About TGP lock

[Pochi]

Hello,

 

I have only a few flight hours in DCS A10 and while following the training courses, I also set up a misson with static targets (trucks and containers) to practice weapons delivery.

 

However, I have sometimes problems with TGP when I want to set the SPI.

 

My first question would be : How can I be sure that TMS up long did work and that my SPI is correctly designated? Some times I think it is locked (I am using Point track), but when I am close to the target, the TGP tracks behind the target...

 

I think I understand the difference between area and point track mode, but what I don't understand is in what cases is area mode used? Am I right to think that for my containers and trucks point track mode is the best?

 

About point track mode, what is the exact symbology I would have to wait for to set the SPI. Some times I only have crosses, sometimes there is a box in the crosses and sometimes the box is flashing. What is the meaning of this symbology? And does the little M stand for? Is it for "masked". If I am right, why is it masked when I can clearly see the target on the TGP?

 

It is a lot of questions but I really want to understand. I do not find find clear answers in the manual.

 

Thanks and best regards,

 

Pierre

[WildBillKelsoe]

How can I be sure that TMS up long did work and that my SPI is correctly designated? Some times I think it is locked (I am using Point track), but when I am close to the target, the TGP tracks behind the target...

check the HUD lower left corner. If SOI is set as TGP, and a target is designated by TGP, you'll read TGP on HUD, even with HUD asterisk.

 

I think I understand the difference between area and point track mode, but what I don't understand is in what cases is area mode used? Am I right to think that for my containers and trucks point track mode is the best?

Area for area attack, such as middle of truck concentration. Point for single target track (STT)

 

OOPS!!

About point track mode, what is the exact symbology I would have to wait for to set the SPI. Some times I only have crosses, sometimes there is a box in the crosses and sometimes the box is flashing. What is the meaning of this symbology? And does the little M stand for? Is it for "masked". If I am right, why is it masked when I can clearly see the target on the TGP?

If it is a cross only, its INU or AREA. If the target is outside TGP field of view, it is now in INU. For area and point to work, you have to have the target dead ahead (<20° to either side of nose), OR directly underneath you. If you pass it, it changes to INU to gyrostabilize the TGP for another round.

 

 

If you get a cross with a box, it is now in POINT track mode.

 

A flashing cross/box-cross means the target is entering the FOV of the TGP and can be locked in either point or area track modes.

 

A flashing INU also means ^. A steady INU means your target is now becoming outside FOV of TGP.

 

Got it?

 

Addendum:

 

If you will use gun, point track. If Maverick, Point track. It depends on the weapon needed and the target engaged being single or multiple.

 

If its a building, Area mode is used.

Edited November 19, 2012 by WildBillKelsoe

[klub44]

Hello,

 

 

My first question would be : How can I be sure that TMS up long did work and that my SPI is correctly designated? Some times I think it is locked (I am using Point track), but when I am close to the target, the TGP tracks behind the target...

 

 

Pierre

 

Hi

Mark the target with laser (NWS button) before set it as SPI.

[mjeh]

Hi

Mark the target with laser (NWS button) before set it as SPI.

 

This. You can verify that your laser is firing by observing the flashing 'L' both on your HUD and on the TGP display. Keep lasing till you've set your SPI

 

The laser will only fire if you have a clear point track, as indicated by it saying 'Point' and not 'inr-p' which means it can't track but remembers the location from earlier track or some such.

[Cookie]

I think I understand the difference between area and point track mode, but what I don't understand is in what cases is area mode used? Am I right to think that for my containers and trucks point track mode is the best?

Use point for everything that moves and area for everything that doesn´t. Simple as that.

 

And does the little M stand for? Is it for "masked". If I am right, why is it masked when I can clearly see the target on the TGP?

The laser does not know what kind of loadout you carry, and therefore always assumes it is the biggest and bulkiest loadout possible. That leads to situations like you describe: You have line of sight to the target, but the laser thinks it is blocked by some ordnance. Also there is some safety margin wrapped around the fuselage itself so you don´t fire the laser into your own aircraft.

[mjeh]

Use point for everything that moves and area for everything that doesn´t. Simple as that.

 

To my understanding, Point tracking will try to automatically lock itself on target signatures, whereas Area won't. So use Area for slewing and Point when you want to lock on to something

[Dejjvid]

I never shoot the laser when i set a SPI. Until i get some evidence that it affects your SPI, i call it a hoax.

 

Ontopic:

 

As Cookie stated, ONLY use point mode for MOVING targets. And area for everything that's stationary.

[SmokeyTheLung]

I never shoot the laser when i set a SPI. Until i get some evidence that it affects your SPI, i call it a hoax

 

Try flying at about 200 ft AGL with a tall building on your nose...point the TGP at the the building hit active pause and look over to your TAD. Note where the diamond or SPI symbol is located on the ground and fire your laser... You can't miss the affect.

 

However, the distance will only be accurate with the laser firing. So it's usefulness is somewhat limited to creating accurate mark points

[PFunk1606688187]

However, the distance will only be accurate with the laser firing. So it's usefulness is somewhat limited to creating accurate mark points

 

I'd say distance is pretty critical for putting ordnance on a target. Accurate or inaccurate mark points are only evident when you roll in on a target from a different angle than where you placed the mark point. The more accurate the fix the more accuracte the mark and the less work you have to do in figuring out where to put the pipper.

 

Approaching a target from a higher angle off the ground though (think overhead instead of low-alt head on) and then making the mark point makes it more accurate again because the line the TGP is drawing goes through the target and hits a point on the ground closer to the target than if at a radical slant angle. Using the laser helps though because it stops that imaginary line at wherever the laser detects the target, thus making for a more accurate mark point.

 

Laser has a maximum range though, and I cannot remember it. I just try and use it under 10 to 15nm and/or as close as I feel comfortable getting before the attack.

 

As for the masking and still seeing the target...

 

(from a Litening 3 I think but same thing for this)

 

 

At long ranges the difference in the positioning of the cameras doesn't make a huge amount of difference, but up close its actually easy to see how a laser could be bocked but the FLIR could still see the target.

[luza]

there is no reason for using the laser while making TGP SPI. The only time you'd want to fire laser outside of LGB. Is in my experience if your creating accurate markpoints with your TGP.

[Pochi]

Thank you for your answers all!

It will help me a lot.I will some training and come back here if there are still some dark area that I need to understand :)

 

Best regards,

 

Pierre

[shagrat]

two additions: the easiest way to use the blinking M is as an indicator for "careful you're going masked in a second if you not alter course or bank angle".

Look at the little white dot on the TGP screen it shows the direction the TGP is looking. For details look up the TGP section in the flight manual. Look for "situational awareness cue" around page 334 in the manual (using an older printed manual as reference, so page no. maybe inaccurate).

 

Second, it usually is a very good idea to lase the point/target you are going to track, before you set it SPI. Here you can see why:

 

The "point" you track comes from the DTS database and the computer doesn't know about any obstacle like trucks or tanks unless you lase them. It tracks a point slightly behind the target if not updated by the laser range. :thumbup:

Edited November 22, 2012 by shagrat