NVIDIA 5 Series cards - Get your wallets ready boys and girls....

[Aapje]

Why can't you respond to what I actually said, instead of pretending I said something I didn't? I never addressed whether it is relevant to 'a discussion about 50-series cards'. I pointed out that it is not relevant with regards to the MSRP, which is actually one of the main discussions going on in this thread.

[kksnowbear]

9 hours ago, Pilotasso said:

have you actually found stores with inventory and price stickers on them? because announced MSRP is one thing, actual practiced price is another entirely. I suspect there will be huge margins given like last gen was BUT... put 600-800€ on top of that. So far this is what I am seeing.

 

I got my ROG strix at launch for 2200€, but the placeholder price (no inventory, no order button="comming soon") for the few stores already listing it has them 2800-3000€ (doesnt mean they will even honor that when they actually get them). Yeah.

Of course, you have a perfectly valid point.  Some people might get the base model FE cards, but some may prefer better models from AIBs for their own perfectly valid reasons.  That's subjective.

Some won't be able to get base models at all, due to historically unprecedented poor availability for these units.  They'll wind up paying more.  Factually, this happened several times in the past, too, with prior generations of cards.  Given the very poor availability, it seems practically assured this time around as well. (There might have been different causes...but the end result is the same: higher prices).

Some (myself included) feel this is just another way to drive higher prices while still advertising lower MSRP, even though very few will likely get cards for that low price.  (There is very little way for anyone to prove this isn't true BTW)

My guess - which seems to be echoed by recognized, expert reviewers - is that the vast majority will not get a 5090 (of any variety) for the $1999 MSTP cited for only the FE model.

Some prefer to only look at the lowest possible cited price - the Nvidia MSRP - since doing so artificially inflates the value of performance vs cost. Of course, Nvidia likes people seeing it this way as it makes their product look better, even though some recognized experts are saying otherwise (and your common sense is telling you the same thing lol).  Some people are very upset that the 50 series so far appears to be proving it's not all Nvidia wants us to believe.

The reality is not all 5090s are created equal, thus it's inaccurate to assign one MSRP to all 5090s.

4 hours ago, Aapje said:

Why can't you respond to what I actually said, instead of pretending I said something I didn't? I never addressed whether it is relevant to 'a discussion about 50-series cards'. I pointed out that it is not relevant with regards to the MSRP, which is actually one of the main discussions going on in this thread.

Please stop trying to pick a fight with me.

The thread is about 50 series GPUs, and not just pricing.

Edited January 25 by kksnowbear

[Aapje]

7 minutes ago, kksnowbear said:

Please stop trying to pick a fight with me.

You are like those cops who should 'stop resisting' at people who are not at all resisting, so they can justify using force themselves. I am not picking a fight, but trying to get you to stop gaslighting me, by pretending that I wrote things that I didn't write at all.

Is it really that unreasonable that I expect you to respond to what I actually wrote, rather than to put words in my mouth?

Edited January 25 by Aapje

[kksnowbear]

I didn't put words in your mouth.

I simply said the thread is about 50 series cards, not just price.  And it is.

[Aapje]

And what did that non sequitur contribute to the discussion?

[kksnowbear]

Please stay on topic. The thread is about 50 series GPUs, and not just about MSRP models or pricing.

[Panzerlang]

9 hours ago, kksnowbear said:

A 5090 is still a 5090, and it's perfectly relevant to a discussion about 50-series cards.

Which is what this is.

Lol. I should have tried that on at my KTM dealer when I had all the bling fitted to it. 

[MJY65]

The reality of the 5090 does present a bit of a dilemma for those of us that waited for our first DCS setup in hopes of increased performance.   I guess I’ll be paying a premium for marginally improved results.   It seems likely that we’ve reached a plateau where things will stay for the foreseeable future.     The next GPU, next “and beyond”, next gen VR,  etc aren’t likely to change much.  Accept DCS as it is now (with minimal improvements) or forget about it and move on.

[bigdaddybones30]

After watching reviews and going thru this flame war\5090 banter, I personally will keep my 6900xt and 5800x3D. Maybe when the 9800x3D combo drops from.$750 to like$450 at Micro Center, I might do that upgrade. Just seems the value isn't there. I play on the Odyssey G9 and I lock the.frames at 60fps with settings maxed out and I love it. The human eye can't see past 60fps anyway. The frame rates are stable and locking it means my hardware doesn't have to work so hard either. Keeps heat, wear & tear down as well. Its been said many times that the CPU is the hold back in this game.

I think stable frames with all the eye candy maxed out is better than 9000fps at medium settings and suffers like crazy. Im and hotrod guy too and I can't see paying as much for a GPU as some of the project cars I buy! Maybe I don't live in the same world. Now if the 5090 voodoo fixes all the issues in DCS, then maybe I will sell hotrod or two and get it. Just don't see that happening.

Just my$.02

[okopanja]

Interesting, isn't it?

 

[BIGNEWY]

@kksnowbear@Aapje please just be nice to each other in this thread, it is a discussion about the NVIDIA 5 series cards, there is no need to be getting upset.

Please take it to PM's if you have to so we dont derail the thread and require moderation.

thank you  

edit: title updated

[Dogmanbird]

there's a notable shortage of both new and used 4090's locally here in Aus, almost nothing available new (from regular official retailers) except a $3999 model here and there. It might help hold the value of the cards for a while longer

 

Edited January 26 by Dogmanbird

[okopanja]

1 hour ago, Dogmanbird said:

there's a notable shortage of both new and used 4090's locally here in Aus, almost nothing available new (from regular official retailers) except a $3999 model here and there. It might help hold the value of the cards for a while longer

 

Yes, this is how NVidia ensures the prices remain high. Up there you can see prices here in Germany.

3090 price is still high, with minimal suppliers.

4090 price is rising in anticipated of 5090!

The only explanation is that NVidia ensures that supply remains limited, so actual number of new 4090s at the moment is very low. Jump started in October, which means that at least as of September they may have chocked the availability. This is not difficult to achieve since they know exactly the state of stocks and actual demand. I am pretty sure that we will see this before 6090 as well before it gets hyped they will push 5090 prices up, but cutting off supply.

If I have to predict for release of 6090 Jensen will wear red tight skin jump suite and all will be "good" again.

[SharpeXB]

9 hours ago, bigdaddybones30 said:

The human eye can't see past 60fps anyway.

Not true. It should be obvious that your monitor doesn’t look like real life. 60FPS is a very decent frame rate for gaming but the limit of what your eye can see is vastly higher. What I find wrong about this math though is the quoted resolution that is perceivable by your eye. The example shown here implies a 27” 1080x1920 screen is at that limit and I think we all know it’s not. 

 

2 hours ago, okopanja said:

The only explanation is that NVidia ensures that supply remains limited

Price is an interrelation between supply and demand. Not just a product of one or the other. Demand for a product that can easily be resold at a higher price is nearly infinite. 

Edited January 26 by SharpeXB

[EightyDuce]

4 hours ago, okopanja said:

Yes, this is how NVidia ensures the prices remain high. Up there you can see prices here in Germany.

3090 price is still high, with minimal suppliers.

4090 price is rising in anticipated of 5090!

The only explanation is that NVidia ensures that supply remains limited, so actual number of new 4090s at the moment is very low. Jump started in October, which means that at least as of September they may have chocked the availability. This is not difficult to achieve since they know exactly the state of stocks and actual demand. I am pretty sure that we will see this before 6090 as well before it gets hyped they will push 5090 prices up, but cutting off supply.

If I have to predict for release of 6090 Jensen will wear red tight skin jump suite and all will be "good" again.

The reason for pricing is simple (over-generalizing here) supply and demand. Demand remains fairly high, however supply is dropping off since it is an outgoing generation.

Most of the orders for die wafers from  TSMC are put in months if not a year in advance with a pre-determined prdouction run amount in mind. It makes no sense to put in orders for older chips that eat up capacity for new wafers and would later canibalize sales of 50XX series. 

Not really a conspiracy, just simple business. 

[Aapje]

15 hours ago, bigdaddybones30 said:

The human eye can't see past 60fps anyway.

This is a myth, like the other person said. Even just the 'coincidence' that this is exactly the same value as a popular framerate, should tell you that this number was made up to defend the use of 60 FPS screens.

Physically, our eyes + brain can process something like 1000 FPS. The ability to identify individual frames is lower, but that doesn't mean that there is not a benefit beyond that. Note that a USAF test had pilots identify a plane after showing them an image for 1/220 of a second (so 220 FPS).

[skywalker22]

Check out this brick  

 

 

[Dogmanbird]

I can definitely see the difference between 60 and 90, above 90, not so much. However, I never thought I could until I got into VR and experimented with settings. 

Racing sims, first person shooters and low level helicopter flying certainly reveals the difference for me

 

[okopanja]

1 hour ago, Dogmanbird said:

I can definitely see the difference between 60 and 90, above 90, not so much. However, I never thought I could until I got into VR and experimented with settings. 

Racing sims, first person shooters and low level helicopter flying certainly reveals the difference for me

 

I think next technological breakthrough will be integrating main CPU into GPU.

[Dogmanbird]

yes

 

[Dragon1-1]

Here's a thought: someone should make a modular GPU board. Instead of selling everything in one pack, let us buy a board, the GPU chip itself, however much VRAM we care to insert, and a cooler for all that. It works that way with the rest of the PC, why not the GPU? I don't think inserting a CPU-style socket would affect performance too badly.

[Aapje]

On 1/27/2025 at 11:55 AM, okopanja said:

I think next technological breakthrough will be integrating main CPU into GPU.

Already exists. They are called APU's. But there is a reason why this is not done for high-end graphics. You put even more heat into a small region and the connection between the CPU and GPU doesn't actually have to be extremely fast, because a ton of rendering is done on relatively little data.

13 hours ago, Dragon1-1 said:

Here's a thought: someone should make a modular GPU board. Instead of selling everything in one pack, let us buy a board, the GPU chip itself, however much VRAM we care to insert, and a cooler for all that. It works that way with the rest of the PC, why not the GPU? I don't think inserting a CPU-style socket would affect performance too badly.

Yes, it would. Current GPUs push everything to their limits, so everything would have to be substantially slowed down. Also, GPU's have direct die cooling and consumers are going to be breaking their GPU chips in large numbers, if you expect them to install the cooler themselves.

And you can't just change the memory amount, because VRAM is much more tightly linked to the GPU chip, than how RAM is connected to the CPU. That improves performance, but you lose flexibility.

And laptop CPU's are already soldered, and memory may be moving to grid array pin contacts, rather than edge connectors, which is a step closer to being soldered on. 

[okopanja]

24 minutes ago, Aapje said:

Already exists. They are called APU's. But there is a reason why this is not done for high-end graphics. You put even more heat into a small region and the connection between the CPU and GPU doesn't actually have to be extremely fast, because a ton of rendering is done on relatively little data.

Well aware, but the thing here is how you market and sell it.

From the money point of view the GPU core is the primary value in such combo, with CPU being added value, as opposed CPU-as-main-value.

 

Meanwhile with DEEPSEEK, I wonder if Jensen should reconsider the pricing for 5090 (and the rest)...

Looks like he will have extra capacity to offer within high end chips to the gaming market.

Edited January 28 by okopanja

[MAXsenna]

Interesting.

https://www.reddit.com/r/hoggit/s/5wFitsxP7D

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk

[okopanja]

14 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

Interesting.

https://www.reddit.com/r/hoggit/s/5wFitsxP7D

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk
 

Western countries did place all the semiconductor future hopes into a single box called Taiwan. No surprise there - it was profitable, except one tiny problem - this is not exactly the safest place on Earth.

It's only natural for current administration to realize that this poses existential risk.

Earthquakes and/or foreign factory can easily disrupt the source of the chips.

Besides, USA wants rightfully to reclaim the lead in technology they essentially developed.

When facing tariffs any export oriented economy will think twice before not complying, Taiwan or Germany, it does not matter much. So TSMC, please come to USA.

 

Edited January 28 by okopanja