1.2.11 SU-27 Bugs

[theropod]

uncheck swap axis and decrease the number of trimmer force to %30 on forcefeedback menu.

i have no trim issue now.

[Airway]

i wonder how much longer before the beta gets yanked away from us because of people that dont know what beta means...

 

That's why we are reporting those bugs. ED has, if I remember properly, never released such a buggy module. I am a bit surprised I mus say.

Though the Su-27 has lots of perfect and wonderful things. Sound for example is great.

The external and internal model are outstanding.

[karambiatos]

That's why we are reporting those bugs. ED has, if I remember properly, never released such a buggy module. I am a bit surprised I mus say.

Though the Su-27 has lots of perfect and wonderful things. Sound for example is great.

The external and internal model are outstanding.

 

yeah but what you did was not report a bug, what you did was whine, and make a snide remark, i remember the last time we had a bunch of those, and then we lost the wonders of weekly development news.

if you want to be helpful, make a thread reporting the bug, how to reproduce and post a track, and none of that extra stuff

[Weta43]

I noticed several issues with the Su-27 in DCS Worlds 1.2.11:

And So....

 

- Trim issues, tends to nose up all the time, not neutralizable with auto pilot.

Please check your control assignments. Nose should not rise in an uncontrolled fashion if trimmed correctly (and for others that have posted simillarly does not after they trim correctly ).

 

 

- Brake chute deployable in air

Sounds like a bug

 

 

 

- oscillating when fully loaded

Too vague to be really sure what you mean - wing rock at low speeds and high AoA ? 'Dutch roll' at speeds above Do Not Exceed speed ? A track would be useful

 

 

- backwards rolling and weird spinning with deployed brake chute and 99% thrust after full stopp (SAME FOR MiG-21bis!)

Sounds buggy

 

 

 

- Flat tire animation is bad

Is the same animation as for all other aircraft, so perhaps not what you'd like, but not a bug.

 

 

 

- MIAFM: Most incomplete advanced flight model

not a constructive comment.

 

 

Can anone confirm these bugs please?

See above.

[mvsgas]

Why is the brake chute deploying in the air a bug? Does the SU-27 have a safety feture on the drag chute? I ask because the F-117 ( the only aircraft that I have worked on with a drag chute) had no safety for the drag chute and it could be release at any speed and any altittude. If you deployed the chute out of paramteres it would damage the aircraft, but it would deploy. Within certain cross winds it would or could damage the rudders, above certain speeds it would rip appart, etc.

[ruddy122]

I don't know if this a 1.2.11 or Su-27 bug but the Localizer and Glide Slope will not activate when selecting LNDG mode.

 

I tried landing at Senaki on Runway 9 and selected landing using the 1 key and no indications for localizer and glideslope.

 

Thanks

 

Lucky

[HiJack]

ILS is broken, try Batumi.

[Beagle One]

i wonder how much longer before the beta gets yanked away from us because of people that dont know what beta means...

The main problem hereby is more that we all will be forced to use a incomplete beta very soon since the fully working sfm SU-27 will be gone forever in 5 days.

[HiJack]

You can allways force the updater to use 1.2.10 :music_whistling:

[Beagle One]

You can allways force the updater to use 1.2.10 :music_whistling:

And say bye bye to multiplayer in a game I use for that purpose solely.

[Fox One]

I noticed several issues with the Su-27 in DCS Worlds 1.2.11:

 

- Brake chute deployable in air

 

There is no mention whatsoever in flight manual for real aircraft that brake chute deployment is locked when airborne.

[*Rage*]

With the Su-27SK manual in front:

 

When flying between -2/0 G

 

Maximum time with AB ON below 15.000 meters: 3 sec.

Maximum Time with AB ON over 15.000 meters: 8 sec.

 

Maximum time without AB below 8.000 meters: 10 sec.

Maximum time without AB over 8.000 meters: 15 sec.

 

Repetition of negative G load only after 30 sec of G=1 or > 1.

 

So check your parameters doing a tail slide to know if you are flying more than this time on negative G.

 

Good info. Ill test this out later! Ive have felt that the 27 engines cut out too easily (anecdotally so far).

 

Edit: do we have similar data for the F15?

Edited November 10, 2014 by ///Rage

[Beagle One]

There is no mention whatsoever in flight manual for real aircraft that brake chute deployment is locked when airborne.

You can also deploy the brake cxhute in the two su-25 in DCS...but you simply don't do it unless on the ground at less then 300km/h. You can slso retract gear on the ground but you simply don't do it unless for a good reason. Unlike western aircraft that have everything augmented you have to use reasonig in russian aircraft, simply do not do stupid things on purpose...it will not forgive...

[*Rage*]

"Negative G flight is limited to 7 seconds at all power settings" - TO 1F-15A-1

 

Nevermind. Found the above in the F15 subforum. Time to test both!

[TaliG]

1. Airspeed acceleration - deceleration arrow on hud does not work.

 

2. Barometric and radar altitude hold mode adds opposite trim on the roll axis (FFB joystick) when you try to make a turn.

Trimer on normal flight, Route following mode and altitude + roll hold mode works fine. (i did not test the other AP modes)

 

3. Auto rudder stabilization needs a lot of tuning, especially for speeds below 400kph.

When you bank from one side to another, it always ''overcompensate''.

Even the autopilot on route mode on landing cannot cope with it and starts to heavily oscillate the nose left and right on the y axis.

It flies fine if you apply full opposite rudder (when at landing speeds).

At speeds above 600kph this behavior is unnoticed.

 

4. The flight model is heavily bugged when starting the mission from the ground (ramp start or taking off from runway)

Eg: Not possible to lift the nose on takeoff while airspeed is below 300kph less than 10% fuel onboard. Flaps up-down and or trimming makes no difference on nose lift speed.

 

BUT!!!

 

When you load the mission in the air, leave your controls untouched for 3-4 secs. Fly normal and go land.. Now try to take off... VUALA!!! nose lifts up at 250-260 max even with 90% fuel and weapons onboard!!

 

 

Overall, I am very impressed with this pfm. :joystick:

Great work ED!! :notworthy:

[aap_flanker]

Why is the brake chute deploying in the air a bug? Does the SU-27 have a safety feture on the drag chute? I ask because the F-117 ( the only aircraft that I have worked on with a drag chute) had no safety for the drag chute and it could be release at any speed and any altittude. If you deployed the chute out of paramteres it would damage the aircraft, but it would deploy. Within certain cross winds it would or could damage the rudders, above certain speeds it would rip appart, etc.

 

Totally agree with that...

[mvsgas]

 

4. The flight model is heavily bugged when starting the mission from the ground (ramp start or taking off from runway)

Eg: Not possible to lift the nose on takeoff while airspeed is below 300kph less than 10% fuel onboard. Flaps up-down and or trimming makes no difference on nose lift speed.

 

BUT!!!

 

When you load the mission in the air, leave your controls untouched for 3-4 secs. Fly normal and go land.. Now try to take off... VUALA!!! nose lifts up at 250-260 max even with 90% fuel and weapons onboard!!

That is weird, could it be some thing in your controls set up? I ask because I have been mainly comparing the Open Beta with the SU-27sk manual and been doing take off at different weight and weapons loads and I have not seen this.

 

My weather was set to winter, 6C. Been mainly taking off with around 4k to 5k kg fuel load. No weapons, 2 R-73, 2 R-73 and 2 R-27. Only using Mill power (100% RPM no AB) Nose will rotate from 240 to 280 and off the ground by 290 to 310.

 

Maybe I set winds and did not noticed

[Nedum]

That is weird, could it be some thing in your controls set up? I ask because I have been mainly comparing the Open Beta with the SU-27sk manual and been doing take off at different weight and weapons loads and I have not seen this.

 

My weather was set to winter, 6C. Been mainly taking off with around 4k to 5k kg fuel load. No weapons, 2 R-73, 2 R-73 and 2 R-27. Only using Mill power (100% RPM no AB) Nose will rotate from 240 to 280 and off the ground by 290 to 310.

 

Maybe I set winds and did not noticed

 

No.. I have the same Problem and an autobreaking on ground.

I need more then 60% Thrustpower to roll this bird, but with this power the bird will get very fast in a few seconds.

[mvsgas]

The thing is we are obviously seeing different things and I am trying to figure if it is hardware related or the way we are setting the mission and/or the aircraft.

I took off from the runway, Winter, with an ambient temp of 6C. Fuel was 3000Kg, no gun ammo nor weapons. Nose tire off the runway at 246KPH, Main gear off at 277kph.

[Andrei]

No.. I have the same Problem and an autobreaking on ground.

I need more then 60% Thrustpower to roll this bird, but with this power the bird will get very fast in a few seconds.

 

This might be intended, according to a post of a Russian side of the forums. Below 60% your engine nozzle is fully open. Once you go past 60% nozzles will close and you will get a rapid increase of trust. Thus to taxi you should carefully play with throttle to go past 60% to accelerate to desired speed and then reduce to ~55% to coast along (you will be slowing down, however).

 

As for the FM, the other comment from the Russian side was that FM is tuned to empty aircraft without even pylons. So when you add up stuff it may not behave as you think it would. There are plenty of very good other comments on FM that explain why stuff works in this or that way, but I can't afford to translate, unfortunately.

[Nedum]

@Andrei

Thanks for the info! :thumbup:

I will give it a try.

[TaliG]

The thing is we are obviously seeing different things and I am trying to figure if it is hardware related or the way we are setting the mission and/or the aircraft.

I took off from the runway, Winter, with an ambient temp of 6C. Fuel was 3000Kg, no gun ammo nor weapons. Nose tire off the runway at 246KPH, Main gear off at 277kph.

 

take a look.

I started on air near Maykop, landed and took off again.

nothing touched on the editor just add the plane and hit fly (summer +20, 56% fuel).

 

Try to get my numbers (nose up speed 230 and take off speed 250) when you load the mission from the ground.

Not possible.

takeoff spd after landing.trk

[TaliG]

Rudders directly connected with ailerons (roll axes) bug.

 

First pass above runway, stability control (s) is on. Check rudder deflection when I roll left and right.

Second pass, stability control (s) is off. Here you can clearly see the rudders deflect left and right while i only give roll input.

rudders directly connected to ailerons.trk

Edited November 11, 2014 by TaliG

[Airway]

Rudders directly connected with ailerons (roll axes) bug.

 

First pass above runway, stability control (s) is on. Check rudder deflection when I roll left and right.

Second pass, stability control (s) is off. Here you can clearly see the rudders deflect left and right while i only give roll input.

 

I confirm.

[Airway]

And So....

 

 

Please check your control assignments. Nose should not rise in an uncontrolled fashion if trimmed correctly (and for others that have posted simillarly does not after they trim correctly ).

 

 

But it does when launched in the air for example in a quick start mission. You get surprised when launched and quickly get into hight AOA before being able to trim neutral...