VKB Gladiator WWII joystick

[Sokol1_br]

From Korean simmer review:

 

 

Edited July 30, 2016 by Sokol1_br

[hansangb]

Let me translate it:

Ordering process was a pain. Even though it was via Amazon Prime 2 Day shipping. I ordered end of June 2016 and it arrived July 14th.

 

I believe I'm the first in Korea to get my hands on VKB Gladiator. The first impression is that it's pretty compact. I thought that it would be bigger than Warthog HOTAS, but in reality the height is similar to T.16000M model. And the Historical KG12 Replica fits my hand perfectly. Unlike Thrustmaster, you don't have to worry about using VKB if you have smaller hands.

 

It was boxed within a box to protect the joystick during shipping.

 

2. The shape and size is similar to T.1600M. When i grabbed the VKB, my first thoughts were "it's light, it's smooth" The base of the stick is made of aluminum, and it's mated to plastic parts. I don't think you have to worry about stick becoming loose.

 

Unlike other sticks like Saitek and TM, the use of gibmal and tension systems made it hard for me to feel how much I pulled on the joystick. It supports twist rudder, and the tension is similar to T1600M. Also, the cover/bushing on the stick and the feel reminds me of using stick shift in manual transmission cars.

 

The keys on the stick are superior in feel to TM. In every aspect, the triggers/switches/hats are superior to TM1600M. And the hat is perfectly for the fingers.

 

AFter testing with Precision Tester, you can clearly see that it followed my input perfectly. This really speaks to precision machining of parts.

 

But if you are used to strong centering joysticks, you may be disappointed. The only thing I wish it had is force feedback.

 

VKB prides itself with MaRS Gimbal and quality parts. I guess time will tell if this is true or not.

 

There are 29 inputs available for mapping.

 

I enjoy propeller planes more than Jet sims, so I can't really use all the mappings. But if you fly DCS, you'll be able to hand the jets as well as prop based sims.

 

And like the real think you can flip the trigger guard, although it does prevent you from being able to reach one of the buttons.

 

Maybe the Pro version will address this?

[Sokol1_br]

And like the real think you can flip the trigger guard, although it does prevent you from being able to reach one of the buttons.

 

Well, the purpose of flip the trigger in KG12/13 is just prevent reach the fire buttons (A and B-Knopf). :D

 

"Triggerhappy" guys should not use this "safety" feature. ;)

Edited July 31, 2016 by Sokol1_br

[hansangb]

He did mention that "like the real thing"..., but I was in a hurry! :)

[Harle]

What's your native language, Sokol?

[Sokol1_br]

What's your native language, Sokol?

 

 

Portuguese - from some ex-colony. ;)

 

And my English "learning" is from Internet - why almost no one understands me. :lol:

 

 

 

AIRROW Flight Stick by Speedlink - OEM version of VKB Gladiator for Europe market:

 

 

https://www.data4u.ch/packshot/PCZ/PEX0HW73667/PEX0HW73667_1.jpg

 

http://www.speedlink.com/?p=2&cat=214&pid=39315&paus=1

 

"Budget" OEM version of VKB Gladiator - made by Asian Games - differences:

 

- Ordinary potentiometer in twist rudder axis, instead the contactless sensor used in Gladiator (In AIRROW X,Y axis the contactless sensor is used).

 

- No input/support for T-Rudder or other VKB future controllers (throttle, button panels).

 

- Simplified firmware without support for load custom profiles.

 

Pre-order in one Eurore seller - it seems that these "simplifications" have not reflected in the price...

 

https://www.exlibris.ch/fr/jeux/pc/accessoires/speedlink-airrow-flightstick-black/id/4027301432244

 

Same version - maybe under other hardware distributor brand - is to be sold in Asia and American Latin markets.

Edited August 1, 2016 by Sokol1_br

[SpeedStick]

I'm not sure. So what gimbal would that thing be using?

[Sokol1_br]

Gladiator non PRO version use the classic one spring per axis pincer system gimbal with separate movement for X, Y axis (like CH, Cougar, R/C transmitter gimbal) made in fiber reinforced plastic:

 

upload picture

 

http://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_07_2016/post-102799-0-45465700-1469539133.jpg

 

Gladiator PRO use VKB "Nex-Gen" all metal, bearings, CAM gimbal - what add ~160$ in price.

 

http://www.gostratojet.com/Marketing/Gimbal_Final_1.jpg

Edited August 1, 2016 by Sokol1_br

[Bourrinopathe]

Simplified firmware without support for load custom profiles.

 

Imo, that's really the weakest point compared to the Gladiator. The programming capabilities of the NJoy32 controller are a great strength.

A very simple example: without the ability to assign the pinky button as a simple button (instead of the default modifier), I wouldn't be able to use the Gladiator with Elite Dangerous, as I use the pinky as a common modifier for my throttle and the stick itself.

 

I'm not even mentioning how crazy you can go with the configs without having to keep a software in the background.

 

One thing I'd like to see with the Gladiator (and the NJoy32) is the ability to modify an axis to a virtual axis in combination with a modifier button (to multiply the available axes for the WW2 birds (mixture/propeller/…)).

In the meantime, you can manage these settings with a combination of buttons +/-.

That flexibility is lost with the European Gladiator derivative.

 

Russia is not that far from Europe after all. I'd know where to order and who I could support with my money ;)

[Sokol1_br]

Imo, that's really the weakest point compared to the Gladiator. The programming capabilities of the NJoy32 controller are a great strength.

 

Thing is less options means less post sales support for that generic brands.

 

One thing I'd like to see with the Gladiator (and the NJoy32) is the ability to modify an axis to a virtual axis in combination with a modifier button (to multiply the available axes for the WW2 birds (mixture/propeller/…)).

 

I test someone profile posted in IL-2 forum for T-Rudder with similar feature, the rudder axis creating virtual axis for brakes.

 

But this idea to make multiple use of axis through a modifier is not very practical - you can test this in CloD and DCS - because the axis dont' remember the lever last position and this result in jumps when switch between axis functions.

Edited August 1, 2016 by Sokol1_br

[Sokol1_br]

This is just a test of the idea... for the sake of the idea. :)

Not for a "new product".

 

http://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_07_2016/post-6112-0-96691800-1469913215.jpg

[Bourrinopathe]

But this idea to make multiple use of axis through a modifier is not very practical - you can test this in CloD and DCS - because the axis dont' remember the lever last position and this result in jumps when switch between axis functions.

 

Indeed. That's not ideal and I already tested combined commands in the Su-27 using an axis and an encoder at the same time - same for the HDD. A bit jumpy but I'd be curious to see if it could be interesting in the WW2 aircraft without launching the pistons into orbit.

 

Could you please link that profile for the T-Rudder?

[Bourrinopathe]

>>> A few pictures of the Gladiator Pro insides (from the Il-2 forums) <<<

 

[Sokol1_br]

Could you please link that profile for the T-Rudder?

 

Think is in one of this topics:

 

http://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/topic/3451-obzor-pedalej-t-rudder-mkiii-na-mudspike/#entry338155

http://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/topic/2030-t-rudder-ot-vkb/page-14#entry289859

Edited August 4, 2016 by Sokol1_br

[SpeedStick]

F*ck me I'd give anything for a Gladiator Pro, my warthog has been dead for a couple of weeks now. There really doesn't seem to be a replacement for the warthog at this very point in time. And Im not buying another stick with crappy gimbal & electronics.

Edit: or Cobra or whatever.

Edited August 4, 2016 by SpeedStick

[rrohde]

Think is in one of this topics:

 

http://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/topic/3451-obzor-pedalej-t-rudder-mkiii-na-mudspike/#entry338155

http://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/topic/2030-t-rudder-ot-vkb/page-14#entry289859

 

Doesn't the VKB T-Link software do this already?

[Sokol1_br]

Do in different way, make a button press in joystick/throttle move two virtual axis simultaneous - if rudder pedal are centralized.

 

In practice I don't notice difference between any of 3 methods, axis to buttons, axis to virtual axis, button to virtual axis.

 

T-Link (or WIZZO) don't offer better solution, only easiness for guys that became scared with programs with more than two options. :)

Edited August 4, 2016 by Sokol1_br

[rrohde]

Good to know, Sokol!

 

I only wish that the T-Link software would allow me to change the speed of the virtual axes; I think they're to fast... Do you know if that is possible?

[Sokol1_br]

Dont know, but don't looks possible, probable the response is hardcoded in T-Link.exe

 

T-Link .INI only add info for joystick ID and joystick buttons assigned for Brake and ACCU.

Edited August 6, 2016 by Sokol1_br

[Bourrinopathe]

Thanks for the links Sokol1!

 

I'll try to find some time next week to test this. There's also something I'd like to try but I'm pretty sure that's not possible (otherwise it would have already been done).

[Sokol1_br]

Gladiator "MOD".

 

Replacing the top button with mini-stick+press button. The mini-stick is configured as 8 way HAT in VKB Config software.

 

 

http://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_08_2016/post-12483-0-44490500-1471700386.jpg

http://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/topic/4607-gladiator-v-voprosah-i-otvetah/page-3#entry439958

 

The mini-stick axis is connected in place of twist rudder axis, running trough SYS connector to NJoy32 in external throttle.

 

Gladiator "Bicycle brake" - HALL sensor.

 

http://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/topic/4718-modern-talking-gladiator/

Edited August 22, 2016 by Sokol1_br

[Kailorn]

The Gladiator Pro is finally available at VKB FSC Europe :)

[Sokol1_br]

Gladiator PRO CAM, springs exchange.

 

[Neurowork]

Well I got a gladiator pro on the way with the Warthog adapter.

Should arrive by the end of the week.

 

I probably should have waited for the Gunfighter but I was dying to replace my Warthog gimbals with something better. Tried to grease it and everything but well, that strong center position is just a pain in the ...

 

When Edward from VKB Europe told me they had a couple warthog adapter in stock I jumped the gun.

 

My original plan was to retrofit the gimbal system inside the warthog stick base. It looks like the diameter of the gladiator stick base is about the same as top ring of the warthog base. Or I figured could build a custom base using a PVC 10mm tube and 2 steel 10mm discs to mimic the warthog base.

 

Now that I see the size of the electronics, there's not way it's going to fit. Plus, I don't really care about the outer buttons and axies the Gladiator has on its base. So... yeah, I probably should have waited for for the Gunfighter but Edward told me that it would most likely have the same gimbal system but it could be a year before it is available for order.

 

I gotta figure something out. It might be better just to dump the internal electronics and go the Arduino way. We'll see. Or, since My warthog stick and throttles are mounted onto the base of my chair, I could probably could route a pocket into the wood and hide the electronics underneath the stick mount.

 

Anybody's ever got the same idea ?

[Sokol1_br]

Will be more easy you make a new metal case, laser cut steel, aluminun... for Gladiator gimbal and electronics and use Warthog grip and extension.

 

Similar what Baur do.

 

http://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_08_2016/post-842-0-36115000-1472574258.jpg

 

 

http://avia-sim.ru/forum/download/file.php?id=7595

http://avia-sim.ru/forum/download/file.php?id=7596

http://avia-sim.ru/forum/download/file.php?id=7597

http://avia-sim.ru/forum/download/file.php?id=7598

 

And with some DIY can add extension wires for Njoy32 controller plugs for use the base buttons remote, to don't leave then 'buried". :)

Edited August 30, 2016 by Sokol1_br