VKB Gunfighter Mk.II (Rev. B) w. MCG Pro Brake Axis Twitching w. X/Y inputs.

[Northstar98]

Hi Everyone,

Having a small issue with my VKB Gunfighter Mk.II (Rev. b), w. MCG Pro that I've had for just under a year and a half (delivered early September 2019). What's happening is that when I put in pitch and roll inputs, the brake axis goes from 0-100% for a split second before returning to 0.

This usually isn't an issue, but I've set the axis up to not only act as an axis (for aircraft that use a brake leaver) but also as a button for a small amount of travel (for western aircraft that have a paddle switch), the momentary twitch causes said button to activate, which can be especially annoying in aircraft like the Tomcat, whereby it disables the autopilot as well as the pitch and roll SAS.

I otherwise don't have any issues with the stick, it calibrates just fine, never has ghost button presses, all axis and buttons work fine (including the brake), it's only this transient 0-100% that it sometimes does with the brake axis with X and Y inputs that's the issue.

I've tried reflashing it, recalibrating it, as well as reseating the grip, I've also tried replugging in the connectors on the gimbal.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Edited November 18, 2021 by Northstar98
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[dburne]

Check very carefully in DCS axis settings panel for any duplicate entries.

[Northstar98]

On 2/6/2021 at 11:48 AM, dburne said:

Check very carefully in DCS axis settings panel for any duplicate entries.

It's not DCS, when looking in VKBDefCfg-C I can see Slider2 (the brake axis) jumping from 0 to 65535 and back to 0; it does this very quickly, talking fractions of a second here, when I move X and Y, though intermittent.

It's only this slider (the brake lever axis) that does this, I experience no ghost button presses, and all other axis on the grip stay perfectly centred until I purposefully operate them.

When I release the stick, it centres properly (almost perfect, but nothing a few small pokes doesn't fix) and all axis and buttons behave as normal, including the brake.

If I squeeze the brake while moving X and Y it still is very glitchy, jumping from 0-65535.

Though sometimes I can move X and Y and not have it play up at all and behave as it should with no transient glitching, it's very odd.

I'm tempted to say that maybe there's a loose connection for the brake lever board? I don't have a long enough screwdriver to unscrew the very top screw of the grip so I can take a look, but maybe that's the issue?

Edited November 18, 2021 by Northstar98
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[nawarren]

Hi NorthStar,

 

Might be a longshot, but worth opening up the base, with desktop mount, only 4 small screws, and checking the wiring, make sure it's not catching or routed in a way where movement of the gimbal can interfere or pinch a wire.

 

Cheers

 

Neil

[Ron]

Show the Profile-Axes tab from the configurator. To unscrew this single screw, you need a screwdriver with a length of about 50mm.

Edited February 9, 2021 by Ron

[Northstar98]

On 2/9/2021 at 4:23 PM, nawarren said:

Hi NorthStar,

 

Might be a longshot, but worth opening up the base, with desktop mount, only 4 small screws, and checking the wiring, make sure it's not catching or routed in a way where movement of the gimbal can interfere or pinch a wire.

 

Cheers

 

Neil

Hi Neil,

Quickly had a look and moved the stick, doesn't look like any of the wires are getting pinched, only one that looks a little tight is the one coming off the X-axis board, the wire from the stick itself looks absolutely fine. Only thing I will say is now it doesn't seem to be doing it as often - odd.

On 2/9/2021 at 4:30 PM, Ron said:

Show the Profile-Axes tab from the configurator. To unscrew this single screw, you need a screwdriver with a length of about 50mm.

 

As for unscrewing, I seem to have misplaced mine, but I'll get back to you once I've got one long enough to unscrew the last screw.

Edited November 18, 2021 by Northstar98

[Northstar98]

EDIT: It seems by messing around with re-seating the grip, blowing some compressed air around and making sure everything is secure seems to have alleviated the issue - I'm not seeing the same problem before at least nowhere near as frequently.

I guess I can treat this as being resolved, thank-you very much to everyone who chimed in!

EDIT: 2 it's still doing it but maybe a little less frequently - so semi resolved.

Edited November 18, 2021 by Northstar98
formatting

[dburne]

2 hours ago, Northstar98 said:

EDIT: It seems by messing around with re-seating the grip, blowing some compressed air around and making sure everything is secure seems to have alleviated the issue - I'm not seeing the same problem before at least nowhere near as frequently.

 

I guess I can treat this as being resolved, thank-you very much to everyone who chimed in!

 

[Northstar98]

Unfortunately it seems that this issue keeps coming back, even after reseating the grip and performing a calibration.

Certain things (namely the brake axis, but I've also noticed the gate control hat too, but more rare), intermittently twitching with X and Y inputs.

It's especially annoying in the Tomcat, where the brake axis twitching results in the pitch and roll SAS channels disconnecting (the brake axis has virtual buttons programmed which is used for the paddle switch in many aircraft), and also the Mi-8MTV-2 and Mi-24P, where it's set to the brake.

I've so far tried reseating the grip, inspecting wires for breaks, unplugging everything and plugging back in (after cleaning pins with compressed air), but nothing ever seems to solve the issue for long.

Sometimes after lots of movement from X and Y across their ranges, the problem dissappears and everything behaves normally.

Edited November 19, 2021 by Northstar98

[MAXsenna]

Does that axis have a potentiometer or magnetic sensor?
If the former the pot is bad or dirty. Try some electronic clenser, or even WD40 can work. Did so for my Cougar before I converted it.

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk

[Northstar98]

Just now, MAXsenna said:

Does that axis have a potentiometer or magnetic sensor?

It's magnetic, definitely not a potentiometer. I've disassembled the grip before, the brake lever is just attached to a shaft with a circuit board mounted on the right of it with 2 ICs which I assume are hall effect sensors. If you see this .pdf, on page 5, you can see the board.

The other thing is that this issue is intermittent, and only occurs sometimes with X/Y inputs, it will quickly max out and go back to 0 in a tiny fraction of a second. Sometimes the axis will glitch out with the slightest stick movement, sometimes it has to be moved to the extremities, sometimes it will be fine for hours and hours (like it is now).

Otherwise the axis functions as expected, no issues.

[MAXsenna]

Right, I suspected that.
Seems like an electronic issue one way or another. Sounds like interference sowmhow. Stow away your cell!
Just kidding.

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk

[Northstar98]

On 11/19/2021 at 10:02 PM, MAXsenna said:

Right, I suspected that.
Seems like an electronic issue one way or another. Sounds like interference sowmhow. Stow away your cell!
Just kidding.

Actually, that's not such a bad idea, my stick is connected adjacent to my laptop's charging cable, maybe it could be EMI? I doubt it, but hey, no harm in checking.

I'll move it to my other spare USB slot and see if that helps.

EDIT: Seems to be doing it a fair bit less (but it could just be a coincidence - this is an intermittent issue and sometimes it doesn't do it so often), but it's still doing it.

Edited November 24, 2021 by Northstar98

[jonsky7]

This could quite probably be the wiring, I've had issues with axis skipping and have solved it by replacing the cables inside.
Mine was the joystick x-axis on a GFmk2 McG pro. Absolutely nothing visual to see, no visually broken wires etc, but I suspect the constant movement causes the copper wiring to break inside or detach somewhat from the teeny weeny plug pins. 

At first it made quite a difference when I added a small amount of superglue that secured the wiring to the tiny plugs. Just a drop between the wires and to the back of the plug to secure them. But it came back eventually.
After a few to and fro emails, VKB sent a replacement set of cables and the issue was solved,  I made sure to add a small amount of superglue to the back of the plugs on the new cables. So far so good. 

[Northstar98]

28 minutes ago, jonsky7 said:

This could quite probably be the wiring, I've had issues with axis skipping and have solved it by replacing the cables inside.
Mine was the joystick x-axis on a GFmk2 McG pro. Absolutely nothing visual to see, no visually broken wires etc, but I suspect the constant movement causes the copper wiring to break inside or detach somewhat from the teeny weeny plug pins. 

At first it made quite a difference when I added a small amount of superglue that secured the wiring to the tiny plugs. Just a drop between the wires and to the back of the plug to secure them. But it came back eventually.
After a few to and fro emails, VKB sent a replacement set of cables and the issue was solved,  I made sure to add a small amount of superglue to the back of the plugs on the new cables. So far so good. 

Might be worth trying, thank-you!

[Mango]

I have the same problem, have to disassemble the base once every month to reseat the connections.