solved DCS crash due to memory

[NightstalkerNOR]

Hello.

With the newest OB-update, I am no longer able to access Syria multiplayer maps due to crashing, presumably because of lack of memory. All other maps are fine, and utilizing about 50% of memory, while Syria uses around 98 until crash.

Pagefile is adjusted to 32GB (32768), and I've done a repair and removed mods folder.

The images named RAM Cauc/PG/Syria are made in the mission editor with clear skies, and a single A10A flying from A to B.

Image "High RAM" is an attempt to fly on the "Syria Rotorheads" MP server. Same results in Grayflag. In previous OB-versions I have been no where near these values.

I've set preload radius to around 80000, but I have not had any issues running it with 150000 in previous versions.

null

dcs.log DxDiag.txt

Edited May 7, 2023 by NightstalkerNOR

[NightstalkerNOR]

I continue to have these crashes but it is consistent with any map, not just the Syria map. I have reduced the preload radius from 150.000(which ran fine previously) down to 80.000, and now 50.000. No effect, and still up to 99% memory usage. Results in slow texture/scenery loading and frequent crashes.

I've run a repair, removed mods folder, deleted the fxo-, metashader folders.

Please see the attached crash logs.

dcs.log-20230506-185633.zip dcs.log-20230506-185655.zip

[NightstalkerNOR]

Reverted back to 2.8.4.38947, but the same issue persist. Caucasus map. It did not crash before I quit the session, but memoryusage was up to 99% most of the time. Few drops down to 95%. Unable to revert further.

[Flappie]

Hi. What happens if you rename your "Saved Games/DCS..." folder? Does DCS keep crashing?

[NightstalkerNOR]

6 hours ago, Flappie said:

Hi. What happens if you rename your "Saved Games/DCS..." folder? Does DCS keep crashing?

Yes, it does. I have removed the whole folder with no concrete results. I have also run a repair each time. I have however removed the pagefile settings that are recommended, to be automatically configured by the system. I had no memory issues in a Liberation round with plenty of AI and scripting. It was running around 60-70% during the whole session while before it ran with 99% until crash. I'll do some more testing to confirm.

Edited May 7, 2023 by NightstalkerNOR

[NightstalkerNOR]

18 hours ago, Flappie said:

Hi. What happens if you rename your "Saved Games/DCS..." folder? Does DCS keep crashing?

Issue is still present. I renamed the saved games folder again and entered the rotorheads server - Syria map. 98% memory usage. So the pagefile-thing is not relevant any more as I've use with and without custom settings.

Edited May 8, 2023 by NightstalkerNOR

[NightstalkerNOR]

I reverted to version 2.8.4.38947, and tried the AH64 SCUD hunting mission in the Syria map. Still default settings with the pagefile, and renamed the saved games folder. Instantly up to 95% memory usage.

I am struggling to troubleshoot this issue. It seems somewhat consistent, but not entirely...

The results so far:

The Syria map is consistently unplayable due to memory unstability. I have not been able to play the Syria map with update 2.8.4.38947 and later. Don't know about previous version due to those being unavailable.

I have seen inconsistent results with Caucasus map. Playing the Retribution campaign with a significant amount of AI-assets and scripts have shown extensive pressure on the memory with around 98% usage, but also "normal" values.

Do shadows have an effect on memory?

dcs.log

Edited May 8, 2023 by NightstalkerNOR

[NightstalkerNOR]

Done some testing with the AH64 and F-16 missions, comparing Syria, Caucasus and Persian gulf respectively. I tried version 2.8.4.38947 first, and then 2.8.4.39731. I used task manager to see the values of memory usage. Pagefile is still default system controlled, saved games folder deleted before starting a new session.

Definitions:

"Main menu briefing": The first briefing after you press "start"/"load"/"whatever to load the mission". Next comes the "in game briefing" which is when you are in the game session and see the aircraft and the briefing.

2.8.4.38947

AH-64
Caucasus - Reservoir flight - 65% while in main menu briefing - 67% while in game.
PG - Mountain coin - 65% while in main menu briefing - 72% while in game.
Syria - Scud Buster - Passing 78% before entering the main menu briefing. 80% while in the main menu briefing. 93% by entering the briefing menu inside the game

F-16
Syria - Nightly silence - 85% While in main menu briefing. 93% while in the game
Persian Gulf - Dawn raiders - 57% in menu briefing. 65 while ingame.
Caucasus - Overwhelming force - 58% while in menu briefing. 66% while in game.

 

2.8.4.39731

AH64
Caucasus - Reservoir FLight - 61% when in main menu briefing. 68% when in game.
PG - Mountain Coin - 57 while in main menu briefing - 73% when in the session
Syria - Scud Busters - 77% while in main menu briefing - 97% when in the session briefing.

F-16
Syria - Nightly silence - 75% when in main menu briefing - 90 while in the game
PG - Dawn Raiders - 56 while in main menu briefing - 67 while ingame
Caucasus - Overwhelming force - 55% while in main menu briefing - 63% while ingame

 

Please see the attached DCS logs for each versions session

 

Updated.log outdated.log

[Flappie]

2 hours ago, NightstalkerNOR said:

Do shadows have an effect on memory?

Yes, they do (see here for more details).

Your logs indicate that Windows does not give that much pagefile:

2023-05-08 09:52:43.712 INFO    APP (Main): CPU cores: 8, threads: 16, System RAM: 32682 MB, Pagefile: 8465 MB

Flying over Syria in MP is the most demanding thing to do in DCS. It usually takes around 50 GB of memory, whch means you either need more pagefile or lower graphic settings. I know you've tried a 32GB pagefile before. I'm thinkin maybe one of your RAM stick is faulty. Try checking your RAM with MemTest86.

[NightstalkerNOR]

26 minutes ago, Flappie said:

Yes, they do (see here for more details).

Your logs indicate that Windows does not give that much pagefile:

2023-05-08 09:52:43.712 INFO    APP (Main): CPU cores: 8, threads: 16, System RAM: 32682 MB, Pagefile: 8465 MB

Flying over Syria in MP is the most demanding thing to do in DCS. It usually takes around 50 GB of memory, whch means you either need more pagefile or lower graphic settings. I know you've tried a 32GB pagefile before. I'm thinkin maybe one of your RAM stick is faulty. Try checking your RAM with MemTest86.

Thanks for checking in!

 

When restaring DCS after removing the saved games folder it defaults to low settings with the same result. The difference with high/low settings are minimal. I don't believe this is the cause.

I will check the RAM stick for faults and report back.

[NightstalkerNOR]

7 hours ago, Flappie said:

I'm thinkin maybe one of your RAM stick is faulty. Try checking your RAM with MemTest86.

I ran the MemTest86 for 6 hours, 4 tests no errors.

[Flappie]

Wow. Let's consider your RAM is perfectly fine, then.

Here are a few things that you can try to prevent crashes:

1. Empty your "C:\Users\your_login\AppData\Local\Temp\DCS.openbeta" folder.
2. Empty your NVIDA shader cache folder: "C:\Users\your_login\AppData\Local\NVIDIA\DXCache".

[NightstalkerNOR]

36 minutes ago, Flappie said:

Wow. Let's consider your RAM is perfectly fine, then.

Here are a few things that you can try to prevent crashes:

1. Empty your "C:\Users\your_login\AppData\Local\Temp\DCS.openbeta" folder.
2. Empty your NVIDA shader cache folder: "C:\Users\your_login\AppData\Local\NVIDIA\DXCache".

Done, and done. No joy. Tried again the Scud buster mission with the AH64, and immediately mid 90% memory usage. Rotoheads server top 90%.

Edited May 8, 2023 by NightstalkerNOR

[Flappie]

I'm out of ideas.

Please open a support ticket: log into DCS website, click Support, then Create a new ticket.

[NightstalkerNOR]

11 minutes ago, Flappie said:

I'm out of ideas.

Please open a support ticket: log into DCS website, click Support, then Create a new ticket.

Roger. Thanks again for all the ideas 

[michaell089]

Try running your game with the fullscreen option in settings unchecked. This fixed it for me. Do set your desktop resolution the same as your game resolution so you end up with a borderless fullscreen game window. Went from 50-70gb ram usage back to 25-30gb in heavy multiplayer servers (syria).

Hope it helps.

[NightstalkerNOR]

10 hours ago, michaell089 said:

Try running your game with the fullscreen option in settings unchecked. This fixed it for me. Do set your desktop resolution the same as your game resolution so you end up with a borderless fullscreen game window. Went from 50-70gb ram usage back to 25-30gb in heavy multiplayer servers (syria).

Hope it helps.

Thank you for your input. I saw your thread and was curious to try it out. No joy, however. I enabled the VR preset, and set the resolution to the same as my desktop, including unticking the fullscreen game window. Mid 90% in an unpopulated Rotorheads server. Thanks though.

[NightstalkerNOR]

I've opened a ticket with DCS support. See if that leads somewhere.

In the meantime: I set the low graphics preset and tried the Scud Buster mission with the AH64. During the first 3-4 minutes massive stutters were present with the memory utilization showing 99%. I was unable to do anything during this period. I believe I was just an inch close to a crash, due to DCS also creating a crash.log. Please see the attached. 

However; After this, the memory utilization dropped down to about 85%, which I consider more "normal". With the current settings I still consider this unacceptable to play with due to the graphics limitations and unstability, but for sake of diagnosing; Is it common for the memory to drop so much after the initial loading?

dcs.20230509-113652.crash dcs.log

[michaell089]

Thats the same that happens to me when unchecking full screen. It loads up the RAM to 99% at the start with some stuttering and then goes back down to 85% ish. Becoming smooth and playable. Have you also tried that on normal servers with the same settings as I shared in my post? Or will it still crash afterwards?

[NightstalkerNOR]

1 hour ago, michaell089 said:

Thats the same that happens to me when unchecking full screen. It loads up the RAM to 99% at the start with some stuttering and then goes back down to 85% ish. Becoming smooth and playable. Have you also tried that on normal servers with the same settings as I shared in my post? Or will it still crash afterwards?

Hmmm. I've sort of considered the values at the startup to be conclusive in regards to being so unstable it's unplayable, although it has previously not crashed before later in the game. I will try with "Normal" settings and see if the issue persist. I would presume that if the memory utilization drops down after a while, there's no real issue. Will check and report back.

[NightstalkerNOR]

2 hours ago, michaell089 said:

Thats the same that happens to me when unchecking full screen. It loads up the RAM to 99% at the start with some stuttering and then goes back down to 85% ish. Becoming smooth and playable. Have you also tried that on normal servers with the same settings as I shared in my post? Or will it still crash afterwards?

 

18 hours ago, Flappie said:

I'm out of ideas.

Please open a support ticket: log into DCS website, click Support, then Create a new ticket.

An interesting update, maybe, I think...?

I jumped in the Rotorheads server and started a session in the Mi24. I set most settings to high, and preload radius to 100.000. Memory utilization spiked immediately to around 98-99% as previously stated and stayed there for 3-4 minutes, fearing a crash was soon imminent. CPU usage was relatively low during this period, and GPU was high - as expected with the increased settings. After 3-4 minutes, it sounded like the computer "settled", in a way (fans calmed down). CPU usage went up and memory usage went down to mid 70's. 

I am unable to test this further until the weekend, but if it is normal behaviour that memory usage should lie around 99% in the startup "phase" of 3-4 minutes and then settle, I presume we are closer to a positive conclusion (I am not using the "s"-word yet)

Additionally: 

1: I see two programs running when entering the task manager. Is this correct?

2: When checking the task manager and memory usage shows around 98% it says underneath that it stores(?) around 17.000mb of data. Is this correct? To me - an amateur, at best - it looks as if it uses half my physical RAM, and considers it to use almost 100%?

dcs.log

[Flappie]

That's what I see in the Task Manager:

 

I observer the same behaviour with memory: when entering a server, memory peaks  to almost 100%, than after a minute or so, 90%, then 85% (I have 32 GB of RAM like you do). One thing to note: the Task manager graph shows you the RAM usage, not the global memory usage (RAM + pagefile). Seeing yoru RAM almost full does not mean your PC will crash. It means your pagefile is about to be used to help.

A PC needs 64 GB of RAM to run DCS without using Windows pagefile. If you have less than 64 GB of RAM, you need a large pagefile.

DCS stores a lot of things in RAM. I assume the most part is textures. Some aircraft textures need some optimization as it was demonstrated by use Taz earlier this year. The Hind is one of them. Some terrains eat up a lot of RAM too, especially Syria. MP also eats more RAM than SP.

Edited May 9, 2023 by Flappie

[NightstalkerNOR]

1 hour ago, Flappie said:

That's what I see in the Task Manager:

 

I observer the same behaviour with memory: when entering a server, memory peaks  to almost 100%, than after a minute or so, 90%, then 85% (I have 32 GB of RAM like you do). One thing to note: the Task manager graph shows you the RAM usage, not the global memory usage (RAM + pagefile). Seeing yoru RAM almost full does not mean your PC will crash. It means your pagefile is about to be used to help.

A PC needs 64 GB of RAM to run DCS without using Windows pagefile. If you have less than 64 GB of RAM, you need a large pagefile.

DCS stores a lot of things in RAM. I assume the most part is textures. Some aircraft textures need some optimization as it was demonstrated by use Taz earlier this year. The Hind is one of them. Some terrains eat up a lot of RAM too, especially Syria. MP also eats more RAM than SP.

 

Thanks for clarifying RAM usage in DCS. Do you have an idea on why it shows using only just above half of my physical RAM?

Also, the two dcs programs running in task manager... I see multiple people have reported the same thing, yet you only have one running? 

 

[Flappie]

2 hours ago, NightstalkerNOR said:

Thanks for clarifying RAM usage in DCS. Do you have an idea on why it shows using only just above half of my physical RAM?

I don't know. I'm pretty sure i behaves the same way on my PC (sorry, I'm too tired to try right now).

2 hours ago, NightstalkerNOR said:

Also, the two dcs programs running in task manager... I see multiple people have reported the same thing, yet you only have one running?

Yes, I've seen other users reported this. Maybe it's caused by VR? (I use a monitor)

[NightstalkerNOR]

I did a full run on the Greyflag server, relatively unpopulated, no crash but full memory utilization for a couple of minutes until it settled to around 75%.

I believe my fault was to assume that a crash was imminent when the 99% memory utilitzation appeared, instead of continuing to see if it actually crashed. The memory utilization "calms down" after a couple of minutes down to normal levels, e.g. around 70%. I am unable to say for a fact, but I believe that the pagefile is the most likely solution.

Thanks Flappie for following up!