Correct usage of autopilot and FD

[mrtube]

I have been following with interest the various threads relating to trimming and autopilot while i try and figure out how to fly and trim this beast correctly. However, despite all my reading up, I am still not sure what is the best way or combination to use the auopilot and flight director.

 

do you:

 

Use just the 3 auto pilot buttons switched on on their own? If so, what effect/function does this have (apart from the obvious heading pitch and altitude hold). Do they work indepentanly of the FD button?

 

Use just the FD button, with none of the other 3 turned on? If so, what effect does this have?

 

Or can you use some combination of the above, and again, if so, what are the effects and relative merits of these?

 

What is the consensus on trimming? should it be done after every manouvre or avoided unless necessary? What will happen if you dont trim?

And what is the effect of trimming with the autopilot or flight director on?

 

Is it better to try and learn to fly first with or without the autopilot? (and or flight director? )

 

Sorry for all the questions, but i am having trouble figuring this out by trial and error, I just seem to get into situations that i cannot understand the reasons for, which makes it difficult to learn from. To learn from a mistake, you need to understand exactly what your mistake is!!

 

Thanks, Mark

Edited February 10, 2009 by mrtube
spelling correction

[Pavlos]

Have you read this already?

 

It is recommended that you trim each time your flight parameters change.

[Mirtma]

Mrtube, just the questions that bothers me. I've been looking and reading over forum and manual but no clear answer. I hope we'll get some here.

[JaBoG32_Prinzartus]

I use FD + 4 dampers during transition flight.

 

When I do areal recon (Hovering) I stabiliize with FD on into a near-hover, and then switch off FD and switch on the hover mode.

 

When advancing slowly, (i.e. for Close Air Support) I keep FD off, but Hover Mode on.

 

However I am not sure wether this is common practice?!

[Chillspider]

I thought the correct way to use Flight director is for when your flying in route mode just like when you fly in auto pilot on a plane. I could be wrong im not sure so i am asking but i thought thats what it was for.

[Maverick-GER-]

Ok now specifically to your questions mrtube:

do you use just the 3 auto pilot buttons switched on on their own? If so, what effect/function does this have

 

That would be normal flight

That's how real pilot are ordered to fly their ka-50s =) And that's in my opinion also the way you should fly it mostly in DCS (But I know there are a lot out there not sharing my opinion) It sure is harder to fly this way than with the FD on but once you know how to trim right and once you kinda do it automatically you will have no problems with this flight mode!

 

Use just the FD button, with none of the other 3 turned on? If so, what effect does this have?

No autopilots on but FD on = no effect except that your hud changes lol!

 

Or can you use some combination of the above, and again, if so, what are the effects and relative merits of these?

 

The combination of both would be the FD mode ... well first what does the autopilots do... if you have the 3 "main" autopilots on (heading hold, bank and pitch hold) the autopilot will try its best to keep your helicopter in the last trimmed position! That means if you move your stick without pressing the trimmer you have to move it over 20% to kinda override the autopilot and therefore you are fighting it!

How it should be done is you hold down the trimmer button, move you helicopter for a new heading, pitch or bank and once you are done you release the trimmer button, then you got no fight with autopilot!

 

Ok now what does the FD mode do? With the autopilot channels and FD mode engaged, the autopilot will not try to get your helicopter in trimmed position but it will only dampen or let's say stabilize your helicopter... which means with all autopilots and FD off your helicopter will twist a bit here shake a bit there and so on and all that twisting and shaking and stuff like that will be dampened (so much that you actually dont feel it anymore at least in the sim)

And i can tell you i use that flight director for close up fighting where i will have to change directions a lot.

 

By the way the same as FD can also be achieved by just holding your trimmer button down.

 

What is the consensus on trimming? should it be done after every manouvre or avoided unless necessary? What will happen if you dont trim?

And what is the effect of trimming with the autopilot or flight director on?

Trimming should be done for every change in flight! You can definately not trim too often! If you dont trim you have to fight the autopilot and you ont want to do that since flying, fighting the autopilot and maybe shooting at stuff is a bit too much =) So it is as easy as this if you trim you fly with the autopilot if you dont you fly against it and flying against it is something you shoudln't want!!!

 

Well since you should have your autopilots on all the time you only trim with them on =)

But with FD on trimming is kinda not neccesary in my opinion!

 

Is it better to try and learn to fly first with or without the autopilot? (and or flight director? )

No you do not need to fly without the Autopilots i mean it's like punching yourself? Why would you wanna fight the helicopter by not using autopilot channels??? You should fly it not fight it!

 

So learn it the right way with a lot of trimming and autopilots and FD you can use also !

Sorry for all the questions, but i am having trouble figuring this out by trial and error, I just seem to get into situations that i cannot understand the reasons for, which makes it difficult to learn from. To learn from a mistake, you need to understand exactly what your mistake is!!

What are you sorry for that's what forums are there for right?

Better to ask beforehand then learning it all wrong and being screwed with that later =)

[Maverick-GER-]

I thought the correct way to use Flight director is for when your flying in route mode just like when you fly in auto pilot on a plane. I could be wrong im not sure so i am asking but i thought thats what it was for.

FD and Routemode are 2 different things...

routemode = Like the autopilot in Fixed wing aircraft but no need for FD with it.

[ericinexile]

Ok now specifically to your questions mrtube:

...That's how real pilot are ordered to fly their ka-50s =) And that's in my opinion also the way you should fly it mostly in DCS (But I know there are a lot out there not sharing my opinion) It sure is harder to fly this way than with the FD on but once you know how to trim right and once you kinda do it automatically you will have no problems with this flight mode!...

 

There is an amazing amount of irony in this statement (although it is true)! Using the FD means NOT using autopilot. So, by definition FD SHOULD be harder. the fact that use of the autopilot is harder speaks volumes. Something is not right.

 

Smokin' Hole

[Maverick-GER-]

Well it is harder UNTIL you learned to trim right!

Using FD means NOT using Autopilot

Well that's a bit misleading.. since you still use the Autopilot for dampening... so let's say with FD on your using only a part of the Autopilot! Edited February 10, 2009 by Maverick-GER-

[ericinexile]

Well it is harder UNTIL you learned to trim right!

Well that's a bit misleading.. since you still use the Autopilot for dampening... so let's say with FD on your using only a part of the Autopilot!

 

OK

[JDski]

 

Is it better to try and learn to fly first with or without the autopilot? (and or flight director? )

 

I would say the best way to fly at first is with FD on, and pitch, bank, and heading hold channels on.

This will make it fly like what you might expect a helicoper to fly, or closest to it. You still should trim, but it's not needed as often with FD on.

 

If you want to switch FD off to get the feel of flying without it and feel the full effects of the hold channels, first make sure your in a steady flight, then hit the trim, then turn FD off.

Only with FD off can you really feel the effects of what the heading, pitch, bank, and alt hold channel do. With FD on they only act as dampers.

 

The Alt hold channel is for when you want to hold your altitude obviously.

Keep in mind there are two settings for this. Baro alt and radar alt.

Baro alt hold the same alt that your at when you set it, and is more or less measured from sea level.

Radar alt (set on as default) only works up to 300 meters and trys to keep you at the alt your at above the ground at which you set it. So it will make you climb and descend over the terrain up to a limit. But you still need to be on your toes around steep hills or mountains.

Just be sure to turn the alt hold off when you don't need it and plan on changing your altitude.

The only hold channel you will turn on and off should be the alt hold. The other ones should always be left on.

[Redeye26]

i rarely use FD mode unless i'm in deep trouble and all the alarms are sounding . I've got so used to flying with the AP assists on now, FD is a get out of trouble mode and i think this is realistic also .

 

It does sink in it just takes a bit of time to refine it and fully understand it .

[mrtube]

Cool, thanks for all the help, i will read assimilate and try it all out, thanks again, Mark

[Slayer]

with the altitude channel on I believe you have to set the altitude with the collective brake/altitude set. I do it out of habit now. I was told that in the real thing you have to squeeze the brake handle in to adjust the collective and that there is a microswitch in the handle that sets the altitute when you use it. Obviously 99% of us don't have a collective that works this way so thats why they made a button for it.