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The interesting effect of power in landing configuration...


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Noticed, mostly during my landing training attempts, that the Spitfire, fully configured for landing ( flaps and gear down ) will pitch down when we add power and pitch up if we pull the throttle...

 

Guess this is due to the combination between those full flaps down drag and the CoG / CoL ?

 

In clean configuration the behaviour is the "classic" one : power up --> pitch up; power down --> pitch down :-)

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Hmm can't say I myself have really seen that. I have over 100 landings so far in the Spit, the majority spent just learning to land this beast lol.

 

I trim it out for a slow descent, speed around 90 as I am approaching the runway , and of course flaps and gear down. I then control my altitude appropriate with only the throttle - if I need to slow descent I give it a little throttle and it slows the descent, or even start to climb a little if coming in too shallow. Or less throttle to increase the descent.

 

I have not noticed the nose pitching down when increasing the power a little or up when decreasing a little. Perhaps I would if giving significantly more or less power...

The main thing I notice is the sharp pitch down when deploying the flaps.

Don B

My VKB Gunfighter MK III Pro L Review

EVGA Z390 Dark MB | i9 9900k CPU @ 5.1 GHz | EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra | 32 GB G Skill Trident Z 3200 MHz CL14 | Corsair H150i Pro Cooler |VKB GF MK III Pro L Ultimate Grip| Virpil CM3 Throttle | VPC Rotor TCS Base w/ Alpha-L Grip| Point Control V2|Varjo Aero|

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Noticed, mostly during my landing training attempts, that the Spitfire, fully configured for landing ( flaps and gear down ) will pitch down when we add power and pitch up if we pull the throttle...

 

Guess this is due to the combination between those full flaps down drag and the CoG / CoL ?

 

In clean configuration the behaviour is the "classic" one : power up --> pitch up; power down --> pitch down :-)

 

What are your trim settings?

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What are your trim settings?

 

Well can't really say for sure, fair amount of up trim I guess . I do it by sight, I just trim it to where it is descending slightly ( descent gauge around the third mark down) at speed around 90, keeping the nose aligned with the runway with the rudder trim, and as I cross threshold I ease throttle back to speed around 80 with a tick more uptrim , and then when just slightly above the runway pull full back on the throttle and flare it for a three point landing.

 

Edit - sorry, just realized you were asking jcomm and I replied...

Don B

My VKB Gunfighter MK III Pro L Review

EVGA Z390 Dark MB | i9 9900k CPU @ 5.1 GHz | EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra | 32 GB G Skill Trident Z 3200 MHz CL14 | Corsair H150i Pro Cooler |VKB GF MK III Pro L Ultimate Grip| Virpil CM3 Throttle | VPC Rotor TCS Base w/ Alpha-L Grip| Point Control V2|Varjo Aero|

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the flaps create without a doupt a lot of drag

 

My way to land this thing is, get to 120, keep that speed, trim it out so it doesn't go up or down, sometimes at nose up (2-3), wait until i'm close to runway, throttle idle and gently go down with about 80-60mph. That way, i don't have to care much about the pitch up when throttling up since i'm always try to keep the same throttle settings to keep the speed, then i'm also trimmed out, so i do fine adjustments with the stick, not really with the trim...

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Yes, that's pretty much my landing technique also, in the sim and IRL, but I just posted because I noticed the difference due probably to the "split flaps" used in the Spitfire.

 

Apparently and due to the relative position of the CoG / CoR, the drag effect compensates the downwash when power is applied and propwash deflected ( ? )

Flight Simulation is the Virtual Materialization of a Dream...

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The flaps on this airplane really should just be called Air Brakes or Ventral Spoilers, lol.

 

Don't trim by looking at the indicator, trim by feel to keep your nose on target and as mentioned above, power-to-the-runway and control your glide slope's steepness/shallowness by pulling/adding throttle.

 

You can land this thing without flaps, by the way, it actually makes life a little less complicated but it will cost more runway naturally.

 

Most times in a tailwheel you are pulling the stick back into your lap as far as it will go by feel, as you feel the air start to no longer grip the surfaces and then there's this "tree branch" snapping in your hand sort of feeling and thats ideally done about a foot off the pavement or less and bop down you go.

 

The Spit oddly enough in my personal experience, responds well to being "flown into the ground" more so than other taildraggers generally respond better to be glided in at a much sharper glide slope angle, stop descent, then flared harder and harder as you reach the point at which the plane no longer wants to fly.

 

In the Spit if you have your stick all the way back before you touch the pavement even at silly low airspeed, it will still try to continue flying, which is bad.

 

Sit in the cockpit on the ground and develop a gunsight/sight picture of what the world should look like attitude-wise right before you touchdown.

 

As far as the plane pitching fwd or aft with throttle application, bear in mind this thing is very light, its a very not-draggy plane (super streamlined) and weight & balance of fuel plus weather and how you're managing your prop pitch manually will all combine to affect the plane's reaction to throttle movement.

 

E.G. if your prop pitch is set very coarsely at the moment, yanking throttle one way or the other will yield one reaction very different vs. yanking the throttle with the prop pitched more finely against the air.

 

Oddly enough, one of my best touchdowns was a ferry flight in realtime weather for the airfield I was at in snow etc, and I'd been drinking heavily... but ah... yeah, there ya go, lol

 

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JComm - thank you, yes I'm using DAWS Weather. You can find it if you search the forum, I know the developer does not officially advise his latest version as compatible with 1.5.5 or the latest 2.0 build, but it works fine on mine, and I also use Mustang's Cloud Shape mod (search forums as well, I can't find the link...) and the two together really do help fix DCS' honestly arcane, awful, outdated weather system lol.

 

I typically pull weather for the actual airfield I'm flying out of and set time to the real local time, or I'll fly an airfield that is closely lined up to rwy heading for my local airfield (McKinney, Texas, KTKI) and pull weather for KTKI so I'm flying my local weather/time.

 

Really livens up the experience because you're not doing yourself any favors by setting up the weather to be 'easy' or comfortable.

 

As I was taught by my CFI in the Cub, there's no such thing as a non-crosswind landing, every landing is a slip, and if you don't go up in awful weather and shoot landings, some day you'll find yourself flying a beautiful sunny day, the weather will shift gears on you, and you won't make it home to see your family because you didn't suck it up and push yourself outside of your comfort zone :)

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Well can't really say for sure, fair amount of up trim I guess . I do it by sight, I just trim it to where it is descending slightly ( descent gauge around the third mark down) at speed around 90, keeping the nose aligned with the runway with the rudder trim, and as I cross threshold I ease throttle back to speed around 80 with a tick more uptrim , and then when just slightly above the runway pull full back on the throttle and flare it for a three point landing.

 

Edit - sorry, just realized you were asking jcomm and I replied...

 

No prob - always good information on how others accomplish landings. My approach is essentially the same as yours.

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RPM is at 2650. Boost at 4 but I play at it as necessary. Gear down 1st and adjust up elevator. Get slower, then flaps down. I trim up elevator by feel and the angle of attack I am looking for once flaps are deployed, but I have my one eye glued to the slip/turn indicator nicely centered, the other on the runway's threshold and centerline. Wags describes the how-to nicely.

 

I am doing fine landing until I get below 60 mph when my rudder is no longer effective. Still working on that. Maybe have 30 landings so far. I have the 3 other WWII birds as previous experience.

 

This Spit is a bit touchy in comparison to the other 3 aircraft in its current state.

 

I like flying the Burning Skies server with that stiff crosswind. I have zero experience flying in Single Player. My ping is about 150 or so. Early afternoon Eastern Time Zone finds lots of guys on.


Edited by DieHard

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RPM is at 2650. Boost at 4 but I play at it as necessary. Gear down 1st and adjust up elevator. Get slower, then flaps down. I trim up elevator by feel and the angle of attack I am looking for once flaps are deployed, but I have my one eye glued to the slip/turn indicator nicely centered, the other on the runway's threshold and centerline. Wags describes the how-to nicely.

 

I am doing fine landing until I get below 60 mph when my rudder is no longer effective. Still working on that. Maybe have 30 landings so far. I have the 3 other WWII birds as previous experience.

 

This Spit is a bit touchy in comparison to the other 3 aircraft in its current state.

 

I like flying the Burning Skies server with that stiff crosswind. I have zero experience flying in Single Player. My ping is about 150 or so. Early afternoon Eastern Time Zone finds lots of guys on.

 

I've been there !!! Look for "jcomm" in the pilot's board.... Sometimes all Spitfire slots are filled, so I pick the 109, although my preferred is still the p51d, but it requires more skill and altitude to be used to it's advantages....

Flight Simulation is the Virtual Materialization of a Dream...

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Side note RE: rudder authority <60mph - thats gonna depend on wind speed and wind direction. Given the right (or wrong, lol) weather conditions, you will find your rudder still steering the plane if only a little bit under 60mph in some cases so be careful and when in doubt, feel it out.

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