From AMD7800X3D to 9800X3D, stutters!!!

[motoadve]

Gained about 15% in fps, but it stutters quite a bit, the 7800X3D was very smooth, this 9800X3D is not.

If I increase graphic settings it stutters the same as if I reduce them, so that does not help, sometimes I see CPU bound in yellow but sometimes in red, which I never saw with the 7800X3D, so something is not right.

Any ideas what to look for? Bios was updated, Mbo is Rog Strix B650E_F.

64GB memory 6000mhz

Turbo Game Mode in Bios is designed to optimize gaming performance for AMD Ryzen processors by adjusting core usage. It disables one of the CPU's two chiplets (CCD) and turns off Simultaneous Multi-Threading (SMT)

So it turns off Simultaneous Multi-Threading, is this recommended for DCS now it is Multithread?

[EightyDuce]

5 hours ago, motoadve said:

Gained about 15% in fps, but it stutters quite a bit, the 7800X3D was very smooth, this 9800X3D is not.

If I increase graphic settings it stutters the same as if I reduce them, so that does not help, sometimes I see CPU bound in yellow but sometimes in red, which I never saw with the 7800X3D, so something is not right.

Any ideas what to look for? Bios was updated, Mbo is Rog Strix B650E_F.

64GB memory 6000mhz

Turbo Game Mode in Bios is designed to optimize gaming performance for AMD Ryzen processors by adjusting core usage. It disables one of the CPU's two chiplets (CCD) and turns off Simultaneous Multi-Threading (SMT)

So it turns off Simultaneous Multi-Threading, is this recommended for DCS now it is Multithread?

9800X3D, unlike the 99XX variants, only has one CCD....so it does not turn off any other CCDs, at least in this particular case. 

I don't have my 9800X3D yet, but assuming that the only change was the new cpu and turning on turbo mode, I would start by turning turbo mode off and go from there. It's difficult to make any other useful recommendations with limited information. Was Windows reinstalled after CPU was changed? While both CPUs are "close enough" in architecture, it may be worth considering fresh OS install if turning turbo mode doesn't resolve your issues. 

 

[BitMaster]

Wasn't there an issue that you have to reinstall your OS if you ever switch the ( AMD 7 series ) CPU ?  Forgot what's the reason but iirc there is something to it.

So if you havent reinstalled from scratch, that's likely it.

[Hiob]

Update Bios

Update chipset drivers

But that‘s actually the reason I‘m still using my 5900X instead of a 5800X3D. The former runs buttery smooth, the latter I couldn’t figure out why it caused a lot of (micro-) stuttering. I‘m sure there is a reason and it can be fixed, but I haven’t found it unfortunately.

[Blackhawk163]

On 11/15/2024 at 2:15 PM, BitMaster said:

Wasn't there an issue that you have to reinstall your OS if you ever switch the ( AMD 7 series ) CPU ?  Forgot what's the reason but iirc there is something to it.

So if you havent reinstalled from scratch, that's likely it.

I have yet to run into any problems, it's possible that this can help, but thus far it's been pretty much plug and play for me. I did update my MB bios prior to install though. I also forgot to take DCS off from offline which resulted in me waiting a few hours for support to remove the hardware change flag off the account. 

[motoadve]

Clean install of Windows 11 did not solved, might be a bad processor.

Drivers for chipset, Bios, Video drivers, all updated.

[Gripen 4-1]

Try to disable SMT (multithreading) manually in your BIOS. Not turbo game mode. Turn this off completely

For me if SMT is enabled with my 5900X I get stuttering in VR; if it is disabled it is smooth.

Did you only change the CPU, or other components too? Try to reset your BIOS settings completely, and then change step by step

 

[coldViPer]

Is cpu temp normal? Heatsink installed properly?

[Hiob]

10 hours ago, motoadve said:

Clean install of Windows 11 did not solved, might be a bad processor.

Drivers for chipset, Bios, Video drivers, all updated.

What kind of RAM are you driving? (Amount, number of sticks, speed?)

ah, sorry. Just saw it in your original post. 

Do you have some kind of failsafe defaults you can load in your bios. Deactivate the XMP on the RAM and try from there.

 

Edited November 18, 2024 by Hiob

[motoadve]

Tried Turbo On or OFF, temps are below 50C

[Blackhawk163]

8 hours ago, Gripen 4-1 said:

Try to disable SMT (multithreading) manually in your BIOS. Not turbo game mode. Turn this off completely

For me if SMT is enabled with my 5900X I get stuttering in VR; if it is disabled it is smooth.

Did you only change the CPU, or other components too? Try to reset your BIOS settings completely, and then change step by step

 

I tried playing DCS with  SMT disabled on my 9800x3d setup (VR) and this actually introduced tiny, yet noticeable micro stutters and fps dips. I then went back to ryzen master and re-enabled it.

 

OP are you able to run a stress test/benchmark on your cpu?  I know you recently sold your 7800x3d but did you ship it yet (I figured it wouldn’t hurt to test the setup again just to be sure)  

[Hiob]

19 minutes ago, motoadve said:

Tried Turbo On or OFF, temps are below 50C

CPU temps? under load?

 

[motoadve]

2 hours ago, Hiob said:

CPU temps? under load?

 

Those temps are under load

[Hiob]

10 minutes ago, motoadve said:

Those temps are under load

That seem a bit low to me. Even for a efficient CPU like this one. You are positively running MT?

How is the FPS limiter in DCS set? In the past setting it to 300 introduced problems with fps and frametimes. Don’t know if that is still a thing.

Generally it is advisable to use external limiters like the driver or RivaTuner

Edit:

Obviously I‘m just shooting in the blue here. Just some variables that have caused issues for me in the past.

Edit2

Since I‘m already brainstorming -

are you using some kind of monitoring software (like HWinfo), RGB-software like iCue or Logitech….. or something like Aquasuite? Try it without those in case.

Last but not least, just for testing, turn off the power service.

Edited November 18, 2024 by Hiob

[motoadve]

Fixed it after a ton of work, trial an error by me , even AMD support, re install windows and nothing helped.

This AM posted in Toms Hardware and one guy with lots of trophies in his signature (experienced) told me to go to Bios, go default, clear CMOS, go back to Bios, stay default and try the game, no stutters and super smooth game play.

Then I was able to overclock and this processor seems pretty good for DCS.

Thanks everyone for the advice.

Will test some more and post the improvement from the 7800.

[Tom Kazansky]

5 hours ago, motoadve said:

Fixed it after a ton of work, trial an error by me , even AMD support, re install windows and nothing helped.

This AM posted in Toms Hardware and one guy with lots of trophies in his signature (experienced) told me to go to Bios, go default, clear CMOS, go back to Bios, stay default and try the game, no stutters and super smooth game play.

Then I was able to overclock and this processor seems pretty good for DCS.

Thanks everyone for the advice.

Will test some more and post the improvement from the 7800.

Good to read.

I assume the overclocking is not really part of the solution, is it? Just to clarify, were there any of those stutters after resetting the bios to default (without overclocking)?

And how much did the DCS performance improve after overclocking?

[motoadve]

8 hours ago, Tom Kazansky said:

Good to read.

I assume the overclocking is not really part of the solution, is it? Just to clarify, were there any of those stutters after resetting the bios to default (without overclocking)?

And how much did the DCS performance improve after overclocking?

9800X3D Bios default compared to 7800X3D felt like an improvement, no stutters, just a bit of slowdown over big cities flying low, , 9800X3D overclocked its a substantial improvement from Bios default, very smooth gaming, maybe some choppiness flying low looking to the side over big cities that's all.

No stutters, very crisp beautiful image.

Varjo Aero at 39PPD (highest resolution)  with foveated focus at 1.6 (60% more resolution), peripheral 0.5 ,DLAA, everything maxed out on graphics except terrain shadows, I use secondary shadows and SSS instead and looks great.

[EightyDuce]

3 minutes ago, motoadve said:

9800X3D Bios default compared to 7800X3D felt like an improvement, no stutters, just a bit of slowdown over big cities flying low, , 9800X3D overclocked its a substantial improvement from Bios default, very smooth gaming, maybe some choppiness flying low looking to the side over big cities that's all.

No stutters, very crisp beautiful image.

Varjo Aero at 39PPD (highest resolution)  with foveated focus at 1.6 (60% more resolution), peripheral 0.5 ,DLAA, everything maxed out on graphics except terrain shadows, I use secondary shadows and SSS instead and looks great.

How much of an overclock over stock are you getting? What method of overclock used (PBO+CO2, eclk +PBO, static via multiplier)? Any memory overclock/tuning?

Thanks in advance. 

[motoadve]

No memory overclock, or anything extreme, just AI tuner in the Bios positive +200 which is all that will allow, and curve negative 25,  processor running at 5.4. Just took this info from a YouTube video and applied it.

[suhast]

How does compare to the 7800x3d in DCS VR?

Edited November 19, 2024 by suhast

[motoadve]

22 minutes ago, suhast said:

How does compare to the 7800x3d in DCS VR?

Definitely an improvement, 7800X3D was pretty good, this one even better, very smooth , allowed me to go from DLAA DLSS to just DLAA (look much better) and also increase Focus resolution in the VR headset 10% more , which puts me at maximum for the Aero, and even with this image upgrades is smoother than the 7800X3D, so pretty happy with the upgrade.

[SharpeXB]

9 minutes ago, motoadve said:

Definitely an improvement, 7800X3D was pretty good, this one even better, very smooth , allowed me to go from DLAA DLSS to just DLAA (look much better) and also increase Focus resolution in the VR headset 10% more , which puts me at maximum for the Aero, and even with this image upgrades is smoother than the 7800X3D, so pretty happy with the upgrade.

That’s interesting. I would figure DLSS and resolution are GPU driven and not dependent on the CPU. 

[motoadve]

Just now, SharpeXB said:

That’s interesting. I would figure DLSS and resolution are GPU driven and not dependent on the CPU. 

I have a 4090, DCS is CPU bound 100% of the time, and even with the 9800X3D still is CPU bound, this might be a DCS thing.

So for DCS and the 9800X3Dd, use Turbo mode or not? It disables a second CCD and SMT , I tried it and got a bit of stuttering

For a Multithreaded game like DCS, disabling SMT is recommended?

[EightyDuce]

4 hours ago, motoadve said:

So for DCS and the 9800X3Dd, use Turbo mode or not? It disables a second CCD and SMT , I tried it and got a bit of stuttering

For a Multithreaded game like DCS, disabling SMT is recommended?

There is only one CCD on the 9800X3D, so hopefully it doesn't disable that.  

But if you tried it and you have adverse effects, it's probably not a good idea to continue using it. It's a new feature that hasn't gotten a ton of "play time" and will likely vary in efficacy on per application basis. It would appear from your testing that it is not a good candidate for DCS, at least in your case. 

I'll give it a go once i get the chance to install the 9800X3D this weekend. Maybe others can comment with their results. 

Edited November 20, 2024 by EightyDuce

[Blackhawk163]

It doesn't stutter on mine by keeping SMT enabled, not sure why it would stutter for yours, mine had the tiniest amount of stutter by disabling SMT.