Weather - again...

[Anatoli-Kagari9]

As much as I think that DCS World really needs to get better graphic identification of at least other aircraft airborne around us, I also think that the absence of a plausible weather modeling of wind variability and turbulence turns it into a much "on-rails" experience, when in fact this has, IMO, nothing to do with anything wrong regarding the flight dynamics model.

 

I believe someone once told me that in the past at least the turbulence could be much more intense, but it was tuned down by users requests. Don't know if this is the case, but even when I set it at the higher values it is still piece of cake to fly a circuit and, the aircraft are always flying across a super-smooth airmass.

 

The fact that wind is also pretty much stable / non variable, turns flying around in DCS a not to plausible "sensation of being there" in what concerns weather effects.

 

As far as I know EDGE will bring graphics only, but I wonder if anything is being considered, in the short run, for these or other weather effects ?

 

Maybe ED could at least tune up the turbulence effects again ?

[Looney]

On top of that, there is no way to tell how and if the weather changes if you're using the dynamic weather system for those that take on the ATC role.

 

I'd like to see a panel or map option to check the weather at a certain spot on the map so that, in case of dynamic weather, a controller can at least tell aircrafts what the current weather is instead of the "on-rails-doesn't change-ever" experience.

[Flamin_Squirrel]

...I also think that the absence of a plausible weather modeling of wind variability and turbulence turns it into a much "on-rails" experience, when in fact this has, IMO, nothing to do with anything wrong regarding the flight dynamics model.

 

Agreed. While the DCS flight models are excellent in isolation, there's no such thing as no weather. Wind/turbulence, especially while flaring for landing, or hovering in a helicopter, is what makes it a challenge.

 

Hopefully DCS2 will bring some improvements.

[chromium]

Don't know if this is the case, but even when I set it at the higher values it is still piece of cake to fly a circuit and, the aircraft are always flying across a super-smooth airmass.

 

This may be cause in the mission code, wind is separed as this:

 

		["wind"] = 
		{
			["at8000"] = 
			{
				["speed"] = 0,
				["dir"] = 73,
			}, -- end of ["at8000"]
			["atGround"] = 
			{
				["speed"] = 0,
				["dir"] = 106,
			}, -- end of ["atGround"]
			["at2000"] = 
			{
				["speed"] = 0,
				["dir"] = 84,
			}, -- end of ["at2000"]
		}, -- end of ["wind"]
		["turbulence"] = 
		{
[color="Red"]				["at8000"] = 0,
			["atGround"] = 5,
			["at2000"] = 0,[/color]
		}, -- end of ["turbulence"]

 

So, the value you add in the ME is for ground level. I suggest you to try to change the other 2 values as the ground one (manually by lua editing), to see if something change or not.

[Anatoli-Kagari9]

@chromium: I'll certainly give these a try. Thx!

[AtaliaA1]

As a Commander of an Air Wing. I would never send my Million Dollar Jets on a mission in turbulence that could cause 1. Mission Failure 2. Loss of Life 3. Loss of Assets. I see no sense in creating a condition that although effects air travel in general, would cause the grounding of all Fighter Jets in the vicinity of the turbulence and or weather condition.

 

While reading the multitude of Biographies available on Air Campaigns I found nothing indicating continued missions in bad conditions. Yes, there were times when while on a mission the conditions changed but that was a rarity and in some cases the conditions called for the cancelation of the Airstrikes.

 

Cloud cover alone ended missions in Vietnam, not to mention turbulence also ended missions in other campaigns. What say ye?

[chromium]

He's talking about turbolence.. not saying how strong they could be. Can't see any reference about "bad" weather about this :)

[Eddie]

As a Commander of an Air Wing. I would never send my Million Dollar Jets on a mission in turbulence that could cause 1. Mission Failure 2. Loss of Life 3. Loss of Assets. I see no sense in creating a condition that although effects air travel in general, would cause the grounding of all Fighter Jets in the vicinity of the turbulence and or weather condition.

 

While reading the multitude of Biographies available on Air Campaigns I found nothing indicating continued missions in bad conditions. Yes, there were times when while on a mission the conditions changed but that was a rarity and in some cases the conditions called for the cancelation of the Airstrikes.

 

Cloud cover alone ended missions in Vietnam, not to mention turbulence also ended missions in other campaigns. What say ye?

 

Sorry, but that is a load of ----.

 

Yes there are weather conditions that will necessitate cancellation of missions, but what those conditions are depend very much on the specific aircraft and its capabilities, and the importance of the mission in question.

 

There were cases in "Desert Storm" where F-4G weasels took off with zero visibility, that is not even being able to see the runway they were taking off from. Now that is a very extreme example granted, but it can and does happen. And similar things happen still today, regularly. Conditions that would prevent civil flying and even cancel military training operations, do not necessarily cancel combat operations.

 

That said people aren't talking about creating hurricane conditions, just some realistic and varied weather conditions. If you think military aircraft only fly in clear blue skies you are very sorely mistaken.

[SDsc0rch]

i agree there should be more transient "bumps" and turbulence - especially nearer to the ground

 

large-scale weather? that would be cool if they can pull it off - but i'm more after the overall "flying" experience than an out-and-out weax simulation

 

 

if you notice, in one of the external views in DCS the camera has a "wobble" factor - the camera "floats" around a main position - simulating the relative movement between two aircraft flying in close proximity

 

so yeah - that

[Cali]

As a Commander of an Air Wing. I would never send my Million Dollar Jets on a mission in turbulence that could cause 1. Mission Failure 2. Loss of Life 3. Loss of Assets. I see no sense in creating a condition that although effects air travel in general, would cause the grounding of all Fighter Jets in the vicinity of the turbulence and or weather condition.

 

While reading the multitude of Biographies available on Air Campaigns I found nothing indicating continued missions in bad conditions. Yes, there were times when while on a mission the conditions changed but that was a rarity and in some cases the conditions called for the cancelation of the Airstrikes.

 

Cloud cover alone ended missions in Vietnam, not to mention turbulence also ended missions in other campaigns. What say ye?

 

What books have you been reading then? I have read a few about Desert Storm and jets flew in bad weather. Some flights are cancelled, but not all of them. I suggest you you read a few more books.....maybe the right books.

[neoshi]

I would really like to fly into a thick nimbus and come out with a wet canopy while the drops stream backwards

[fltsimbuff]

As a Commander of an Air Wing. I would never send my Million Dollar Jets on a mission in turbulence that could cause 1. Mission Failure 2. Loss of Life 3. Loss of Assets. I see no sense in creating a condition that although effects air travel in general, would cause the grounding of all Fighter Jets in the vicinity of the turbulence and or weather condition.

 

While reading the multitude of Biographies available on Air Campaigns I found nothing indicating continued missions in bad conditions. Yes, there were times when while on a mission the conditions changed but that was a rarity and in some cases the conditions called for the cancellation of the Airstrikes.

 

Cloud cover alone ended missions in Vietnam, not to mention turbulence also ended missions in other campaigns. What say ye?

 

When you can just cancel or delay a trip to take out a weapons depot so you can actually see what you're bombing, or avoid needless loss of life and aircraft then sure. Modern operations tend to be able to take less risk as the skies are pretty safe and things can more or less happen on the timetable of the one with air superiority.

 

But that's not warfare in general. War involves risks and loss of life and loss of aircraft. See WWII for a good example of many many risks taken because they had to be.

 

In a future (or theoretical) war where two similarly matched forces are contesting airspace and battlespace, there will be lots risks taken and lots of loss.

 

I haven't noticed all that much turbulence myself, but it is fun to crank the wind speed at the ground up all the way as a headwind, and take off and "hover" over the airfield in an A-10C :)

[FoReIgNeR]

I agree that the weather could have a more dynamic effect on aircraft, especially for the smaller WWII birds. Even with fairly good weather you can, and will get thrown around a bit by thermals, turbulence, local pressure differentials. IMHO, this is not a 'nice to have', but should be regarded as an essential part of any proper aircraft sim.