Tanker refuelling questions?

[Puma]

Does anyone find refueling easier if you pop20-40% speed brakes? I have had more luck this way. Obviously deceleration is more responsive, but I also feel like this reduces the affect of throttle changes on pitch. Thoughts?

[bunraku]

Does anyone find refueling easier if you pop20-40% speed brakes? I have had more luck this way. Obviously deceleration is more responsive, but I also feel like this reduces the affect of throttle changes on pitch. Thoughts?

 

 

I'll try that. Does anyone have recommendations of where to hold gaze on the tanker? I've been trying to get the V Fins on the boom as my fixed point, but obviously this must be a mistake as everyone says follow the plane not the boom.

[Aginor]

That's right, don't look at anything connected to the boom, look at the airplane.

Example: Keep the tanker's engines on both sides touching your canopy frame in the same spot.

 

EDIT: Like this: http://cloud-4.steamusercontent.com/ugc/630789130634789176/C25F8101FBFD3F540956D32C0FC4B6CD612CCD82/

 

The only thing interesting about the boom is its color. You should stay in the green.

 

EDIT: And btw, you can experiment with curves for the throttle axis that make the middle more sensitive, some people say it helps a lot. Haven't tried myself though.

Edited March 7, 2016 by Aginor

[bunraku]

Hi.

1 thing I struggle with is how to react when the boom operator suddenly pulls that boom up as I get into position. On a personal note it bloody annoys me as I'm pretty much nose in line with boom end and some minor movements on his part would suffice. So this sudden uplift of boom is disconcerting. Sometimes when this happens and I assume it's because I am too low or too far forward, but the boom disappears above my head out of sight. So at the moment of him doing this, do I just hang in the same position and the boom should come to pretty much the same place in relation to my plane where it was before he yanked it up or do I do something else?

[Mick F]

Line up with the tanker as in the picture posted above and you will connect. The boom will lift up as you get close and then connect like a baby with it's soother!

[Aginor]

Yeah, ignore the movement of the boom, the boom operator is drunk or high.

Just remember the position relative to the tanker.

[bunraku]

Line up with the tanker as in the picture posted above and you will connect. The boom will lift up as you get close and then connect like a baby with it's soother!

 

No picture??

[Mick F]

The one Aginor posted:

 

http://cloud-4.steamusercontent.com/...4B6CD612CCD82/

[lobo]

FWIW these are the two sight pictures I use. Default straight ahead view, TIR paused, and zoomed in slightly so canopy rails are on edge of screen. For myself it definitely makes it easier to always go in with the same sight picture, which for myself is as I've described above.

 

Note in the contact pic where the tanker engines and belly are.

[bunraku]

Thanks again everyone. What axis settings are recommended/people using on the HOTAS?

[lobo]

^ Default

[Xavven]

Thanks again everyone. What axis settings are recommended/people using on the HOTAS?

 

I have 20 curvature set.

[Scaley]

Just made this - hope it helps....

 

[Aginor]

Yesterday I had the time to fly the A-10C in my training mission again, after some weeks. I was relieved to see I can still get the tank from 50% to full while disconnecting only once (unknown reason, I was straight and in the green), although I haven't been flying much during the last month. So I guess my technique is still working. :)

 

Btw:

Do y'all prefer circular or race-track patterns for refueling?

I prefer circular ones. Racetrack patterns would be fine when they are long, but the sudden turns (even though they got improved A LOT since earlier versions of the sim) still put me off sometimes.

[probad]

boom lifting gets to you? you're still thinking in terms of the boom. stop thinking about the boom. the boom isn't even in the ideal position before it lifts -- the nozzle is retracted. just get up near it, start watching the tanker's wings or engines, and slide forward levelly into the box. you need to watch the tanker body for your own position so make sure you only monitor the colors with your peripheral vision when taking throttle cues from it!

 

if it still isn't clear, when people say look at the tanker it means everything that doesn't swing around at the back. so no, watching the vanes on the boom doesn't count as looking at the tanker.

 

about the curves: ive tried all curve schemes when learning and i got equally frustrated with all of them because the problem was me, not the joystick.

Edited March 10, 2016 by probad

[Puma]

Do y'all prefer circular or race-track patterns for refueling?

I prefer circular ones. Racetrack patterns would be fine when they are long, but the sudden turns (even though they got improved A LOT since earlier versions of the sim) still put me off sometimes.

 

I have to preface this with asking if "circular" is a real world tanker track? Ive only found documentation on a couple of the tracks using the game speak (delta and echo I think) but I dont recall either mentioning circular.

 

If there isnt a real world version then I definitely prefer race-track. Otherwise Id consider it a step towards "teleport fuel into my tank, please".

[bunraku]

Thanks for all replies and nice video Scaley. I actually passed the nighttime refuelling mission in the Maple Flag Campaign, so I am getting better. Thanks again

[Aginor]

I have to preface this with asking if "circular" is a real world tanker track? Ive only found documentation on a couple of the tracks using the game speak (delta and echo I think) but I dont recall either mentioning circular.

 

If there isnt a real world version then I definitely prefer race-track. Otherwise Id consider it a step towards "teleport fuel into my tank, please".

 

AFAIK cicular patterns were used in the past, but I am not sure if they are normally used now. The most common pattern is the race-track, but in real life tanker crews have repeatedly done unconventional things to make sure an aircraft can refuel, including circling near a CAS area and towing a plane by the boom to a near airfield.

So I guess using a circular pattern - while uncommon - may not necessarily be unrealistic.

I also met a few players who dislike the pattern because they say it is harder to refuel, while for me it is easier. That's one of the reasons I asked.

 

Perhaps one of our real life military members can explain more. :)

[Kimi_uy]

Taking advantage of the thread's name:

 

Does anybody know what's the transfer fuel flow for the A-10C and the KC-135?

Question goes for both DCS and RL (if declassified).

[Sryan]

Taking advantage of the thread's name:

 

Does anybody know what's the transfer fuel flow for the A-10C and the KC-135?

Question goes for both DCS and RL (if declassified).

 

I think it's about 48kg per second

[Sierra99]

I have to preface this with asking if "circular" is a real world tanker track? Ive only found documentation on a couple of the tracks using the game speak (delta and echo I think) but I dont recall either mentioning circular.

 

If there isnt a real world version then I definitely prefer race-track. Otherwise Id consider it a step towards "teleport fuel into my tank, please".

 

Real world tanker tracks are MOSTLY what are called "Racetracks" in DCS. However, there are numerous "Point to Point tracks in the real world as well. AR track 7BA was used for decades for training KC-135 and B-52 crews the art of Air Refueling. AR 6N was my personal favorite as it parceled the coast from south of Big sur to south of Mendocino. Occasionally we'd refuel in a constant bank circle if we were fighting for clear air away from weather. Depends on the receivers

 

AP-1B Is the source document for Air Refueling tracks over the United States. On the back cover the tracks are depicted as they are usually flown. Tracks in operational areas can either be straight lines or orbits depending on operational needs.

 

Sierra

[Sierra99]

Taking advantage of the thread's name:

 

Does anybody know what's the transfer fuel flow for the A-10C and the KC-135?

Question goes for both DCS and RL (if declassified).

 

Real Life KC-135 transfer rate is approx 6,000lbs a minute...however, most fighters are restricted to 2 pumps to prevent pressure disconnects. I'll check my books when I get home or you can check ATP-56B

 

Sierra

[Backy 51]

Many Air Refueling Tracks are linear and "long" routes of waypoints as you say. Anchor "tracks" can be rather tight oval racetracks, but not circular. The linear tracks are primarily, but not necessarily for bombers and transports. The anchor tracks are mainly for fighter refueling. I'd puke if I flew in circles constantly for 8-12 hours. :D

 

I have to preface this with asking if "circular" is a real world tanker track? Ive only found documentation on a couple of the tracks using the game speak (delta and echo I think) but I dont recall either mentioning circular.

 

If there isnt a real world version then I definitely prefer race-track. Otherwise Id consider it a step towards "teleport fuel into my tank, please".

Edited September 19, 2016 by Backy 51

[lobo]

KC-135 fuel transfer rate to A-10C with 2 pumps = 2400 PPM.

[Sierra99]

KC-135 fuel transfer rate to A-10C with 2 pumps = 2400 PPM.

 

And the AR line valve must be closed after fuel transfer is complete to prevent fuel syphoning because of deck angle.

 

(Been out of the KC-135 for 22+years...still remember the little things.)

 

Sierra