New CH Hotas / Saitek X65F / Logitech G940

[baksie]

Ok my current X45 is slowly dying, several switches are broken. The toe brakes on my CH Pro pedals are broken.

Christmas is coming.

 

So what should I do?

Buy Logitech G940 ? or wait for X65F or CH A10 Hotas?

Anyone know what the release dates are for the two new Hotas?

 

Flying mostly: IL2 / Lockon / DCS:BS / Rise of Flight

 

Thanks,

 

Baksie

[Feuerfalke]

You should add the Thrustmaster Warthog to your considerations.

 

 

At the moment, you only have 2 choices:

 

1. Buy the Logitech 940

 

or

 

2. Wait.

 

The Saitek is announced for February 2010. I bet that until that time some solid info on the CH and TM HOTAS is available as well.

 

 

Looking at your list I just recommend to consider that the Saitek X65F uses a rigid stick-design - it moves for about 8mm. For IL2 this is probably not the optimum.

[lawndartleo]

Why not current CH? Their current stable of USB controllers is well featured and quite programmable.

[Hunt3r.j2]

Why not current CH? Their current stable of USB controllers is well featured and quite programmable.

Rigid stick is far more precise, yadda yadda.

 

Basically, unless CH releases something new, it's really going to start falling behind.

[4c Hajduk Veljko]

Well, Thurstmaster is coming up with a new Hog throttle and stick.

[Hunt3r.j2]

Well, Thurstmaster is coming up with a new Hog throttle and stick.

And if CH releases one then Thrustmaster will have done all that R&D for nothing.

[LukeFF]

Basically, unless CH releases something new, it's really going to start falling behind.

 

I highly doubt that.

[sobek]

So what should I do?

 

Welcome to my world :D

 

Seriously, all four of the sims you mentioned can benefit from force feedback, especially BS, ROF and Il-2. Therefore i would tend towards the G940. Unfortunately, FFB is not yet implemented to use the stick properly and to it's full capabilities.

[159th_Viper]

Ok my current X45 is slowly dying, several switches are broken. The toe brakes on my CH Pro pedals are broken.

Christmas is coming.

 

So what should I do?

Buy Logitech G940 ? or wait for X65F or CH A10 Hotas?

Anyone know what the release dates are for the two new Hotas?

 

Flying mostly: IL2 / Lockon / DCS:BS / Rise of Flight

 

Thanks,

 

Baksie

 

What would I do?

 

Purchase a Cheap Flightstick (Cyborg Evo or the like) in the Interim to tide me over till the release of the new A-10 HOTAS from CH or the HOTAS Warthog from Thrustmaster.

 

Saitek X65 is a definite No-No for BS/IL-2/Rise of Flight by it's mere design (Force Sensors). Then left with the G940 which is unfortunately and dependant on One's level of Tolerance, Porked beyond Redemption.

 

I would Definitely Wait.

[Pilotasso]

 

Saitek X65 is a definite No-No for BS/IL-2/Rise of Flight by it's mere design (Force Sensors). Then left with the G940 which is unfortunately and dependant on One's level of Tolerance, Porked beyond Redemption.

 

I would Definitely Wait.

 

X65 is being unfairly criticized IMHO. People heavily dissing it for not having FFB. What is curious is that the G940 is being also criticised for being FFB, that technology always brings compromises, hence the center play, and lack of input centering also due to lack of software optimization. Appart form that its a good HOTAS hardware wise. I have one.

 

Realy think people should read the saitek forums to see that the stick is not realy fixed, it flexes a bit and sensibility to force is adjustable. If many people using the super stiff super heavy cougar why not X65? Let it be released and review it later.

[Feuerfalke]

Viper did not comment on the lack of FFB on the Saitek stick, but because there was no force-sensing stick in any WW1 and WW2 plane and therefore the stick is not best suited for those simulation in immersion terms.

 

If the Saitek Stick is good or bad, nobody commented on that so far, at least not that I am aware of.

 

Nevertheless the stick makes a new and different approach and it has to be discussed and not everybody likes that.

 

Sure, you can also say that the Saitek-Stick is not "stiff", but then I'd say that the X65F with a movement range of 8mm is pretty stiff compared to a CH Fighterstick with a movement of about 210mm. ;)

[Pilotasso]

CH stick almost has no return to center tension and massive travel cannot be compared. :)

 

 

Was not targeting Vipers coments but the overal critics made by the fans. If you want immersion on WW2 then ask for a noodle on a pole with 2 buttons on it (1 for machine guns the other for cannon).:D

 

People ask for modern jet replicas and fly them on WW2 sims what can they complain now?

[CyBerkut]

It is certainly too early to condemn the Saitek X65F to oblivion, as we haven't seen its quality and useability yet. A lot of the criticism about it not being FFB is fair though... Saitek ran a poll in their forums, and the overwhelming response was for an FFB HOTAS. From the community's perspective, this choice to go with an FS HOTAS came out of left field, and was a disapointment. People are entitled to that disappointment, especially in light of the existence of DCS:BS, where a well implemented FFB would really enhance use of the sim's trim function.

 

I can see how an FS design could appeal to the decision makers over at Saitek. Saitek has taken a lot of guff over the pivoting mechanism / centering spring design utilized in current sticks, etc. Getting rid of that probably looks good to them. The FS design *could* be very robust.

 

While I understand that some folks are really interested in replicating the aircraft controls as closely as possible, I can be reasonably satisfied by what works well (whether it duplicates the aircraft's controls, or not). The human mind can be very adaptable (well, *some* human minds can... ;) ) so it is entirely conceivable to me that a good FS stick could work well in many sims for aircraft that don't have FS sticks in reality. For instance, I suspect it will work fine for the upcoming DCS:A10C sim, for folks that want it to.

 

I'll agree that FFB may have some inherrent compromises, but I don't recall MS Sidewinder FFB2 users complaining about that stick being as bad around the center for DCS:BS. Software/drivers seem to be the key. With word-of-mouth (ie. forums, etc.) being so important in marketing, you would think that Logitech would be parachuting at least one programming wizard into E.D.'s offices to help make the G940 work better in DCS:BS, etc.

 

@ Baksie (the O.P.). My advice would be to wait. Take some time to assess your wants and needs about how to control your sims. Is it realism that rings your bell? (If so, which of your sims does the realism matter most in?) Do you want the stick to move a significant distance, or do you think your mind would adjust to a Force Sensing stick that has a 1/4 inch (or so) of throw? Do you want/need a LOT of hats/switches/rotaries, etc.? Were you happy with your X-45? Would an X-52/X-52 Pro serve your needs well now? Did you like your CH Pro pedals, or do you want something with a different spacing or feel? Are you open to physically modifying your equipment, or do you prefer to use them as they come out of the box? What is your budget limited to? How long can you stand to wait before acquiring something to replace your current equipment? The answers to all of those questions could factor in to your decision(s).

 

I suspect Viper's suggestion of buying a low cost stick for now would be a good idea for you. Good luck!

Edited December 22, 2009 by CyBerkut