Patch 1.13 Requested Features/Fixes List (*Merged)

[thereminqblank]

hrmmmm surreal

[UWBuRn]

Boomerang? Never heard "that" called in this way, but seen this in LO, using 27ER in HOJ at very high altitude: was just too funny looking at the missile from F6 making a 180° turn and start chasing the bandit. :megalol:

 

@GGTharos

Comparing the AIM-7E, employed by a plane without doppler radar, with the R-27 on 29/27 (their radar mustn't be great too in scan, but in tracking should work ok) sounds a bit odd... i mean, not impossible (many missiles were overrated before beign used on the field), but still, odd.

 

The Sparrow in Vietnam was conditioned by ROE, enviromental condition, difficulties in mantaining a stable lock, inability to perform lookdown shootdown engagements and so on, leading the PK to about 0.1.

 

I tried to search something about R-27 but i came up with nothing (well, was late and had to stop searching). :no_sad:

 

If you (or someone else) have find something, would you mind share it? I would be interested in reading something about that argument. :)

[VMFA117_Poko]

12:41:02: Poko: Yupp, it is frustrating and make no sense flying online since you have known these tricks or when you're a noob flying against some squadron members whose know this as well.

> 12:41:07: Nub #2

> 12:41:33: Crazy Eyes: Yoda I totally agree with you these exploits really kill the playability of lomac especially in A2A

> 12:41:36: Nub#3

> 12:41:45: I mean these ppl are just looking for an exuse

> 12:41:54: because they get pwned again and again

 

> 12:41:54: that is correct

 

> 12:42:19: lol

> 12:42:22: funny thing

Yes, I am a no0bie. Should I be sorry for that?

[Shaman]

I just can't wait to see everyone on the server go rambo-barrel-rolling.

All missiles will become totally useless and finally we will go gunzo 99% of time... but this is never going to happen.

Truth is, these kinds of maneuvers are totally unpractical, will get you killed more often. This is last resort only.. You should never get into a situation like this. In most cases you'll blackout, loose SA, or both. Try to sort your targets while you are doing this. This makes you an easy target for any organized flight of two. You can counter everything in this game, just think twice. It is not an exploit - like finding out how to get an extra missile by quickly combining few odd keystrokes together or whatever. This is a stupid rambo maneuver that always is fun and safe to do in laboratory environment. I wouldn't go for it in multi player environment, unless your opponent is a total and complete straight flying nub, who's just received an in-game message how to turn his engines on, or this is last resort action to save your ass (no other option for you available) :) That is why A2A in this game is still competitive.

 

Poko, there's no shame in this :) I still love you :P http://www.moviesoundclips.net/movies1/serenity/gooddeath.wav

[GGTharos]

You need to find the right people to talk to. I haven't really found anything on the net besides the E-E conflict. That's about all I can tell you. It isn't likely they'll tell you too much either ... you know, 'operational security'.

 

The Sparrow in Vietnam was conditioned by ROE, enviromental condition, difficulties in mantaining a stable lock, inability to perform lookdown shootdown engagements and so on, leading the PK to about 0.1.

 

I tried to search something about R-27 but i came up with nothing (well, was late and had to stop searching). :no_sad:

 

If you (or someone else) have find something, would you mind share it? I would be interested in reading something about that argument. :)

[Pilotasso]

I just can't wait to see everyone on the server go rambo-barrel-rolling.

All missiles will become totally useless and finally we will go gunzo 99% of time... but this is never going to happen.

Truth is, these kinds of maneuvers are totally unpractical, will get you killed more often. This is last resort only.. You should never get into a situation like this. In most cases you'll blackout, loose SA, or both.

 

Good post. I think barrel rolling, orthogonal roll and the 10m exploit are being a bit overrated here. the 10m exploit can be easely countered if you have a bit of imagination. I have devised one I ilustrated on a previous page in this thread. Once the whole ECM/maddog and Chaff resitence bugs are tuned in an eventual patch, doing these things will get anyone killed instead. I hate to barrel roll for the precise reasons you mention above. I preffer the orthogonal roll even if its harder to perform correctly in a caotic enviroment such as an online match, but this manuever is even realistic, just not that close inside the NEZ. An orthogonal roll allows better escape window than a barrel roll since in this last manuever you still keep flying in the same overall direction. Eventualy you have to come out of it only to find out your 6 to be compromised and cant turn without blacking out.

[Kula66]

are tuned in an eventual patch

 

Pilot, I think you are being a little optimistic!

 

The last patch was released when? Ages ago. Development has switched to DCS ... it's never going to happen! We are not going to get a patch that fixes missiles/seekers/chaff/flares/ECM ... ED are not going to make money on it!

 

We'll just have to wait for DCS to get around to doing 2 fighters and hope they do A2A missiles right this time!

[HubMan]

Good post. I think barrel rolling, orthogonal roll and the 10m exploit are being a bit overrated here. the 10m exploit can be easely countered if you have a bit of imagination. I have devised one I ilustrated on a previous page in this thread. Once the whole ECM/maddog and Chaff resitence bugs are tuned in an eventual patch, doing these things will get anyone killed instead. I hate to barrel roll for the precise reasons you mention above. I preffer the orthogonal roll even if its harder to perform correctly in a caotic enviroment such as an online match, but this manuever is even realistic, just not that close inside the NEZ. An orthogonal roll allows better escape window than a barrel roll since in this last manuever you still keep flying in the same overall direction. Eventualy you have to come out of it only to find out your 6 to be compromised and cant turn without blacking out.

But a barrel roll allows you to keep your target locked. If you are not Fox 3 equipped, this is a better choice, as an orthogonal roll will cause to break lock :)

In all the cases, it's -very- hard to escape 3 AMRAAMS launched with the good timing : you can dodge the 2 first ones, but most of the time, the last one will get you, because you will be out of energy :)

 

Cheers :)

 

 

Hub.

[Pilotasso]

Pilot, I think you are being a little optimistic!

 

The last patch was released when? Ages ago. Development has switched to DCS ... it's never going to happen! We are not going to get a patch that fixes missiles/seekers/chaff/flares/ECM ... ED are not going to make money on it!

 

We'll just have to wait for DCS to get around to doing 2 fighters and hope they do A2A missiles right this time!

 

Keyword: "EVENTUAL" ;)

[Grimes]

I think barrel rolling, orthogonal roll and the 10m exploit are being a bit overrated here.

 

Since StarFox has well established the fact that a barrel roll will get you out of any situation, I too believe that such tactics should remain applicable to a combat flight sim.

 

I would think the fact that such exploits exist, have been talked about before(never with wonderful video evidence), and ignored for some time would be plenty reasoning as to why our concern isn't overrated.

[Geier]

Just use your gun when these stupid tricks are taken place:smilewink: It's a real pleasure to kill the bandit after all his unfair shifts.

That's why I like to fly F15 in LO. No advantages except the radar, 120s' number and your brains:P

 

 

 

@Yoda, nice thread:thumbup:

[PoleCat]

Let's hope for a 1.13 patch to eventually fix these issues. What more can we do? Frustration and rage will never accomplish anything so I prefer to hope for the best outcome.

 

Thankfully most of the people that I know in this fine community simply would not purposely use these exploits to cheat. Those that do gain nothing IMHO.

 

Out

[HubMan]

:D

 

Hub.

[VMFA117_Poko]

Let's hope for a 1.13 patch to eventually fix these issues. What more can we do? Frustration and rage will never accomplish anything so I prefer to hope for the best outcome.

 

Thankfully most of the people that I know in this fine community simply would not purposely use these exploits to cheat. Those that do gain nothing IMHO.

 

Out

Amen, and close this finally. I'm sure ED will bring what they promised. They always do. Everything in proper time. So please keep all your critics calm. Please, I bag You.

[S77th-GOYA]

The focus of this thread seems a bit strange. The problem isn't so much exploits as it is under-modelled missiles/radar. No one needs to purposefully exploit these missiles. Everything in that movie is a real defensive tactic. Chaffing, high-G maneuvers, beaming, etc., cannot be considered exploits. Doing so puts blame on pilots when the blame is really with the code.

While NOE is a real tactic, as far as LO:FC goes, it may be considered an exploit. But again the problem is with the coding.

 

It took me quite a while let go of the memories of when Lock On was actually enjoyable to fly. Hearing things similar to "Lock On is great but the missiles are horrible" makes me think that others are having the same trouble facing the reality of 1.12a/b. For a BVR pilot, Lock On is not great. In fact, for a BVR pilot, Lock On sucks badly. It was great fun in the past but now it is an exercise in frustration. It used to be that spamming missiles was frowned upon as a noob move. Now spamming is SOP because of the high likelihood of a missile fired from an excellent position will simply not hit its target. Who needs that?

 

I, for one, will not consider another ED product because of their actions regarding Lock On. And it is damn shame because at one time, it was the best sim I've ever played, with the potential to become even better. But the sad truth is that ED has ruined it and left it for dead. And abandoned its customers in the process.

[S77th-GOYA]

Amen, and close this finally. I'm sure ED will bring what they promised. They always do.

 

Poko, what did ED promise?

[Pilotasso]

Since StarFox has well established the fact that a barrel roll will get you out of any situation, I too believe that such tactics should remain applicable to a combat flight sim.

 

I would think the fact that such exploits exist, have been talked about before(never with wonderful video evidence), and ignored for some time would be plenty reasoning as to why our concern isn't overrated.

 

 

It is one thing to do these stunts in controlable enviroments and the other is in actual Multiplay game. Often you are fired upon by surprise or from different vectors at a time your SA aint too good. Dumping your entire chaff load like in the videos will get you killed fast. Nor will you be able to controll the spacial conditions to perform ortogonal rolls or execute a barrel roll without sacrificing your escape window at the end.

[Geier]

Poko, what did ED promise?

 

there was no promise afaik:huh:

[RvETito]

Just use your gun when these stupid tricks are taken place:smilewink: It's a real pleasure to kill the bandit after all his unfair shifts.

 

Why do you think we in RvE fly gunzo so much? ;)

[Geier]

Why do you think we in RvE fly gunzo that much? ;)

 

Same here:thumbup:

[VMFA117_Poko]

there was no promise afaik:huh:

 

Poko, what did ED promise?

No?

Q: Does the launch of the new DCS series mean the end of Lock On?

A: Absolutely not. The DCS series and Lock On will live side by side for many years to come. The Lock On community is extremely active, with many websites, and new users are purchasing Lock On and Flaming Cliffs every day. Modifications are continually being launched by the communities that enhance the Lock On experience. Though we will not be launching new aircraft for Lock On, we are evaluating a 1.13 patch to meet the continual demands of the Lock On community.

[Shaman]

No?

 

Hmm... well... they are "evaluating"...

whatever it means.. it may even mean in close future: "we're sorry - not enough workforce"

Please don't forget that ED is rather focused on developing software for military personnel (that's where the money is); we're at the end of food chain.

[VMFA117_Poko]

I don't remember when they said about something that they were not sure. Only exception is just the title Lockon 1.2 BlackShark --> DCS BlackShark.

[Geier]

No?

we are evaluating a 1.13 patch to meet the continual demands of the Lock On community.

yep - but not "we're announcing the new 1.13 patch with all fixes that LO community has written here for at least 2 years"

:(

[VMFA117_Poko]

:bomb: Ok, I give up. Take Your copy of Flaming Cliffs, open the window, throw this up and then kick so hard to blast it on the horizon. Maybe this will help :mad: