Aapje

Is there a list or such of the changes they made? Did they replace the cap that so many people complained about?

They are not really that silent, since they tell us what they are working on, at least with regards to new products. They then just take ages to design those products and make them manufacturable.

Just be aware that if you do or have done the pre-order, you are probably signing on for a fairly long period of dealing with missing functionality, bugs, etc. I'm fine with people going into this with two eyes wide open, but some just seem impatient and expect everything to work right away, which seems unrealistic to me.

I haven't seen any news about the electronic detents or rail versions. And with VKB, I wouldn't hold your breath.

It's really simple if you the only heavy thing you do with the computer is game: 7800X3D.

They have to spend time working with the reviewers (answering their questions, giving them new software releases, etc), so it's understandable that they want to limit the pool. According to the shipping date they gave, they should start delivering units pretty much now. But judging by the early pre-reviews, I expect them to either delay it or deliver it with software that is way behind the Rhino. Or most likely, both. Anyway, I look forward to seeing the 5 stages of grief among the early adopters, and then hopefully, they will improve the software relatively quickly (but I think that 6 months is optimistic to get at the level of the Rhino software). PS. Moza seems to not have made the reviewers sign a review embargo, which is really quite unprofessional and not very smart. You'd think that they would know better than that.

Oh, I misread the manual. In that case, it's most likely a hardware issue where they don't pass through all the signals.

The Rhino has the same issue. It's an issue caused by Virpil, not something that the bases seem to be able to solve. The best solution may be to use VKB's Modern Combat Grip Pro, with the passthrough adapter made by VPForce. Then you are guaranteed to have full grip functionality.

You may be very lucky with top tier silicon, that can take the high voltages, or you may have damage that is not yet critical. But we know that a proper fix is not yet out.

@Wolfhound Neither, get the 7800X3D. The 14900KF is absurdly expensive & power hungry & kills itself. The 7950X3D is intended for people who both game and use heavy productivity software. For gaming, all those cores are not only not needed, but the extra chiplet can cause performance issues. So you are paying more, just to get potential problems in games.

16:9 is widescreen compared to screen sizes of the past, but they went further than that, so that is called ultrawide. And I would indeed get a 16:9 screen. And DCS is very VRAM demanding, which is why I think that the 7800 XT, 7900 GRE or 7900 XT are better than the Nvidia options at those price levels. Nvidia is very stingy with VRAM. You can also go for a 4080 Super or 4090, but that is going to be a lot more expensive. I would not spend more just to be VR ready, unless you think that you will go for VR relatively soon.

@François That is the best gaming processor right now. But you should get a single 2 x 32 Go kit of memory. Putting 4 DIMMs in a system is suboptimal.

@Panzerlang Perhaps you should sell it to a virtual helicopter pilot. Apparently, it's reasonably usable for that use case.

I'd personally opt for air cooling with a 7800X3D. It doesn't use that much power and air cooling is more reliable, durable and less risky. The Thermalright Peerless Assassin 120 SE cooler is a very good option. DCS (and MSFS) can make use of a lot of RAM. Given your level of spending, you might want to go for 64 Gb: G.Skill RipJaws S5 Low Profile 64 Go. The case you selected is more suited for silent PCs that do low intensity gaming. I'd suggest a case with better airflow, like the Corsair 4000D Airflow or Fractal Design Torrent. A single 1 Tb/To drive is very small. I'd go for at least 2 Tb. You can save quite a bit of money on the Windows key on the grey market.

That channel is reasonably good and he has experience with FFB (albeit not joysticks), so I'm happy that he got one.

That only makes sense to me if you also play vintage games. Besides, if you buy something nice and keep it long enough, it becomes vintage eventually.

@kksnowbear Fair enough. I quickly looked at eBay earlier and I wasn't that impressed, but I took another look and something like this seems OK: https://www.ebay.com/itm/266909613953 That's $220 and it should get him way over the halfway point between what he has and my 5700X3D suggestion. It has PCIe 3, but that should be OK in many cases, even with a future GPU upgrades. I am wondering why the DDR4 speed is missing. Might be some awfully slow RAM. Note that I didn't look very far, so there may be much better deals out there.

Brunner is a Swiss company that makes things by hand, not a manufacturing company. They're the kind of guys that you get bespoke or very low volume products from at an eye-watering price. But they are not competent at competing even with VPForce in manufacturing ability, let alone an actual serious manufacturing company that makes 10k-millions of products.

@propeler The lower the price for an FFB option, the more people can afford one. So there is no lower limit. Note that statements like "reasonably priced" and "dirt cheap" are not objective and for many people, $550 for a gaming peripheral is not at all dirt cheap. Of course, the above is just about the demand side. What is reasonably from a production point of view is a different question, and is in no small part dependent on the features of the desired product. As I've said before, I think that ideally, we have more advanced products at higher prices and more limited products at lower prices (like a desktop model with weak motors).

The difficulty with suggesting second hand parts is that it is hard to predict what is available locally to the person and judging how good the deal is and the condition of the parts requires more knowledge. So it requires a lot of knowledge on the part of the person who wants to upgrade to be able to do these things. And of course the risk factor is higher. And it may be hard to find a deal that matches the needs in this case, because DCS can very much use 32 GB of RAM, but second hand bundles are probably going to most often be 8 or 16 GB. And a lot of cheap second hand AM4 boards will lack PCIe4, hampering upgradability, and when a new one is only 100 bucks... Of course, but I would personally choose a solid 5700X3D build that can perform to a reasonably high level over the next 10 years, rather than get something half as good that only lasts for 5 years for $200, and then upgrade again for $200 to something similar to the 5700X3D build. Then the total spend is the same, but the guy will have a considerably slower system for those first five years, and will also have more fuss due to having to upgrade twice in that period.

@Holbeach You have an ancient platform. For example, your memory is 2 generations old. Your PCIe is 3 generations old. Doing these small upgrades where you go from being very far behind the state of the art to slightly less far behind is just going to result in small improvements at relatively high cost (and effort). My suggestion is to save a bit and then get a platform upgrade that can last you a good while. For example, an Asrock B550M Pro 4 motherboard + 5700X3D processor + 32 GB of DDR4 should run you about $400 new ($100 for the motherboard, $200 for the CPU and $100 for the RAM). The only issue is that you might need access to an old AM4-processor to flash the bios, so it supports the 5700X3D, but you can always just get one of the worst AM4 processors like a 1200 from ebay to do that, if the motherboard doesn't come with a newer BIOS. Then you have a platform that should easily last you 10 years, given how long you seem to use your hardware for. You can also go for AM5, which will cost more initially, but will presumably allow for relatively cheap upgrades in the future, and should last you longer than the AM4-platform.

@Nightdare Yeah, that one was already hugely expensive. Probably due to the long throw and all the extra material that requires. Unless they change it to lets say a linear mechanism with a belt, a FFB version would probably be at least as expensive.

Totally expected, as getting the software right is clearly quite a bit of effort (since you have to implement a telemetry-based system for a bunch of sims). It's better than the hardware being bad, since you can download new software, but not new hardware. Keep in mind that this is what you often sign up for when you (pre)order the first product of a certain kind, that a company makes. That said, I'm not yet convinced that the hardware is good for all use cases. I want a test to heat failure, people trying it out with long table clamps, etc.

You misunderstand me. I'm saying that if Winwing prices a FFB throttle within lets say 100 euro of the VPC VMAX Prime, it may be convince people who would otherwise get the most expensive throttle from Virpil.

I have no problem with that decision from a technical point of view. However, they've promised it for late 2022 and a bunch of other dates that they won't make. The lesson again is to not start tossing out dates unless there is at least a working version in the lab. Although to be fair, we didn't get a new date in this video, so perhaps they are learning.