. I can't switch it with mouse clicks to High or Low position. I can only open, close or slightly open the protective cover of this switch.

 

 

On 3/1/2023 at 11:23 PM, Flappie said:

 

• Issue 3 is now reported.

 

The blower mode switch does work. You need to click on the letters to switch the switch. If you want to switch to low mode, you need to press on "low", if you want it in high blower mode, press "High". If you want it in auto press "Auto".

In short, if you want to flip the switch in a different position, you need to press on the letters for the mode. The switch itself is only the click spot for the cover.

null

[Riddick]

razo+r Thank you, I can finally fly above 14,000 feet with a supercharger lower stage.

You are right, but this is not an obvious control. It would be better if the switch operation was similar to that of the position lights switches. 
When a right mouse click raises the switch lever and a left click lowers the switch lever.
Left mouse click lowers the protective cover, right mouse click raises it.

[Art-J]

@Riddick The Mustang issues you noticed are about two years old (at least) and used to affect the payware variant as well. They were eventually fixed in that one, but TF variant, being a free product, seems to be lower on bugfixing priority list and still awaits some of those fixes.

And before you ask, in a similar fashion, the TF probably still suffers from yet another issue of carb air intake being constantly  stuck in filtered, heated position (despite levers in cockpit suggesting otherwise), which robs you off a few inches of MAP at mid-to-high altitudes. Fixed in the P-, probably not yet in TF-, I'll have to double check though before nagging Flappie about that one ;).

[Riddick]

2 hours ago, Art-J said:

@Riddick The Mustang issues you noticed are about two years old (at least) and used to affect the payware variant as well. They were eventually fixed in that one, but TF variant, being a free product, seems to be lower on bugfixing priority list and still awaits some of those fixes.

And before you ask, in a similar fashion, the TF probably still suffers from yet another issue of carb air intake being constantly  stuck in filtered, heated position (despite levers in cockpit suggesting otherwise), which robs you off a few inches of MAP at mid-to-high altitudes. Fixed in the P-, probably not yet in TF-, I'll have to double check though before nagging Flappie about that one ;).

I think that such a complex project as DCS is written in an object-oriented programming language. 
If the code is written correctly, then bugs in similar functions of similar aircraft, such as the TF-51D and P-51D, should be fixed at the same time. 
Unless of course they are inherited from the same base class.

It's a little disappointing that when you run such a complex simulator, you expect to learn something, 
but in the end you have to point out the errors yourself, and almost immediately after launch.
This circumstance greatly discourages the desire to purchase paid add-ons.

Every day I find new errors while almost not flying, I don’t even know if it’s worth writing about them or not.

Edited March 8, 2023 by Riddick

[Art-J]

4 hours ago, Riddick said:

Every day I find new errors while almost not flying, I don’t even know if it’s worth writing about them or not.

Worth writing - only if you do it properly (see guidlines here: https://forum.dcs.world/topic/124096-how-to-report-a-bug-faq-guide/#comment-4498141 ), otherwise chances of having your report noticed are slim.

I'd also recommend looking at a broader picture - bugs demotivate only if you look for them and dwell on them too much instead of flying. Keep that mindset and you're setting yourself up for failure. It's true that there's a mountain of unresolved bugs, glitches and errors in DCS (and each patch adds numerous new ones in place of some older fixed ones). However, there's also a whole mountain range of things that just work and in some cases are vastly superior to competition products.

The only way to enjoy DCS is not to think too much about what coulda-shoulda work better, but about what's fully operational right here right now and how to get the most entertainment time out of it.

Also keep in mind the modules in DCS are not "treated" equally. It's pure capitalism - non-profitable, "dirty peasant" modules are low on bug-fixing list (for example TF Mustang and Su-25T as you noticed), or sometimes abandoned unfinished even if they're payware (Yak-52, Combined Arms). On the other side are "celebrity-superstar" modules which get new features, updates and fixes more often than the rest (ie. Hornet, Viper, Apache, Hind, Tomcat). That's just how things are over here. Then there's a myriad on third-party modules, which are also a bit of a hit and miss quality.

Please remember that if you play standalone version of DCS and not the one from Steam, you can install and try most (if not all?) of aircraft and map modules for free for two weeks - that should allow you to form a better consumer's opinion if a module you test is worth purchasing. Not to mention frequent sales and promos - I, for example, purchased all my DCS products using one form of discount or another, ranging from 20 to 70%, so I'm not bothered all that much when bugs appear, since I didn't pay full price anyway and I got my money's worth already.