skendzie Posted February 15, 2015 Posted February 15, 2015 Some basic questions ahead. What SAMs use radar? What SAMs use heat seeking missiles? I want to use my L-081 Fantasmagoria pod with anti-radiation missiles. I set up a few SAMs, about ten different types, and I don't get a radar signature from any of them. If there's no radar tower, these SAMs don't use radar maybe?? Also, with AAA like the Shilka, do they use radar? Can they be assisted by radar? Thanks so much in advance!
Exorcet Posted February 15, 2015 Posted February 15, 2015 The encyclopedia is hit and miss with what info it has. Wikipedia is honestly a better quick reference a lot of the time. I don't fly the Su-25T often, but some of the radar guided SAM's have fairly short range which is why they might not be appearing for you. The large, long range SAM's are usually multiple component. If you don't place their radar unit, they won't emit a radar signal (and also won't be able to fire missiles). If you want to make sure you're setting things up properly, place SA-10 or Patriot missile batteries on the map. The template feature in the ME has aa fully set up SA-10 site in the default list, so if you don't know how to properly set a SAM site you can use that. Awaiting: DCS F-15C Win 10 i5-9600KF 4.6 GHz 64 GB RAM RTX2080Ti 11GB -- Win 7 64 i5-6600K 3.6 GHz 32 GB RAM GTX970 4GB -- A-10C, F-5E, Su-27, F-15C, F-14B, F-16C missions in User Files
tobalt Posted February 15, 2015 Posted February 15, 2015 (edited) IR SAMs (minus MANPADS like SA-18 or Stinger) --------------------------------------------------------- SA-9 SA-13 Radar SAMs --------------------------------------------------------- SA-3 SA-6 SA-8 SA-10 SA-11 SA-15 SA-19 The SA-8, SA-11 and SA-15 and SA-19 are all self contained SAMs, as in the one unit has both the radar and missiles. All the others are multi-component, so the radars and missile launchers are separate (if you want to use them in a mission you have to add both the radar and the missile vehicles to the same unit). The Shilka does use radar for assistance in target acquisition and engagement, but only normally activates the radar when the target is within range and below 7-8k ft in altitude. Edited February 15, 2015 by tobalt
Gloom Demon Posted February 15, 2015 Posted February 15, 2015 skendzie Did you make the SAMs belong to the opposing coalition? AMD Ryzen 3600, Biostar Racing B850GT3, AMD Rx 580 8Gb, 16384 DDR4 2900, Hitachi 7K3000 2Tb, Samsung SM961 256Gb SSD, Thrustmaster T.Flight HOTAS X, Samsung S24F350 24'
Nerdwing Posted February 15, 2015 Posted February 15, 2015 With regards to SAM's, namely IR SAM's, have any issues been noted regarding the altitude at which they engage their targets? I'm taking shots well above the stated ceiling for many of the systems, and looking at the game files alot of them dont seem to have their maximum altitude stated. Are they just outright using their horizontal range in a straight line, and shooting at the target? If so, doesnt this lead to some very-exaggerated ceilings for MANPADS in particular?
PFunk1606688187 Posted February 15, 2015 Posted February 15, 2015 (edited) Just so you guys know, as far as I know in DCS, the SA-19 doesn't use radar to guide the missile. As a result none of your countermeasures will do jack. The only solution to a missile launch against you in that case is purely kinematic. EDIT. That reads wrong. The radar is used to guide the missile itself, but is sending commands based on an optical tracking sight. SACLOS. Edited February 15, 2015 by P*Funk Warning: Nothing I say is automatically correct, even if I think it is.
esb77 Posted February 15, 2015 Posted February 15, 2015 Some basic questions ahead. What SAMs use radar? What SAMs use heat seeking missiles? I want to use my L-081 Fantasmagoria pod with anti-radiation missiles. I set up a few SAMs, about ten different types, and I don't get a radar signature from any of them. If there's no radar tower, these SAMs don't use radar maybe?? Also, with AAA like the Shilka, do they use radar? Can they be assisted by radar? Thanks so much in advance! Aside from setting the SAMs to a hostile faction, you also need to make sure that you're putting in the full emplacement. Typically you have several missile launchers and 1 to 3 radar and command units. If you don't have the entire SAM battery set up properly you won't have a functioning air defense unit to practice against. Buk, Kub, Patriot, and Hawk all operate in this manner. For AAA Shilka, Vulcans, Tunguska, and Gepards all use radar, it is self contained and doesn't require other units. Roland and Osa SAMs also posses integrated radar. Also make sure you're turning your Phantasmagoria pod on, it doesn't work when it's off. If things are showing up on the RWR but not on the HUD that's the most likely cause. Callsign "Auger". It could mean to predict the future or a tool for boring large holes. I combine the two by predictably boring large holes in the ground with my plane.
escaner Posted February 16, 2015 Posted February 16, 2015 With regards to SAM's, namely IR SAM's, have any issues been noted regarding the altitude at which they engage their targets? I'm taking shots well above the stated ceiling for many of the systems, and looking at the game files alot of them dont seem to have their maximum altitude stated. Are they placed atop mountains? Obviously that extends their ceiling [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
skendzie Posted February 17, 2015 Author Posted February 17, 2015 Gurby, the Encyclopedia... tells me none of the information I was asking. You should read it sometime. Excocet, Thank you very much for that list! Exactly what I was looking for. Jeez, that makes things much more difficult in the campaign since most or SAM-9 or SAM-13 sites. I was copying the SAMs I saw in the mission. Those were the SAM-9/13s. Obviously I can't pick up IR SAMs. That was one problem. The other problem was I wasn't making full emplacements with command posts. Strangely, the last thing I messed up was (this is very dumb...) expecting to see a signature if my HUD wasn't lined up. I keep forgetting this is a sim! A 360 degree HUD would be pretty cool though :P So if a Shilka has integrated radar, I should be able to spot it with the Phantasmagoria, no? Thanks everyone for the responses!
GGTharos Posted February 17, 2015 Posted February 17, 2015 Generally speaking leave the phantasmagoria for better targets. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
Gloom Demon Posted February 17, 2015 Posted February 17, 2015 Actually, You can see 360 degrees around you with the help of the SPO-15 "Beryoza" (RWR), with the exception of some deadzones. It is quite handy. Strangely, the last thing I messed up was (this is very dumb...) expecting to see a signature if my HUD wasn't lined up. I keep forgetting this is a sim! A 360 degree HUD would be pretty cool though :P AMD Ryzen 3600, Biostar Racing B850GT3, AMD Rx 580 8Gb, 16384 DDR4 2900, Hitachi 7K3000 2Tb, Samsung SM961 256Gb SSD, Thrustmaster T.Flight HOTAS X, Samsung S24F350 24'
escaner Posted February 17, 2015 Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) IR SAMs and AAA by themselves are easy. Just stay above their ceiling of engagement. That is, about 11,000-12,000 ft above them. It will be hard to find a Shilka with Fantasmagoria because they will only activate their radar at close range. But you can locate it in your RWR. Edited February 17, 2015 by escaner [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
Mike5560 Posted February 17, 2015 Posted February 17, 2015 Shilkas in DCS won't track you until you're within 7-8 km. Kind of a waste of an anti radiation missile, you can out stick them with vikhrs or fab-250s is you attack from high enough and know when to pull off on a bad rollout.
Slipp Posted February 17, 2015 Posted February 17, 2015 Some basic questions ahead. What SAMs use radar? What SAMs use heat seeking missiles? I want to use my L-081 Fantasmagoria pod with anti-radiation missiles. I set up a few SAMs, about ten different types, and I don't get a radar signature from any of them. If there's no radar tower, these SAMs don't use radar maybe?? Also, with AAA like the Shilka, do they use radar? Can they be assisted by radar? Thanks so much in advance! You should read this awesome guide on the topic of SEAD in DCS: http://562.50megs.com/562nd/DCS%20Ironhand%20Guide.pdf It also explains, in details, pretty much every anti-air unit in the sim.
BitMaster Posted February 17, 2015 Posted February 17, 2015 Gurby,...... So if a Shilka has integrated radar, I should be able to spot it with the Phantasmagoria, no? ....... Yes, you will see the Shilka sooner or LATER ! The later you see her, the closer you are, the better chances for the Shilka to rip you in pieces. In other words, don't go hunting Radar emitting ZSU's with a kh-58 + Kh-25MPU loaded Toad !!! Those are for Vikhrs from far away, preferably Ka-50 targets but not really suited for the Toad in radar mode as you need to get VERY close to have them emit radar and be able to lock on, with Optics you can safely lock on from 8 klicks out, fire and blast it away while still outside it's range. Gigabyte Aorus X570S Master - Ryzen 5900X - Gskill 64GB 3200/CL14@3600/CL14 - Sapphire Nitro+ 7800XT - 4x Samsung 980Pro 1TB - 1x Samsung 870 Evo 1TB - 1x SanDisc 120GB SSD - Heatkiller IV - MoRa3-360LT@9x120mm Noctua F12 - Corsair AXi-1200 - TiR5-Pro - Warthog Hotas - Saitek Combat Pedals - Asus XG27ACG QHD 180Hz - Corsair K70 RGB Pro - Win11 Pro/Linux - Phanteks Evolv-X
escaner Posted February 17, 2015 Posted February 17, 2015 Here there is also a nice recopilation of basic information regarding Russian defense systems, check document 1. http://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/86362/ [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
Ian Boys Posted February 18, 2015 Posted February 18, 2015 To practice set up a mission with a Hawk SR, TR and Launcher. Your pod will see the Search Radar from a long distance and you can kill it before you come into range of the launcher quite easily if you have some altitude. It is a good way to practice.
tob.s Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 in multiplayer u could easily stay behind your allies and wait for the shilkas to activate their radar. once u got lock, switch to optical and use a vikhr from safe distance.
skendzie Posted February 24, 2015 Author Posted February 24, 2015 There was some seriously good information in this thread. I hope everyone checks it out. I have to convert that ref. sheet to Km though haha. Thanks everyone!
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