Braking behaviour

[Lixma 06]

This is from a British trial of a captured Bf-10E in 1940

Quote

 

The centre of gravity is unusually far behind the main wheels, and the brakes can be applied fully immediately after touch-down without fear of lifting the tail. The ground run is very short, and there is no tendency to swing or bucket. Owing to the large ground attitude, and the consequent high position of the nose, the view ahead during the hold-off and ground run is extremely bad. Landing at night would probably be difficult.

   4.14. Ground Handling. – Because of the large weight on the tail the aircraft can be taxied very fast without bouncing or bucketing, but is difficult to turn quickly; an unusually large amount of throttle is necessary, in conjunction with harsh use of the differential brakes, when manoeuvring in a confined space. Apart from turning performance, the ground handling qualities are good. The brakes are powerful and can be used harshly without lifting the tail; they are foot operated, and the pilots expressed a strong preference for the hand-operated system universal on British aircraft.

 

This is in complete contrast to our K-4 which will happily tip over at practically walking speed.

I doubt between 1940 and 1944 the Bf-109's braking evolved, or the type's centre of gravity so dramatically shifted forward, as to account for such a stark difference in behaviour.

http://kurfurst.org/Tactical_trials/109E_UKtrials/Morgan.html

[HARTMANN1145]

Very interesting..thank you for the link

[Hobel]

 

Am 1.5.2024 um 03:37 schrieb Lixma 06:

I doubt between 1940 and 1944 the Bf-109's braking evolved, or the type's centre of gravity so dramatically shifted forward, as to account for such a stark difference in behaviour.

Actually, the weight of the engine increased significantly from the E to the K, so it is not really appropriate to compare the two.
The K4 has a 30mm cannon and muntion in the nose + the significantly heavier and more powerful engine..
The tail of the BF109 has hardly changed compared to the engine section, so the center of gravity has probably shifted

in other simulations where you can fly BF109E and K4 the difference in weight is sometimes more and sometimes less noticeable in different situations

[LeCuvier]

On 5/1/2024 at 3:37 AM, Lixma 06 said:

...This is in complete contrast to our K-4 which will happily tip over at practically walking speed...

 

An exaggerated statement in my opinion. I land the Kurfürst quite frequently and I have no problem at all getting down to taxying speed after touchdown.
I use analogue pedals of course. With ON/OFF signals that might be quite tricky, but I've never tried.

[Ala13_ManOWar]

Yep, I use buttons since I can't step on braking pedals, so it's clunky and cumbersome, but back when I used those braking pedals there's no problem beyond oneself mishandling.

 

Besides, well, an Emil 4 and a Kurfurst 4 are way different airframes mate, nothing to do one to the other.

[Rex]

On 7/13/2024 at 3:41 AM, Ala13_ManOWar said:

Yep, I use buttons since I can't step on braking pedals, so it's clunky and cumbersome, but back when I used those braking pedals there's no problem beyond oneself mishandling.

 

Besides, well, an Emil 4 and a Kurfurst 4 are way different airframes mate, nothing to do one to the other.

I don't think I'd be able to fly the Kurfurst with buttons for braking.   It's my primary plane and I fly it every day, but I very rarely, if ever, fully lock a brake unless I'm trying to turn while going slow.  I have pedals and rarely step on them all the way.  After landing and getting down below 50kph or so,  I never press both at the same time because, yes, it will nose-plant at relatively slow speeds.  To stop quickly, I walk the brakes left - right - left - right  quickly oscillating back and forth, about 1/2 - 3/4ths strength, while making sure never to step on the both at the same time.

If I stepped on one or the other 100%, I imagine I'd get the same behavior your experienced.  Unfortunately, these things are too nuanced to to use off/on controls unless you can figure out a way to do it very quickly, and average the force out over time.  I'd imagine that would take a lot of practice, though.

You  mentioned that you can't step on pedals, you can probably emulate pedals with the pinkie switch or one of the analog joystick controls.  Maybe even the twist-grip of the joystick if you have one, left for left brake, right for right brake, as long as it's analog, you could probably make it work.