CASE III - 30° offset marshal radial?

[Eldur]

Some might remember:

 

 

What happened to the 30° offset marshal radial in CASE III? It's not part of the SC manual and everyone keeps showing off flying the stack on the BRC radial instead now. Is there a reason?

[Swift.]

It's just a different type of case3 approach. iirc CV1 is the straight in, CV2 is a weird overhead thing, and CV3 is the offset one

[=4c=Nikola]

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4334204&postcount=23

[maxTRX]

It's just a different type of case3 approach. iirc CV1 is the straight in, CV2 is a weird overhead thing, and CV3 is the offset one

 

CV1 is FB and offset, CV3 is for helos?

[Hippo]

 

6.4.1 Marshal Procedures

 

6.4.1.1 Jet/Turboprop Aircraft

 

The primary TACAN marshal fix is the 180 radial relative to the expected final bearing at a distance of 1 mile for every 1,000 feet of altitude plus 15 miles (angels +15).

 

The holding pattern is a left-hand, 6-minute racetrack pattern.

 

The inbound leg shall pass over the holding fix.

 

In no case will the base altitude be lower than 6,000 feet.

 

 

From CV NATOPS MANUAL.

 

 

Dated 31/07/2009 - perhaps procedures have changed since then?

[G B]

With the CV-1, the Marshal radial is almost always offset from the final bearing. 30* is very typical.

 

The CV-2 is an overhead Marshal stack to a teardrop entry to the final bearing. It is used when airspace won’t allow a CV-1. It is not very common at all.

 

Edit: to clarify, the CV-1 procedure graphic you may find depicts a straight-in. That is a generic description of the approach so do not interpret that to mean that that is always what happens. It almost never does.

 

Also, the description in the post above mine is a description of a generic CV-1, not what MUST happen.

Edited May 19, 2020 by G B

[AG-51_Sabot]

G.B., the boat can stack you on whatever radial they want. Typically it's behind the boat. Is that correct?

[G B]

G.B., the boat can stack you on whatever radial they want. Typically it's behind the boat. Is that correct?

 

Yes. The most common radial for the stack is offset 30* from the final bearing reciprocal (behind the boat).

[huppel]

Is it possible to setup a mission with an offset radial or is it automatically chosen in DCS (and always a straight in)?

And if not will this option be added later?

[victorlima01]

Automatically chosen by marshall. and so far I've only been assigned the reciprocal of final bearing. I hope they'll soon add some random offset radials.

[maxTRX]

Automatically chosen by marshall. and so far I've only been assigned the reciprocal of final bearing. I hope they'll soon add some random offset radials.

 

Same here. Once, I think I was given a radial that was 2 deg. off FB reciprocal.

[USSInchon]

Maybe it's training in progress down in the CATCC and the new booter has no idea what they're doing.

[sfzdrums]

Same here. Once, I think I was given a radial that was 2 deg. off FB reciprocal.

 

Last night I was given a marshal radial almost 80 deg offset. :huh: I had to go back and make sure I didn't misunderstand the controller. I did not. Not sure if that is anything close to real life or not, but it made for an interesting approach anyway

[victorlima01]

I think 80* offset might be a little more than we bargained for. Let's see what Creepy, GB or Lex have to say about this

[G B]

In theory, the offset can be any amount. Typically you’ll see 30 degrees. 20-40 is overwhelmingly the most common. 80 is aggressive but sure it can be done. There are different procedures on how to correct to final bearing depending on how misaligned the marshal radial and final bearing is.

 

I have never seen the radials be coincident (a straight in direct from marshal). It of course can be done. But in practice it isn’t, because the dog leg geometry allows CATCC ways to be creative to fix spacing for whatever reason. (They also can control speed...For example “305, take speed 225” or “402, dirty up” prior to 8 miles).