Refresh my memory on hovering

[Galwran]

Someone once said that there are no stupid questions, just stupid people :music_whistling:

 

I have some control issues with the ka-50.

 

I have flown BS since it was released, but haven't had the time to learn all of the things. Currently I mostly fly DCS:A10 but decided to learn better copter skills because the two sims will some day compatible together. I use TM warthog and Saitek combat pedals for controls.

 

The problem is that I'm having troubles hovering in a stable position and then turning in to a new direction when my sensors reach their limits.

 

Currently I place copter in hover by manually decreasing horizontal and vertical velocity and then trimming. I have to keep pressure on the pedals to keep the nose pointing at the right direction, but if I am looking at the sensors my feet might slip a little and the bird starts to turn, often uncontrollably.

 

However, I believe that there are some aides for this? For example how and why should I use the collective brake? How about flight director? Alt hold? Autohover? Descent mode? They are all gibberish to me, especially because disengaging autohover leaves alt hold on and I have to disengage autopilot channels to fix it.

 

Please help :helpsmilie:

[GGTharos]

Trim your rudder?

[71st_Mastiff]

trim and then trim again make sure you have the copter in free flight mode or just the heading button off. I always turn off the heading and wpt pvi 800 off. that way I fly the heli my way.

 

also might be useful is to go into the control panel game options and click on the trim reset center position.

 

Also you can over trim too, so make sure you reset after forward sustained flight.

 

good luck and practice theres also a good set up guid I think its on dragons page.

 

joystick setting and dead space.

[KaspeR32]

Something that helped me a lot was to use Ctrl + Enter (I think that was it) It shows you your rudder and joystick position AND how much you've trimmed it. So when you're in a hover, it should always roughly be trimmed (unless there is high winds) in the same position, once you start to learn the correct positions for ie. Forward flight, Hover, Strafe, Turn, etc. It really becomes quite easy.

[Sulman]

Alt hold being on really isn't a problem. That channel - like all the others - only has 20% authority and changing altitude with it engaged is probably the easiest of all the axis.

 

If you have heading, roll, and pitch channels engaged, you should not have any creep in the aircraft's heading, assuming you are trimmed correctly.

 

Two possible scenarios:

 

1) The heading channel will use beta input (yaw) to maintain the last trimmed heading; this will create the scenario you described if you deviate from this heading. Pedal input will allow you to point the helicopter's nose where you see fit, but as soon as your input diminishes to within the heading channel's authority, it will revert. This is resolved by updating (pressing and releasing trim) once you are on your desired heading.

 

2) You have trimmed in some rudder. A hazard with none-force feedback pedals. If this trimmed in rudder exceeds the AP's authority, your heading will drift unless you manually correct it. A quick press of the 'x' or 'z' key (you can map these, naturally) will drop it back to centre.

 

You really have to train yourself to be very careful with rudder trim in the shark, I would simply say 'avoid' if you can. I.e., get the aircraft pointed where you want it with and try to trim after you're done with your pedal inputs, otherwise you can get into a real mess.

 

Cheers

 

 

James

[Sulman]

As an addition, I would say the holds are great aids to flying. For example, sideslipping is laughably easy with the holds engaged. Just trim for hover, and gently push the stick left or right. Heading hold will look after the yaw & pitch hold the attitude. Likewise small movements backwards and forwards become very easy. KA50 automation is wonderful once you get what it is doing.

[Isegrim]

Hmmm :huh:try out to Reset your trim.

If the Helicopter beginns to turn to the right slowly it is normal then and no Setup Proplem.

 

Or.. turn on Shkval >Auto turn on Target>and let Heading hold on please.

 

The Rudder now should turn the Helicopter into the Direction your Shkval is looking, but make sure there is no Wind in the Mission you try out this.

 

The point is you always have to do something to make YOU fly the Shark,

OTHERWISE THE SHARK FLYs YOU. ;)

 

If this doesnt help.

POST a TRACK.:thumbup:

[KosPilot]

Someone once said that there are no stupid questions, just stupid people :music_whistling:

 

I have some control issues with the ka-50.

 

I have flown BS since it was released, but haven't had the time to learn all of the things. Currently I mostly fly DCS:A10 but decided to learn better copter skills because the two sims will some day compatible together. I use TM warthog and Saitek combat pedals for controls.

 

The problem is that I'm having troubles hovering in a stable position and then turning in to a new direction when my sensors reach their limits.

 

Currently I place copter in hover by manually decreasing horizontal and vertical velocity and then trimming. I have to keep pressure on the pedals to keep the nose pointing at the right direction, but if I am looking at the sensors my feet might slip a little and the bird starts to turn, often uncontrollably.

 

However, I believe that there are some aides for this? For example how and why should I use the collective brake? How about flight director? Alt hold? Autohover? Descent mode? They are all gibberish to me, especially because disengaging autohover leaves alt hold on and I have to disengage autopilot channels to fix it.

 

Please help :helpsmilie:

 

Turn to target:

(I assume you fly with AP channels always on.)

(1. Reduce horizontal and vertical speed as you normally would when entering stable hover, but make sure your trim is in neutral.)

(2. When stabile hover is acheived, hit the trimbutton and your copter should now be reasonably stationary by itself.)

(3. Engage Autohover.) -I got the understanding that this is already what you're doing.

4. Engage "Turn to Target" on your target mode panel.

5. Designate any target using your Helmet Mounted Sight or uncaging your Shkval.

6. You can now turn your copter just by scanning the Shkval.

 

Collective brake:

Collective brake is a nescessity in real life, but has no practical use in the sim. However, it is also used to designate new height/altitude when AP Alt Hold is engaged.

 

Spot turn:

If the copter starts yawing uncontrollably, the likely reason is that you are going adrift backwards or sideways, or you're hovering in wind. Pay attention to wind speed and direction before taking off.

While hovering (w/o Hover Hold) keep your eyes at the HORIZON and you will find it easier to hold a stable hover. Also do this during spot turns, keep the horizon level and at a constant attitude (unless adjustment for wind is needed).

 

Personally I fly most of the time without AP, even during hover and while scanning for targets unless there are difficult wind conditions or I am setting myself up for attacking multiple targets in quick sucsession.

The flying style with and without AP is quite different. When flying without AP, you use the copters inherent instabilities to your advantage and just "nudge" it in the direction that you want it to go. -Didn't move just like you wanted? Then nudge again! I find the copter being more predictible this way.

 

Most important: Fly the way you like and have fun! :D

[Sulman]

Turn to target:

 

 

Collective brake:

Collective brake is a nescessity in real life, but has no practical use in the sim. However, it is also used to designate new height/altitude when AP Alt Hold is engaged.

 

 

It's actually pretty handy in the hover, and cruise. It has limited authority but if you're trimmed correctly it'll hold your height perfectly.

 

The other thing I forgot to mention is have a look at the collective and check the route mode, specifically checking it's in the middle position. It's controlled by the 'r' key. If it's up then the aircraft will try and point at whatever waypoint you have selected. It's a bit gotcha as it is not obvious.

[Galwran]

thank you all, I will try these solutions. And then return to ask more.

 

It just has bothered me a lot that there are many buttons that I do not use when flying; collective brake being one of them. I also thought that you couldnt't trim the rudder... but looks like you can?

[CAT_101st]

Forgot I had made a video of entering a hover. Yes I sound like a boring teacher that will put you to sleep.

 

[KaspeR32]

I also thought that you couldnt't trim the rudder... but looks like you can?

 

You can, yes. When you trim it takes into account your cyclic position and rudder position.

 

This anyway, is true for the game with it being a joystick and all, in the real BS I'm not sure, can you trim rudder?

[CAT_101st]

ED would not have put it in if the real thing did not do it. Besides HEADING HOLD AP.

[ZQuickSilverZ]

Word of caution about autohover. If you engage autohover and a missle is fired at you autohover CAN get you killed. Your trying to sideslip to dodge the incomeing missle and the autohover is trying its best to keep you in one spot. Autohover is GREAT for SCANNING. However, once the enemy is located and found to have anti air capabilities its best, in my opinon, to turn it off. If not at least turn it off once you spot a missle coming at you. Hope your fast.

[Yurgon]

Forgot I had made a video of entering a hover. Yes I sound like a boring teacher that will put you to sleep.

 

Nice vid! Just one thing: you mention the HUD symbology changes when the airspeed drops below 50 knots. Since the Ka-50 uses the metric system, it's actually 50 kph.

 

Word of caution about autohover. If you engage autohover and a missle is fired at you autohover CAN get you killed.

Yeah, you're right about that. But there are several ways to get out of it:

1. Disengage autohover. The button is located on the cyclic, so that should be pretty fast.
   
2. Emergency AP disengage, located on the cyclic as well. The downside is that with all the stability augmentation channels gone, the chopper behaves really differently, so depending on altitude and pilot training, this may get you killed just as well.
   
3. Engage Flight Director, it overrides autohover. But in the real pit, the button is on the right panel, so this is not practical because with an incoming missile, there's only one reason to take the hand away from the cyclic: to start the UV-26 dispenser.
   
4. Simply override the chopper's 20% authority and configure the systems once mortal danger has been escaped.
   

Then again, there 's always the question why the chopper is in SAM range in the first place. We really want to avoid that. :-)