AIM-54 Phoenix Operation and Modes

[bonesvf103]

I'm confused about the Phoenix's active abilities.  I read up on it again in the Heatblur manual, but I'm not entirely sure if what they are saying at the beginning of the Phoenix section (https://www.heatblur.se/F-14Manual/weapons.html#id3) is what the Phoenix can do in real life, and the last part of the article what it can actually do in DCS (https://www.heatblur.se/F-14Manual/weapons.html#aim-54-in-dcs).

Refer https://www.heatblur.se/F-14Manual/weapons.html#id3:

Section TWS/SARH/ARH:  It says in the absence of the command to switch to ARH, the missile will still be guided by SARH.  What would cause the absence of the command?

Section PD STT:  I understand this to mean that if you get a PDSTT on a target and fire the Phoenix at it in with NORM mode in the backseat set, that it basically is a very big expensive AIM-7, is that right?  If so, if the lock is broken and it's an AIM-54A then it's trashed, but if the lock is broken and it's an AIM-54C, it will immediately go active in hopes of still catching the target.  Is that right?

Section Active-Radar Homing (ARH):   I understand this as saying that if you set the switch to PH ACT before launch, then when you fire on a target it will be mad dog off the rail so long as you are within 6 miles of the target's six or 10 miles of the target's nose.  This is only when using TWS or if you have a PDSTT lock.  So, when in TWS mode, do you have to hook a target for this to happen, or can you fire in the general area of the target and hope that it sees the target to go after it?  If you have him in PDSTT, and you fire within those range parameters, then break the lock, the missile should still guide because it is mad dog off the rail, right?  The PDSTT tells it where to  look with its ARH seeker so you shouldn't have to keep the target locked in PDSTT, right?  I suppose since if the missile can't find the target with its own ARH, it falls back to SARH, so it would probably be best to keep a PDSTT lock without breaking it for that reason.

Section ACM Active:  This is where I'm most confused.  Do you have to have the ACM cover up for ACM active launch?  It doesn't say so in this section but I thought you had to.  In the manual it says you have to select BRSIT only.  It says there are three conditions for ACM active mode launches:  1.  BORSIT mode selected, 2.  No WCS tracks and 3.  A non-pulse doppler radar mode OR a TCS track must be used.  So I understand that to mean the radar must be in pulse search or pulse STT.  Since pulse search and PSTT are not doppler, then basically the TID should not have anything other than datalink tracks in it for this to work, right?  Are PLM, VSL HI/LO, PAL,and MRL modes considered pulse doppler modes?

Section ECM Mode:  I understand that the Phoenix will automatically home on jam without the pilot or RIO having to do anything, and no special symbology would be displayed anywhere, correct?

Section Missile Operation:  "When used in boresight or ACM without a WCS track the HUD will not indicate any symbology apart from the ADL which is used to aim the missile."  So, if I had a lock and then I broke it, say by hitting PLM then releasing it, then the only symbology in the HUD is the ADL cross?  Again, there would be no contacts in the TID since contacts are only in the TID when in a pulse doppler mode or if it's a DL.

Section AIM-54 in DCS:  This section seems to override everything about Phoenix operation described in the previous sections.  It keeps what is said about TWS and SARH mode, but simplifies things down to regardless of what mode you are in, if you fire less than 10 miles away (never mind about the 6 miles astern and 10 miles on the nose) or if you are in any ACM mode, or if the RIO has the PH ACT switch on, it will fire mad dog off the rails.  Am I reading that right?

Thanks for your help.

v6,

boNes

[Karon]

The manual may be outdated. The first change occurred in October 2019 or 2020 IIRC: LTE, modes and guidance were adjusted. More recently, the AIM-54C has become a sort-of AIM-120, with different guidance, ability to go active on its own and so on.
That being said, I'm in a hurry and most other questions can be answered by spending 5 minutes with the mission editor and testing. Ergo, I did not go too much into the details, if you test it yourself they will "stuck" better and you will remember them better.

Section TWS/SARH/ARH: A only, anything that can impede the WCS. Exempli gratia, destruction or damage to the Tomcat: id est, WCS gone and or track completely lost. This prevents the WCS to send the activation signal at all.
In a less dramatic fashion, change radar mode and this causes the drop of the tracks.

Section PD STT: SARH all the way for the A, de facto an AIM-7; same for the C, with the self-activation caveat in case the track is lost.

Section Active-Radar Homing (ARH): I never used the PH ACT switch. I prefer PSTT if I want to fire and forget. IIRC, last time I tried, 2019 perhaps, it was making PDSTT identical to PSTT, but PSTT could guide the Phoenix back then.
The WCS automatically sets the activation whenever the range in SR < 10 nm TA hot; SR < 6 nm TA cold.

Section ACM Active: de facto PSTT. Monthy Python would describe it as *farting [the missile] in that general direction*. PSTT does not guide, just tells the missile to go in a certain direction then, at 10nm, it starts guiding onto the target. The latter is due to DCS limitations, with some hilarious results sometimes.
With manual loft, PSTT > TWS (in certain conditions).

Section ECM Mode: Advice: don't use EW in this game, it's just.. no. Disable it everywhere.
If you really, really, really want to use it, basically take advantage of the transition between JAT and PDSTT through burnthrough range to bang targets 60+ nm away. No, this should *not* be possible.
There is ad hoc symbology; check the manual or the post in this forum IM or Cobra wrote when the feature was introduced.
PS: fly from the backseat. It's much better than from the front whilst engaging targets.

Section Missile Operation: No clue, have you tried? I guess the symbology would be meaningful to your new radar mode.
Also, stop worrying about the TID. Focus on the DDD. That's your best friend.

Section AIM-54 in DCS: What are you referring to in particular? Assuming it is updated, that would be the behaviour of the missile in DCS, which has tons of corners cut compared to real life. For instance, the A cannot revert to SARH if its seeker cannot find its target.

[bonesvf103]

<sigh>.  This is why I find it so difficult to learn how to properly employ these weapons--manual outdated, changes along the way that you may not be privy too immediately, conflicting information as a result, and so on.  Ah well.

I did actually make a test mission with an F-14 carrying 6 AIM-54Cmk47.  This is the same mission I used to test what happens if you lock up a bandit with PDSTT, launch, and then break the lock (it did go active and kill him).  But I tried situations for each of the points above and the results were mediocre.  Sometimes it would work, sometimes it wouldn't, and nothing was consistent.  I think for the most part the missile tried to track; there were a few instances where it just flew blindly straight ahead.  It seemed like the LTE was 1 second if the ACM cover was up, if PH ACT was on and in BRSIT mode...I also discovered for the first time that when the ACM cover is up, it automatically goes to boresight mode.  That was interesting.

There were so many different ways to execute this and so many varied results that it was really hard to figure out a set procedure and whether or not the conditions are correct to implement it.  I wish there was a black and white way to set up the system and fire for each situation, but since things are all over the place, it doesn't seem like it.

v6,

boNes

[Karon]

Yeah, a lot has changed, and you are right, resources should be updated, although it is probably not worth the invested time at the moment, as we are still waiting for the renowned "new API", which surely will change a lot of things. Testing, imo, is always the best way to figure out what's going on. Grab TacView, however, or you won't understand what is going on.

Anyway, if you drop the lock when you are still far away, the logic of the game will cause all sorts of weird things. Don't do it, the missile may even do a loop and fly backwards towards you - and I'm not even joking.
The reason why you can't really expect "realistic" behaviours from this situation is that missile seekers are not really a thing: you can have a missile fly in front of the target when maddog, but it will ignore it if its original target is another one. I have a bunch of videos showing this. Therefore, use only PSTT or equivalent, it's the most reliable way to employ besides PD.

Example of PSTT employment:

Quote

I wish there was a black and white way to set up the system and fire for each situation, but since things are all over the place, it doesn't seem like it.

The procedure to use your AIM-54 should be straightforward and adhere to your Timeline. Use TWS or PDSTT as per SOP and sorting, and that's it. Just keep in mind the AN/ASN-92 limitations when manoeuvring and using TWS.
I have never used the ACM cover with the Phoenix, nor felt the need to do it.

[Naquaii]

On 9/20/2023 at 5:21 PM, bonesvf103 said:

I'm confused about the Phoenix's active abilities.  I read up on it again in the Heatblur manual, but I'm not entirely sure if what they are saying at the beginning of the Phoenix section (https://www.heatblur.se/F-14Manual/weapons.html#id3) is what the Phoenix can do in real life, and the last part of the article what it can actually do in DCS (https://www.heatblur.se/F-14Manual/weapons.html#aim-54-in-dcs).

Refer https://www.heatblur.se/F-14Manual/weapons.html#id3:

Section TWS/SARH/ARH:  It says in the absence of the command to switch to ARH, the missile will still be guided by SARH.  What would cause the absence of the command?

Section PD STT:  I understand this to mean that if you get a PDSTT on a target and fire the Phoenix at it in with NORM mode in the backseat set, that it basically is a very big expensive AIM-7, is that right?  If so, if the lock is broken and it's an AIM-54A then it's trashed, but if the lock is broken and it's an AIM-54C, it will immediately go active in hopes of still catching the target.  Is that right?

Section Active-Radar Homing (ARH):   I understand this as saying that if you set the switch to PH ACT before launch, then when you fire on a target it will be mad dog off the rail so long as you are within 6 miles of the target's six or 10 miles of the target's nose.  This is only when using TWS or if you have a PDSTT lock.  So, when in TWS mode, do you have to hook a target for this to happen, or can you fire in the general area of the target and hope that it sees the target to go after it?  If you have him in PDSTT, and you fire within those range parameters, then break the lock, the missile should still guide because it is mad dog off the rail, right?  The PDSTT tells it where to  look with its ARH seeker so you shouldn't have to keep the target locked in PDSTT, right?  I suppose since if the missile can't find the target with its own ARH, it falls back to SARH, so it would probably be best to keep a PDSTT lock without breaking it for that reason.

Section ACM Active:  This is where I'm most confused.  Do you have to have the ACM cover up for ACM active launch?  It doesn't say so in this section but I thought you had to.  In the manual it says you have to select BRSIT only.  It says there are three conditions for ACM active mode launches:  1.  BORSIT mode selected, 2.  No WCS tracks and 3.  A non-pulse doppler radar mode OR a TCS track must be used.  So I understand that to mean the radar must be in pulse search or pulse STT.  Since pulse search and PSTT are not doppler, then basically the TID should not have anything other than datalink tracks in it for this to work, right?  Are PLM, VSL HI/LO, PAL,and MRL modes considered pulse doppler modes?

Section ECM Mode:  I understand that the Phoenix will automatically home on jam without the pilot or RIO having to do anything, and no special symbology would be displayed anywhere, correct?

Section Missile Operation:  "When used in boresight or ACM without a WCS track the HUD will not indicate any symbology apart from the ADL which is used to aim the missile."  So, if I had a lock and then I broke it, say by hitting PLM then releasing it, then the only symbology in the HUD is the ADL cross?  Again, there would be no contacts in the TID since contacts are only in the TID when in a pulse doppler mode or if it's a DL.

Section AIM-54 in DCS:  This section seems to override everything about Phoenix operation described in the previous sections.  It keeps what is said about TWS and SARH mode, but simplifies things down to regardless of what mode you are in, if you fire less than 10 miles away (never mind about the 6 miles astern and 10 miles on the nose) or if you are in any ACM mode, or if the RIO has the PH ACT switch on, it will fire mad dog off the rails.  Am I reading that right?

Thanks for your help.

v6,

boNes

TWS/SARH/ARH: The manual does not say it will continue to be guided in SARH, it says that the AWG-9 will continue to transmit the guidance. There's no way to have a situation in which the active transfer command is missed and the missile continues as SARH to the target in TWS. All commands sent to the missile after it hits the active criteria also sends the active command so if the missile later reacquires it will then go active. SARH in TWS isn't exact enough that the missile can hit the target reliably. For DCS the tl:dr is that if you don't guide the AIM-54A it will miss in TWS.

PD-STT: You're correct apart from that the AIM-54 in SARH is not "just" a very expensive AIM-7 even if it stays in SARH.

ARH: IRL setting PH ACT will make the AWG-9 immediately send the active transfer command and IRL the missile will then still use the semi-active guidance until it finds its target. But if used it will also alert the target of an active missile and use up the missile battery more quickly. In DCS, due to limitations, it will just set the missile as basically a maddog shot. The exception is that if a sensor track is present (either radar or TCS) it'll launch a long the direction of the sensors line of sight. So kinda a directional maddog. Having an active missile which also uses SARH is not currently possible in DCS. Additionally, what the PH ACT switch is set to is separate from the range criteria, the range thing is always present in the Pulse-Doppler modes. This is due to the missile needing to be active immediately at short range and this will always happen even if you haven't set PH ACT.

ACM-Active: And ACM active launch can be achieved in multiple ways but in DCS it's basically analogous to other active launches. The only difference is that if you have the ACM cover up you can get a shorter launch-to-eject time of one second if shooting at a target within a certain angle of ADL (15 degrees). Other than the 1 sec LTE the ACM cover is simply a short cut to preset the missiles for ACM. The difference of the ACM mode and the BRSIT button is that ACM mode sets the missile to boresight if there's no sensor track, BRSIT sets it to boresight regardless. As for the PLM, VSL, PAL and MRL they're all pulse modes leading to a P-STT lock.

ECM-mode: The missile itself will switch to ECM home on jam if a target starts jamming while in flight and switch back to normal track if the jamming stops. This is a DCS missile function and works the same as other missiles in DCS. If you want to launch in home on jam from the start you need to lock up the jammer on the DDD using the AGC-trace.

Missile-Operation: Depending on exactly which symbology you mean yeah. Dropping an STT track will drop the radar back to the corresponding search mode, so from PLM it would drop back to Pulse Search or with Jester TWS. But given you're talking PLM you're likely to be so close as to that not really working.

AIM-54 in DCS: Your read is basically correct yeah. And yes, this section tries to detail what is actually modelled in DCS, the other sections describe a simplification of the IRL system.

Unfortunately some stuff was updated after the last manual revision and as I left as the manual author and editor before this it hasn't been updated to reflect this yet. The new manual editor is naturally focusing on the F-4 atm.

But the two big major changes since last update are basically the change in how the AIM-54C works due to new information being available and the addition of the ECM modes in the AWG-9. Other than that the information is correct as far as I know.

 

 

Edited September 24, 2023 by Naquaii

[Skarp]

On 9/24/2023 at 3:56 PM, Naquaii said:

TWS/SARH/ARH: The manual does not say it will continue to be guided in SARH, it says that the AWG-9 will continue to transmit the guidance. There's no way to have a situation in which the active transfer command is missed and the missile continues as SARH to the target in TWS. All commands sent to the missile after it hits the active criteria also sends the active command so if the missile later reacquires it will then go active. SARH in TWS isn't exact enough that the missile can hit the target reliably. For DCS the tl:dr is that if you don't guide the AIM-54A it will miss in TWS.

PD-STT: You're correct apart from that the AIM-54 in SARH is not "just" a very expensive AIM-7 even if it stays in SARH.

ARH: IRL setting PH ACT will make the AWG-9 immediately send the active transfer command and IRL the missile will then still use the semi-active guidance until it finds its target. But if used it will also alert the target of an active missile and use up the missile battery more quickly. In DCS, due to limitations, it will just set the missile as basically a maddog shot. The exception is that if a sensor track is present (either radar or TCS) it'll launch a long the direction of the sensors line of sight. So kinda a directional maddog. Having an active missile which also uses SARH is not currently possible in DCS. Additionally, what the PH ACT switch is set to is separate from the range criteria, the range thing is always present in the Pulse-Doppler modes. This is due to the missile needing to be active immediately at short range and this will always happen even if you haven't set PH ACT.

ACM-Active: And ACM active launch can be achieved in multiple ways but in DCS it's basically analogous to other active launches. The only difference is that if you have the ACM cover up you can get a shorter launch-to-eject time of one second if shooting at a target within a certain angle of ADL (15 degrees). Other than the 1 sec LTE the ACM cover is simply a short cut to preset the missiles for ACM. The difference of the ACM mode and the BRSIT button is that ACM mode sets the missile to boresight if there's no sensor track, BRSIT sets it to boresight regardless. As for the PLM, VSL, PAL and MRL they're all pulse modes leading to a P-STT lock.

ECM-mode: The missile itself will switch to ECM home on jam if a target starts jamming while in flight and switch back to normal track if the jamming stops. This is a DCS missile function and works the same as other missiles in DCS. If you want to launch in home on jam from the start you need to lock up the jammer on the DDD using the AGC-trace.

Missile-Operation: Depending on exactly which symbology you mean yeah. Dropping an STT track will drop the radar back to the corresponding search mode, so from PLM it would drop back to Pulse Search or with Jester TWS. But given you're talking PLM you're likely to be so close as to that not really working.

AIM-54 in DCS: Your read is basically correct yeah. And yes, this section tries to detail what is actually modelled in DCS, the other sections describe a simplification of the IRL system.

Unfortunately some stuff was updated after the last manual revision and as I left as the manual author and editor before this it hasn't been updated to reflect this yet. The new manual editor is naturally focusing on the F-4 atm.

But the two big major changes since last update are basically the change in how the AIM-54C works due to new information being available and the addition of the ECM modes in the AWG-9. Other than that the information is correct as far as I know.

What functionality is currently not modeled correctly/missing for the aim54C?

[Naquaii]

9 hours ago, Skarp said:

What functionality is currently not modeled correctly/missing for the aim54C?

The two most noticable points atm would be more control over how and if a missile goes active (allowing us to correctly do AIM-54C SARH) and better control over the guidance logic.

We believe we're close in regards to actual aerodynamic and motor performance but guidance is still somewhat lacking. Having more control over the guidance logic or getting help to tune it would, imho, be the way ahead for more realism. But I also know that's an ongoing discussion with ED.

Apart from that being able to launch the missile at a selected point in space instead of being locked to actual targets would also increase accuracy as to how the missile should behave but I'd say it's a lower prio and likely harder to achieve.

[Kageseigi]

17 hours ago, Naquaii said:

The two most noticable points atm would be more control over how and if a missile goes active (allowing us to correctly do AIM-54C SARH) and better control over the guidance logic.

We believe we're close in regards to actual aerodynamic and motor performance but guidance is still somewhat lacking. Having more control over the guidance logic or getting help to tune it would, imho, be the way ahead for more realism. But I also know that's an ongoing discussion with ED.

Apart from that being able to launch the missile at a selected point in space instead of being locked to actual targets would also increase accuracy as to how the missile should behave but I'd say it's a lower prio and likely harder to achieve.

I want to thank you guys for your continued pursuit of improvement!

If I may ask, would what you mentioned above also make the missile more resistant to notching? For example, could there be a case that when guiding an AIM-54C with the AWG-9 while cranking, if the target successfully notches the AWG-9, the Phoenix's radar would go active and take over from enough of a different angle where the target is not in the notch against it?

I'm afraid I haven't had much experience dealing with inbound Phoenixes yet. So, specifically for DCS, what is the target attempting to notch? The missile itself or the Tomcat that fired it? Does it depend on the mode that the missile was fired in? Or the phase of missile flight? If it's the missile itself, does its radar show on RWR apart from the F-14? Or do you just have to look for it or guess the angle that it's approaching from?

[Naquaii]

14 hours ago, Kageseigi said:

I want to thank you guys for your continued pursuit of improvement!

If I may ask, would what you mentioned above also make the missile more resistant to notching? For example, could there be a case that when guiding an AIM-54C with the AWG-9 while cranking, if the target successfully notches the AWG-9, the Phoenix's radar would go active and take over from enough of a different angle where the target is not in the notch against it?

I'm afraid I haven't had much experience dealing with inbound Phoenixes yet. So, specifically for DCS, what is the target attempting to notch? The missile itself or the Tomcat that fired it? Does it depend on the mode that the missile was fired in? Or the phase of missile flight? If it's the missile itself, does its radar show on RWR apart from the F-14? Or do you just have to look for it or guess the angle that it's approaching from?

If the missile has taken over and is active then it's the missile you're notching, in SARH it's both the missile and AWG-9 in a way. But I'm not 100% it's both the missile and radar in DCS. Not an expert on that part of it.

As for RWR if the missile is active you should see it there. The only limitation is that in DCS the active seekers are limited to 10NM both way, so the missile can't see the target until at that point and an RWR can't see the missile either until then.

[draconus]

On 10/2/2023 at 4:52 AM, Kageseigi said:

Or do you just have to look for it or guess the angle that it's approaching from?

If it's the Tomcat flying toward you (and you see his radar pings on your RWR) you can expect his TWS shot and defend before his missile goes active. Same with IR missiles when you get into WVR range - you expect them coming and defend accordingly.

In DCS you notch the aircraft in case of SARH missiles.

[Victory205]

On 9/24/2023 at 3:56 PM, Naquaii said:

 

ACM-Active: And ACM active launch can be achieved in multiple ways but in DCS it's basically analogous to other active launches. The only difference is that if you have the ACM cover up you can get a shorter launch-to-eject time of one second if shooting at a target within a certain angle of ADL (15 degrees). Other than the 1 sec LTE the ACM cover is simply a short cut to preset the missiles for ACM. The difference of the ACM mode and the BRSIT button is that ACM mode sets the missile to boresight if there's no sensor track, BRSIT sets it to boresight regardless. As for the PLM, VSL, PAL and MRL they're all pulse modes leading to a P-STT lock.

 

Hmmmm.

[draconus]

6 hours ago, Victory205 said:

Hmmmm.

When you know it's wrong but are not allowed to tell what.

[Naquaii]

14 hours ago, Victory205 said:

Hmmmm.

Please do note that I'm talking DCS here and the implementation within those limitations that exist there.

I know very well this doesn't match exactly to the real thing!