Multiplayer Server Creation is Full of Fail

[Pman]

And pman, I reject your assertion that the user should be responsible for dicking with firewall and router settings. Those are things that the user should never have to mess with just to get a multiplayer game going with a friend. And btw, that stuff does not fall into the simple category. No chance in heck my mom could ever forward a port. If my mom can't do it, it's not simple.

 

This just goes to prove that you havent been around PC online gaming for long then :megalol:

 

You can reject it as much as you like, really makes no difference. You want to get it working then configure your firewall correctly. Believe it or not yes it really is quite simple, as for your Mum I have no idea of her skill level with IT so it would be impossible to say, My Mother and Father are both capable of following simple instructions so I have no doubt they could do it

 

Not too mention that if every program that installed on my PC changed my firewall settings it wouldnt be very secure now would it?

 

Really think about what you say before you say it

[flybynoob]

I can see you know ...

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzP-_5SYzsY

[flybynoob]

On a helpful note (for now).

 

Due to the need for increased security by default most routers / firewalls etc will allow outgoing connections

but stop incoming connections unless its return traffic originating from your internal network.

 

As you want to setup a server and ask your friends to connect to you then you are asking for your router to operate

outside its default setup. So all you need to do is setup your router to forward the DCS traffic to your computer

hosting the server.

 

Now I understand that for the less computer literate people this is a pain, however if there was a way the software

could do this automatically for you then this could be used by "others" to access your computer, bank information

or collection of midget porn.

 

What model of router are you using ?

Edited April 10, 2013 by flybynoob

[TraxusIV]

@Pman: Ok, credentials, since we seem to be playing that juvenile game now: I am a physicist, and I program actively in 3 languages and am familiar with 8 or 9 more. I have been playing multiplayer games since before the internet was a thing (dialup bbs for the win). While I am not well versed in network coding, I do have a brain and am capable of comparing how DCS does networking, from the USER'S perspective, to how other games do it.

 

The fact that in most cases forwarding ports and setting up firewall exceptions takes only 10 minutes or so is beside the point. It is something that is not a standard user level action and therefore should not be required of a user unless absolutely necessary. The fact that there are so many games which do not require the user to do it proves it is not essential for it to be done by the user.

 

You claim that there are many other games that require messing with router and firewall configuration, and that it is a perfectly normal thing. I'm calling you on that. Provide a list. Going through my list of Steam and non-steam games, I cannot find a single one which has ever required me to mess with router and firewall settings, excepting DCS. Hell, even setting up a MINECRAFT server doesn't require me to mess with them, and that is far from being a class A title. Provide me an example or two of professionally made games that require messing with those settings just to get a multiplayer game going.

 

And now you're using the MEGALOL smilie to convey that you are laughing at me, and you think you are aren't being rude? Ad hominem attacks, constant insults, and you think you are not being rude? Yes, YOU are the only one in the thread to call me rude and arrogant, but even if you weren't, two people calling the sky orange doesn't make it so. Stop with the self promotion and aggrandizement. I didn't start this thread so you could stroke your epeen in front of everyone and talk about how popular your server is, or how your mom and dad are cooler than my mom and dad. I started it so that attention can be brought to the fact that ED is selling a product which has a rather glaring deficiency, in the hopes that it might be corrected. The fact that it's based on old code is NOT an exoneration of it, but further incrimination. Unless you wish to posit that old code is somehow magically superior to newer developments.

 

So stop trying to hijack this thread to show off and stroke your ego. Quit insulting and belittling me, and quit trolling.

Edited April 10, 2013 by TraxusIV

[TraxusIV]

@flybynoob lulz (re the video).

 

@Zaelu Tested with canyouseeme.org, and it sees the service on port 10308.

Edited April 10, 2013 by TraxusIV

[flybynoob]

The fact that there are so many games which do not require the user to do it proves it is not essential for it to be done by the user.

 

Most game you are connecting to are external hosting "server".

 

You want to host your own server so you will need to allow the traffic in which is something

all routers / firewalls block by default.

 

If this is a pain then connect to an existing DCS Server and don't need to do anything.

 

If you want to host your own server then you will have to follow the rules than have been in place since January 1st 1983 when the internet

changed over from ARPANET to TCP/IP and open the ports.

 

If you give me your model of router I will help you as I am fluent in 19 different protocols :p but if you don't want any help then maybe you should relax.

[Pman]

@Pman: Ok, credentials, since we seem to be playing that juvenile game now: I am a physicist, ...

 

Ah things make sense now

 

The fact that in most cases forwarding ports and setting up firewall exceptions takes only 10 minutes or so is beside the point. It is something that is not a standard user level action and therefore should not be required of a user unless absolutely necessary. The fact that there are so many games which do not require the user to do it proves it is not essential for it to be done by the user.

 

Its not essential but depending on hardware that is used it may be essential, it depends on the users gear...why is this so hard for you to comprehend?

 

You claim that there are many other games that require messing with router and firewall configuration, and that it is a perfectly normal thing. I'm calling you on that. Provide a list. Going through my list of Steam and non-steam games, I cannot find a single one which has ever required me to mess with router and firewall settings, excepting DCS. Hell, even setting up a MINECRAFT server doesn't require me to mess with them, and that is far from being a class A title. Provide me an example or two of professionally made games that require messing with those settings just to get a multiplayer game going.

 

Ok, how about the Playstation 3? or the Xbox 360 which do not work correctly hosting games without ports being setup correctly? How do I know this Because I have had to do it myself....

 

Games, What about Company of Heroes? Ventrilo and Teamspeak all require ports to be forwarded to work correctly. What about Dawn of War? How about Combat Flight Sim 3 or White cliffs of Dover? SplinterCell needed ports to be forwarded if you used Netgear stuff. Hell for a while when World of Warcraft changed its updating methods people had to muck about with ports to get it working properly as they changed to P2P distribution. Need I go on?

 

Nah? didnt think so

 

Port forwarding is a device specific implementation, just because you dont understand it doesnt mean its wrong...

And now you're using the MEGALOL smilie to convey that you are laughing at me, and you think you are aren't being rude? Ad hominem attacks, constant insults, and you think you are not being rude? Yes, YOU are the only one in the thread to call me rude and arrogant, but even if you weren't, two people calling the sky orange doesn't make it so. Stop with the self promotion and aggrandizement. I didn't start this thread so you could stroke your epeen in front of everyone and talk about how popular your server is, or how your mom and dad are cooler than my mom and dad. I started it so that attention can be brought to the fact that ED is selling a product which has a rather glaring deficiency, in the hopes that it might be corrected. The fact that it's based on old code is NOT an exoneration of it, but further incrimination. Unless you wish to posit that old code is somehow magically superior to newer developments.

 

I have no requirement or desire for your approval, my point in posting in the first place was quite simply to point out that ranting about a sim that works fine because you lack the expertise to get it working just shows a load about your character and technical ability rather than anything else. If you had been a polite and civil person we could have solved this for you but tbh sounds like you need a life lesson that not everything is handed to you.

 

 

Oh and as for the my Mum your Mum thing, I think you started that with saying that your Mum couldnt change a port...

 

 

See above for responses, but tbh you should just take flybyn00bs help, thank him and be thankful that someone wants to help you

Edited April 10, 2013 by Pman

[TraxusIV]

Most game you are connecting to are external hosting "server".

 

You want to host your own server so you will need to allow the traffic in which is something

all routers / firewalls block by default.

 

If this is a pain then connect to an existing DCS Server and don't need to do anything.

 

If you want to host your own server then you will have to follow the rules than have been in place since January 1st 1983 when the internet

changed over from ARPANET to TCP/IP and open the ports.

 

If you give me your model of router I will help you as I am fluent in 19 different protocols :p but if you don't want any help then maybe you should relax.

 

The fact that most games have you connect to external servers is well understood. Let's look at one specific example, since a single counter example will disprove the hypothesis that this port forwarding nonsense must be handled by the user. The example is ArmA 3. You can host a game where clients connect to your computer, and you run custom missions. This is done without the host having to change any firewall or router settings. Counter example provided, assertion disproven. There are other examples, but we only need the one. It CAN be done without the user having to muck with things. I assert that it therefore SHOULD be done.

[flybynoob]

A neutron walked into a bar and asked, "How much for a drink?" The bartender replied, "For you, no charge."

[chromium]

A neutron walked into a bar and asked, "How much for a drink?" The bartender replied, "For you, no charge."

 

:megalol:

 

I understand that there's no asking for solution, so... I'm out :)

[Frostie]

The issue is not connecting to a host but being the host. Let me clarify that my goal here is not to obtain assistance in troubleshooting the problems we are experiencing, but to highlight the need for changes to the game to make hosting a game more simple and reliable. Perhaps I'm mistaken, but i believe that ED does monitor these forums, and my hope is that they will take note of the issue and address it. Of course, if we get the problem solved in the process, that's a nice side effect.

 

Side note: pman, you do realize that you are the one who is being insulting and rude here, right? You are personally attacking me without knowing anything about me or my knowledge base. I am simply attacking deficiencies that I see in the software. Unless you are the guy who wrote that code, I don't see how you have any grounds for getting pissy at me. If you ARE the guy who wrote that code, then I understand your offense, but it still stands that the MP hosting capability is SUBSTANDARD.

 

The problem here is that people are having difficulty in believing there is an issue with the software because as it stands the majority of people that have issues hosting are making basic errors such as not forwarding the port they are using, giving out their router network ip instead of their actual ip etc.

 

I installed DCS:World and hosted immediately without a problem, I didin't tweak anything and have had no problem nor know of any problem from a gazzilion other users i've come across. The only reason someone has not been able to host is because of Firewall issues and like it or not this is true of a lot of games/sims.

 

Regarding portforward, like most manuals you wll come across the required ports that need forwarding, if your mum read the manual she'd know that and with a simple google check, even my Gran could do that.

 

DCS MANUAL EXCERPT :

Port. Each server can be assigned a unique port by entering it here. By default, the port number is 10308. However, in order to access the server behind a firewall, you may need to change this port number or open the default port number in the firewall.

 

Are you sure you're following this process:

First of all make sure you both run the same version of DCS.

Find your IP address here http://www.whatsmyip.org/

 

start game with Multiplayer shortcut>

When in the lobby make sure both you and your friend have set 'Internet source' on 'Internet'

to Host hit 'New Server'>

server options:

'server type' = Internet>

'interface' = this is your router network not your IP>

'Port' = 10308 is default>>

select a mission.

hit 'Start'

Then tell your friend to 'connect by IP' give him the IP from the site with :10308 on the end eg. xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx:10308

[flybynoob]

The example is ArmA 3. You can host a game where clients connect to your computer, and you run custom missions. This is done without the host having to change any firewall or router settings. Counter example provided, assertion disproven.

 

Because you are using a 3rd party for the NAT transferral.

 

I offered to help as I do "firewalls " all day and every day but I'm begining to think that you just want to argue ?

 

Now you seem intelligent enough not to argue about firewalls will a full time firewall enginner ?

 

http://community.bistudio.com/wiki/ArmA:_Dedicated_Server

 

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?147537-Tutorial-How-to-run-ArmA3-server-on-a-dedicated-server

 

Firewall issues

 

By default the Arma 3 server is reporting to Gamespy and it also uses the Gamespy server to negotiate a NAT traversal. If this does not work reliably for you (e.g. when running behind very strict firewall), you may need to open and/or forward following incoming ports:

port UDP (used for game)port+1 UDP (used for server reporting)port+3 UDP (used for VoN transmissions)Following outgoing ports need to be open as well:

port UDP (used for game)port+3 UDP (used for VoN transmissions)Default value of port is 2302, but you may change it by -port command line argument.

 

 

 

Counter example provided, you now look silly :P

Edited April 10, 2013 by flybynoob

[Pman]

Because you are using a 3rd party for the NAT transferral.

 

I offered to help as I do "firewalls " all day and every day but I begining to this

you just want to argue ?

 

Now you seem intelligent enough not to argue about firewalls will a full time firewall enginner ?

 

http://community.bistudio.com/wiki/ArmA:_Dedicated_Server

 

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?147537-Tutorial-How-to-run-ArmA3-server-on-a-dedicated-server

 

Firewall issues

 

By default the Arma 3 server is reporting to Gamespy and it also uses the Gamespy server to negotiate a NAT traversal. If this does not work reliably for you (e.g. when running behind very strict firewall), you may need to open and/or forward following incoming ports:

port UDP (used for game)port+1 UDP (used for server reporting)port+3 UDP (used for VoN transmissions)Following outgoing ports need to be open as well:

port UDP (used for game)port+3 UDP (used for VoN transmissions)Default value of port is 2302, but you may change it by -port command line argument.

 

 

 

Counter example provided, you know look silly :P

 

This just goes to show you that 99.9% of games at points require port forwarding. It just so happens that Arma3 uses Gamespy and handles it for you

 

Tbh you should just stop playing with things you dont understand or are not willing to understand, I am sure Arma 3 will welcome you back with kitten gloved hands.

 

Pman

[flybynoob]

Now we could go into a real nightmare situation where you are trying to

Double Nat .... but I think this would be lost in translation ...

 

 

(Networking Joke)

[KombatMilc]

And your server is visible outside the network?

 

After you start the server and you are in mission did you alt-tabed and go to "canyouseeme.org" and see if your server on the specified port is visible? cause if it's not... then...

 

Sometimes you need to press "newsearch" for a refresh. Also direct IP should work without server being visible in server browser but only if the port has been forwarded. AFAIK DCS does not uses UPnP so it will not open automatically the port for you in router.

 

canyouseeme.org cannot see port 10308 when the server is running. I am using a Linksys WRT110 router. Port 10308 is forwarded to my PC for both TCP and UDP.

[KombatMilc]

I tried disabling the routers SPI firewall, but it did not work

[TraxusIV]

Flybynoob, Since you're asking so persistently, my router is an Apple Airport Extreme. I use the provided AirPort Utility to set up port forwarding.

[c0ff]

Flybynoob, Since you're asking so persistently, my router is an Apple Airport Extreme. I use the provided AirPort Utility to set up port forwarding.

 

Support for automatic port forwarding with NAT-PMP is planned for the near future.

Currently, only UPNP is supported.

[ENO]

Didn't figure this one would get solved ironically... but there you go.

[flybynoob]

it has nothing to do with being persistent .. I was trying to help you out but to be honest I'm going to pass.

 

Q: How many physicists does it take to setup a DCS server ?

[TraxusIV]

Support for automatic port forwarding with NAT-PMP is planned for the near future.

Currently, only UPNP is supported.

 

Cool. :)

[TraxusIV]

it has nothing to do with being persistent .. I was trying to help you out but to be honest I'm going to pass.

 

Q: How many physicists does it take to setup a DCS server ?

 

18. One to set up the server and 17 to coauthor and peer review the paper about it.

[flybynoob]

:)

[SkateZilla]

did you guys ever fix your connection issues?

 

Other than Entering Ports into router and trying to connect, did you run any Port Checker software to confirm the port is open, that seems to be a very wide spread issue, the router didnt hold the settings, or the users connect with the router Assigning them a Dynamic IP, from the DHCP.

 

For Best Results, Set the Router to Assign the MAC Addresses of your PC's a Static IP.

Dynamic IPs from the DHCP change everytime the router reboots, the PC reboots, or the lease time for the IP Expires.

[KombatMilc]

did you guys ever fix your connection issues?

 

Other than Entering Ports into router and trying to connect, did you run any Port Checker software to confirm the port is open, that seems to be a very wide spread issue, the router didnt hold the settings, or the users connect with the router Assigning them a Dynamic IP, from the DHCP.

 

For Best Results, Set the Router to Assign the MAC Addresses of your PC's a Static IP.

Dynamic IPs from the DHCP change everytime the router reboots, the PC reboots, or the lease time for the IP Expires.

 

Traxus was able to get his end working correctly, but I still can't.

I already have a static IP (both set up in the DHCP reservation list and my computer) and port 10308 forwarded to my computer for both UDP and TCP. canyouseeme.org reports that it can't see the server for DCS on 10308. Yes, I did have the server running when I tested it. I tried disabling my routers SPI firewall, but no joy.