Increasing Ram from 32GB to 64 GB

[dburne]

Ok so have been running this i9 9900k rig since Jan 2019 and it has been great. With a 4090 GPU and now Open XR with MT DCS I am getting good performance in my Aero. I had planned a new build around first of the year, may postpone that another year will see. 

In the meantime I am replacing my ram finally. I have been running 32 GB (2 sticks) PC-3200 CL14 DDR4 ram. Higher priced G-Skill stuff. My replacement I have ordered is 64 GB ( 2 x 32GB sticks) Corsair Vengeance PC-3200 DDR4 ram. However this "cheaper" ram has CL16 rather than CL14. I elected to go with cheaper ram this time due to my possibly replacing this rig sometime after first of year - that part I am still unsure of.

So I wonder will the increase in size mean better performance in DCS or will the increase in latency make it a little worse. Going to be interesting finding out. Ram scheduled to arrive sometime this afternoon/evening from Amazon. Will try to get it in my rig tomorrow for some testing. As long as I can maintain my vsync lock of 45 fps I should have a smooth experience like I am getting now.

Edited October 1, 2023 by dburne

[kksnowbear]

FWIW, my opinion is that the 64G will do you more good than any perceived loss from difference in latency.

There are numerous threads about DCS using over 32G RAM, and if you land in that position even momentarily, the adverse effects from running low on RAM will hurt far worse than the (almost certainly imperceptible) difference between CL14 and 16 at the same clock could offset.

Don't expect frame rate increase, it isn't likely at all.

The persistent claims of stutter improvements are all subjective IMO.

Once again, the foregoing is entirely my opinion.  An informed, professionally trained opinion based on 40+ years' experience specific to this discipline - but an opinion nonetheless.

Best of luck.

Edited October 4, 2023 by kksnowbear

[dburne]

5 hours ago, kksnowbear said:

FWIW, my opinion is that the 64G will do you more good than any perceived loss from difference in latency.

There are numerous threads about DCS using over 32G RAM, and if you land in that position even momentarily, the adverse effects from running low on RAM will hurt far worse than the (almost certainly imperceptible) difference between CL14 and 16 at the same clock.

Don't expect frame rate increase, it isn't likely at all.

The persistent claims of stutter improvements are all subjective IMO.

Once again, the foregoing is entirely my opinion.  An informed, professionally trained opinion based on 40+ years' experience specific to this discipline - but an opinion nonetheless.

Best of luck.

 

Sounds great and what I was  hoping for - thanks!!

Yeah I am not expecting any fps changes at all from it, just want the extra memory for DCS more than anything. The ram arrived today , will probably put it in sometime tomorrow. Not feeling well this afternoon and am under some drugs so figure I better play it safe for today anyway. Anxious to get going with it though.

[LucShep]

On 10/1/2023 at 1:34 PM, dburne said:

In the meantime I am replacing my ram finally. I have been running 32 GB (2 sticks) PC-3200 CL14 DDR4 ram. Higher priced G-Skill stuff. My replacement I have ordered is 64 GB ( 2 x 32GB sticks) Corsair Vengeance PC-3200 DDR4 ram. However this "cheaper" ram has CL16 rather than CL14. I elected to go with cheaper ram this time due to my possibly replacing this rig sometime after first of year - that part I am still unsure of.

So I wonder will the increase in size mean better performance in DCS or will the increase in latency make it a little worse. Going to be interesting finding out. Ram scheduled to arrive sometime this afternoon/evening from Amazon. Will try to get it in my rig tomorrow for some testing. As long as I can maintain my vsync lock of 45 fps I should have a smooth experience like I am getting now.

Intel is far more "memory agnostic" when it comes to RAM (if compared to AMD Ryzen), especially from 6th gen up to 11th gen. On these, DDR4 3200 CL16 is still considered excelent, no perceptible difference from DDR4 3200 CL14 - even if with an RTX4090 - certainly not with DCS.

As said above, what you'll imediately notice with the bigger capacity RAM (64GB instead of 32GB), doing complex missions and MP in DCS, is that it feels a lot smoother, and most stuttering issues are gone (MT issues with VR aside, those are a different story), even if with no difference in framerate. The bottleneck by the limited (lower) memory capacity is no longer there, as the bits that are expected to be worked by the fast RAM speeds now are always so, and no longer swapped onto the system page file on disk (much slower even if that's on an NVME, and what causes stuttering when things get complicated on RAM capacity limited systems).
In this specific case, it's all benefits, and no downsides.

Edited October 4, 2023 by LucShep

[dburne]

6 minutes ago, LucShep said:

Intel is far more "memory agnostic" when it comes to RAM (if compared to AMD Ryzen), especially from 6th gen up to 11th gen. For these, DDR4 3200 CL16 is still considered very good, no perceptible difference from DDR4 3200 CL14 - even if with an RTX4090 - certainly not with DCS.

As said above, what you'll imediately notice with the bigger capacity RAM (64GB instead of 32GB) is that complex missions and MP feel a lot smoother, and most stuttering issues are gone (MT issues with VR aside, those are a different story). The bottleneck by the limited (lower) capacity is no longer there, and all the bits that are expected to be worked by the fast RAM speeds are always so, and no longer swapped onto the system page file on disk (much, much slower, even if that's on an NVME, and what causes major stuttering when things get complicated on RAM capacity limited systems). In this specific case, it's all benefits, and no downsides.

 

 

Sounds great thanks much for the info!

[dburne]

Ok so my 64 GB of Corsair Vengeance 3200 MHz DDR4 CL 16 ram is in - two sticks of 32 GB each. All recognized in both bios and Windows. Good to go!

Obviously the main thing I got it for was DCS. 95% or even better is spent in DCS so hoping it really benefits from my having 64 GB now. Was wanting to fly some DCS this evening however just my luck for some reason my device ID changed on my Virpil CM3 stick and now getting just errors in the Virpil software. Have posted on their forums and just have to wait to get sorted - ugh just my luck. That has not happened to me before. No idea why it happened, I did change my CM3 Stick from the Virpil Mount to a Monster Tech Mount as it sits closer to my desk and I really like their mounts. But did not change anything connection wise, plugged into the same powered USB port as it was before. Very weird. All button assignments in DCS for the stick are gone.

Maybe tomorrow I can get sorted and do some checking in DCS with my new ram. I will advise when I get it going.

Edited October 2, 2023 by dburne

[j9murphy]

Just copy the settings from your old profile that worked into the new one that was created... or rename the old file to the same name as the new file that was created.

Sent from my SM-S918U using Tapatalk

[dburne]

2 hours ago, j9murphy said:

Just copy the settings from your old profile that worked into the new one that was created... or rename the old file to the same name as the new file that was created.

Sent from my SM-S918U using Tapatalk
 

What are you referring to as an old profile?

[j9murphy]

Your control profiles for each aircraft are stored in C:\Users\[Your user name]\Saved Games\DCS (or DCS.OpenBeta)\Config\Input

Your most recent file will be the new device id, the one before it will be the one with all your settings in it. You can look at it to verify.

You just need to rename the old file to the new device id or copy the contents of the old one into the new one(replacing what's there)

Sent from my SM-S918U using Tapatalk

[Motomouse]

I followed your example and upgraded to the same 2x32 GB sticks. I was not able to drive 4x16GB sticks at 3200, but 2x32 works well on my asrock 450 board & 5600. I wanted to fly in syria without dropping the ram speeds. I am quite happy with the upgrade.

[dburne]

7 minutes ago, Motomouse said:

I followed your example and upgraded to the same 2x32 GB sticks. I was not able to drive 4x16GB sticks at 3200, but 2x32 works well on my asrock 450 board & 5600. I wanted to fly in syria without dropping the ram speeds. I am quite happy with the upgrade.

 

Nice! Mine are certainly all in and ready to go however I have not been able to do any actual flying with it yet. I am very ill at this time and just can not do it. Hopefully soon. Hoping for a better day tomorrow.

[Motomouse]

Hope you are well again very soon.

I just managed my first kill with the 64 GB on my first Enigma Cold War Syria flight in the AJS37 Viggen. With a little help of my friends at the AAA of the airfield

CU in the skys.

[MAXsenna]

 
Nice! Mine are certainly all in and ready to go however I have not been able to do any actual flying with it yet. I am very ill at this time and just can not do it. Hopefully soon. Hoping for a better day tomorrow.

Get well Don!

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk

[dburne]

4 hours ago, Motomouse said:

Hope you are well again very soon.

I just managed my first kill with the 64 GB on my first Enigma Cold War Syria flight in the AJS37 Viggen. With a little help of my friends at the AAA of the airfield

CU in the skys.

 

3 hours ago, MAXsenna said:

Get well Don!

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk
 

 

Thanks so much guys I really appreciate it!

Truth be known, no I will not be getting well. All I can do now is hope for some better days. Today has just not been one of them unfortunately.

[DayGlow]

When I got 64gb of memory I started using Primocache to use part of my memory as a super fast cache. I have 12gb for my Windows drive and 12gb for my App drive. Can't say it helps DCS directly, but it does improve overall system performance. 

[dburne]

19 minutes ago, DayGlow said:

When I got 64gb of memory I started using Primocache to use part of my memory as a super fast cache. I have 12gb for my Windows drive and 12gb for my App drive. Can't say it helps DCS directly, but it does improve overall system performance. 

 

Nice!

[Motomouse]

64 GB:

expected:          I can use my Syria map

unexpected:      I can fly multiplayer without stutters at the same FPS and picture fidelity as singleplayer on all servers I use

(I had to reduce my settings for heavier multiplayer scenarios prior and thought it was a VRAM issue. But it was just a RAM shortage seemingly.)

5600 & 3080 & Aero & 45 FPS sync