Complete Newbie rookie pilot to DCS

[RavenLeader]

Good Morning chaps,

After my intro to this great forum, I figured the best place to continue my leap into DCS world would be right here and forgive me if this has been asked a million times before. Now Ive seen the DCS world top spec recommendation's for a PC setup, now whilst my knowledge in PC's and software is fairly sound Im by no means an expert, so a self build Id say is way out of my level of expertise whilst acknowledging this would be the most cost effective route to DCS world. Im based in the UK and having done a lot of research and asking questions getting quotes, its all with the various PC specialists. Whilst Im sure they know what they are talking about, Im alaso savvy enough to think they may just be sales pitching me anything that may be way over the top. AMD and Ryzen seems to be the favoured choice over Intel iCore based on what Ive researched for better value for money. I have no idea on that one. Id prefer more reputable and having found the Dell Alienware setup that appears to suit DCS I am very tempted but I would appreciate you chaps input, especially from those based here in the UK. Bottom line what should I get for ideal play in DCS. I know this requires a decent amount of cash but I dont want to bent over a barrel either.

 

Look forward to hear from you chaps.

[Caster]

First off, welcome

 

From everything I've heard, alienware tends to be overpriced (if you want prebuilt you absolutely cannot go wrong with PC Specialist, customer support is excellent, but compare relative specs with the alienware and make up your own mind). AMD pretty much have the best specs/value atm (breaks my intel fan heart  ), but DCS cares way more about single core cpu performance atm than threading, so maybe don't bother with a threadripper. I would recommend 32Gb of RAM, I saw a big upgrade in multiplayer performance when I upgraded from 16Gb.

 

For reference I have a 3090, i5-9600k clocked to ~4.9Ghz, 32Gb RAM, and it definitely is bottlenecked on the CPU, max settings I get ~120fps singleplayer, and anywhere from 30 - 80fps multiplayer. There's lots of options you can tweak for lessen GPU load, but not so many for CPU that don't have a big impact on fidelity.

 

One last thing, no matter what your existing HOTAS setup, if you don't have headtracking I would prioritise that, it makes a HUGE difference. There's good DIY "free" options, as well as more expensive stuff like delanclip, which I've heard very good things about. I went with TrackIR, and it's been perfect.

 

 

 

There's a bunch of great communities dedicated to helping out new and old players getting to grips with all aspects of DCS, and hosting events and training. Avoid any that charge money for training like the plague. I'm in Tactical DCS (https://discord.gg/tacticaldcs), we have dedicated instructors and training events, as well as campaigns, very low maintainence, anyone welcome. There's also places like hoggit, spudknockers' discord and a bunch of others. Finally, for any full fidelity aircraft chuck's guides are a must have reference https://www.mudspike.com/chucks-guides-dcs/

 

 

Hope this all helps, feel free to ask if you have any questions

Edited March 14, 2021 by Caster

[VpR81]

Hello and welcome,

 

Maybe you want to wait a bit before choosing an AMD, as Intels new CPU generation is announced for end or march. Not saying you shouldn't go with AMD Ryzen, but propably wait for the new Intel CPUs, see what they provide and then decide wich you are going for. As Caster already mentioned, 32GB RAM is what you definately should have. Also you should make sure that DCS (and Windows) is installed on a SSD (i'd say at least 1TB for both together). As long as you don't want to go the VR route, you should be good with a RTX 3060Ti or a Radeon 6700XT (wich is sadly not released yet - or is it?) GPU. Headtracking is very important for a nice flight sim experience. I used the Delanclip with opentrack before switching to VR and i was pretty happy with it. Setting opentrack software up is kinda tricky, but there are good videos on Youtube explaining how to do it. It took me about a day or so until it ran perfectly. Delan engineering is a small UK company, so you should have low shipping costs. Their headtracking device is also much cheaper than the original TrackIR and the delanclip is made from robust aluminium instead of the cheap (and as i heard, fast braking) plastic clip of the TrackIR device. The Delanclip (with camera) was about 70€ for me including shipment to germany, while TrackIR is at least 150€ for the standard version and 200€+ for the advanced version (wich has a similar clip as the Delan, the standard version has a very simple one that needs to be attached to a basecap or something). The quality of Delanclip is very good and the needed software (Opentrack) is for free.

 

You don't need a 500€+ HOTAS to enjoy DCS (this beeing said, DCS can be controlled with a XBox controller, but... you know...), there are a few decent flight control systems out there for a reasonable price. Ok, the Covid-19 pandemic and the release of the MSFS2020 increased the prices, but still somehow acceptable in comparison to the high end flight sim peripherals. The Thrustmaster T16000 + TWCS provides good value for the money and should last you a couple of years. An alternative would be the VKB Gladiator stick wich is a bit more expensive than the T16000, is also significant better. Another benefit from the T16000 (not sure about the Gladiator) is, that it comes with a twist axis so you wont desperately need rudder pedals from day one. CH Products are also very good, but difficult to get these days. Just stay away from Logitech.

 

Cheers mate

[RavenLeader]

12 minutes ago, VpR81 said:

Hello and welcome,

 

Maybe you want to wait a bit before choosing an AMD, as Intels new CPU generation is announced for end or march. Not saying you shouldn't go with AMD Ryzen, but propably wait for the new Intel CPUs, see what they provide and then decide wich you are going for. As Caster already mentioned, 32GB RAM is what you definately should have. Also you should make sure that DCS (and Windows) is installed on a SSD (i'd say at least 1TB for both together). As long as you don't want to go the VR route, you should be good with a RTX 3060Ti or a Radeon 6700XT (wich is sadly not released yet - or is it?) GPU. Headtracking is very important for a nice flight sim experience. I used the Delanclip with opentrack before switching to VR and i was pretty happy with it. Setting opentrack software up is kinda tricky, but there are good videos on Youtube explaining how to do it. It took me about a day or so until it ran perfectly. Delan engineering is a small UK company, so you should have low shipping costs. Their headtracking device is also much cheaper than the original TrackIR and the delanclip is made from robust aluminium instead of the cheap (and as i heard, fast braking) plastic clip of the TrackIR device. The Delanclip (with camera) was about 70€ for me including shipment to germany, while TrackIR is at least 150€ for the standard version and 200€+ for the advanced version (wich has a similar clip as the Delan, the standard version has a very simple one that needs to be attached to a basecap or something). The quality of Delanclip is very good and the needed software (Opentrack) is for free.

 

You don't need a 500€+ HOTAS to enjoy DCS (this beeing said, DCS can be controlled with a XBox controller, but... you know...), there are a few decent flight control systems out there for a reasonable price. Ok, the Covid-19 pandemic and the release of the MSFS2020 increased the prices, but still somehow acceptable in comparison to the high end flight sim peripherals. The Thrustmaster T16000 + TWCS provides good value for the money and should last you a couple of years. An alternative would be the VKB Gladiator stick wich is a bit more expensive than the T16000, is also significant better. Another benefit from the T16000 (not sure about the Gladiator) is, that it comes with a twist axis so you wont desperately need rudder pedals from day one. CH Products are also very good, but difficult to get these days. Just stay away from Logitech.

 

Cheers mate

Thanks VpR81, much appreciated. Whilst not as tech savvy on the PC tech scene what I do know is that the technology moves so fast, I could wait for the new Intel CPU, and then someone will say wait for the new AMD one and so on and so on. After an extensive amount of research and watching many youtube clips It seems to me that Intel take the piss a bit on pricing, purely because of their name in the industry, bit like buying a BMW, half the damn cost is in the badge.LOL. I have already purchased the HOTAS Warthog setup with stick and throttle unit. I was just about to push the purchase button on the track IR so thanks for the heads up on that one.

[RavenLeader]

1 hour ago, Caster said:

First off, welcome

 

From everything I've heard, alienware tends to be overpriced (if you want prebuilt you absolutely cannot go wrong with PC Specialist, customer support is excellent, but compare relative specs with the alienware and make up your own mind). AMD pretty much have the best specs/value atm (breaks my intel fan heart  ), but DCS cares way more about single core cpu performance atm than threading, so maybe don't bother with a threadripper. I would recommend 32Gb of RAM, I saw a big upgrade in multiplayer performance when I upgraded from 16Gb.

 

For reference I have a 3090, i5-9600k clocked to ~4.9Ghz, 32Gb RAM, and it definitely is bottlenecked on the CPU, max settings I get ~120fps singleplayer, and anywhere from 30 - 80fps multiplayer. There's lots of options you can tweak for lessen GPU load, but not so many for CPU that don't have a big impact on fidelity.

 

One last thing, no matter what your existing HOTAS setup, if you don't have headtracking I would prioritise that, it makes a HUGE difference. There's good DIY "free" options, as well as more expensive stuff like delanclip, which I've heard very good things about. I went with TrackIR, and it's been perfect.

 

 

 

There's a bunch of great communities dedicated to helping out new and old players getting to grips with all aspects of DCS, and hosting events and training. Avoid any that charge money for training like the plague. I'm in Tactical DCS (https://discord.gg/tacticaldcs), we have dedicated instructors and training events, as well as campaigns, very low maintainence, anyone welcome. There's also places like hoggit, spudknockers' discord and a bunch of others. Finally, for any full fidelity aircraft chuck's guides are a must have reference https://www.mudspike.com/chucks-guides-dcs/

 

 

Hope this all helps, feel free to ask if you have any questions

 

Hi Castor, many thanks for the welcome and I  have seen PC Specialists. Ive already received a quote from a similar outfit called "SCAN" on both the Intel and AMD option. 32Gb RAM I knew about from my research and good to see you chaps confirm that too so thats always been my benchmark. So far most of the machines Ive looked at are all 500gb SSD and the cards are all in the right bracket. As mentioned Ive already got the Thrustmaster Warthog HOTAS stick and throttle unit on order. I was going into Tracker IR but paused that to check out this Denclip crowd. I want a decent setup but not bonkers over the top. Im awaiting a quote from PC Specialist

[Caster]

I only went for trackIR because it was the first one I found, it's definintely not worth getting the "pro" version imo. I've heard good things about delanclip, but I can only speak to my experience with ttrackir, which has been excellent, since I found a great profile for curves so it was very easy to set up

[VpR81]

54 minutes ago, RavenLeader said:

Thanks VpR81, much appreciated. Whilst not as tech savvy on the PC tech scene what I do know is that the technology moves so fast, I could wait for the new Intel CPU, and then someone will say wait for the new AMD one and so on and so on

The price difference between Intel and AMD isn't that big anymore. The latest AMD Ryzen is pretty new and it is less than 2 weeks for the new Intel CPUs to be released. Nothing wrong with choosing AMD right now, just saying that i personally would wait for some Benchmarks of the Intel CPU and then see what people here in the forum report about the performance in DCS. Some friends of mine purchased the new AMD CPUs and had a significant performance increase in DCS, so you can't do anything wrong with AMD.

 

54 minutes ago, RavenLeader said:

purely because of their name in the industry, bit like buying a BMW, half the damn cost is in the badge

This is so damn true... it's also the case for TrackIR  

 

54 minutes ago, RavenLeader said:

I have already purchased the HOTAS Warthog setup with stick and throttle unit. I was just about to push the purchase button on the track IR so thanks for the heads up on that one.

Thats a solid choice, i'm sure you will enjoy your HOTAS. Had this one as well and it was realy good, especially the grip wich i still use. Glad the headtracking advice helped you, Delanclip realy provides good value for the money.

 

edit: in this case, you would propably want a set of rudder pedals as the Warthog does not come with a twist axis. Again, stay away from Logitech/Saitek. Good rudder pedals are relative expensive. Starts with the VKB T-Rudders (about 200€) and ends with Slaw Viper RX (about 500€). The VKB Rudders are more like Helikopter pedals, as they do not have toe brakes, but they are from very high quality. My brother has them and is absolutely happy with them. A very good choice for Pedals with toe brakes are the MFG Crosswinds (about 300€ incl. VAT) and the Virpil Ace Rudders (about 300€ excl. VAT). I have the Thrustmaster TPR (about 500€) wich are way overpriced imho. 

 

Cheers

Edited March 14, 2021 by VpR81

[RavenLeader]

Thanks Caster, yes just seems some the software requires a bit of fiddling, but not really an issue it seems. Many thanks for those links to your discord groups I will take that up once setup. Thank you.

 

[Bossco82]

Hi Raven,

I can give you a spec list as an idea. I built my own system for years and mine now runs DCS at 4k resolution at 60 fps with no stutters, butter smooth. I use a 50" 4k TV as a monitor. It's very immersive.

Amd 5600x cpu

X570 or B550 motherboard

4x8gb sticks of 3200mhz c16 or c14 DDR4

An SSD 500gb for Windows and DCS only. Increase the size of you want to install more. Get an nvme pciex4 for best performance. A Sata3 will be fine

For 4k res Nvidia 1080ti minimum then 2080ti. After that it's the new 3080 or 3090. I don't know your budget and the gpu availability is awful.

A quality 850w too 1000watt power supply Corsair are reliable.

 

For head tracking Trackir or Delanclip are fine and work.

 

Scan UK are the most reasonable and reliable PC builders at the moment.

 

Hope all that makes sense and helps you out.

[Burt]

Welcome to DCS !

All great information given to you above so I will make this a short one. I bought an Alienware R9 last year for only DCS because I didn’t know anything about a gaming rigs, I think I could of bought all the parts to build one but I decided to buy this Alienware machine which was actually cheaper giving the warranty that comes with Dell. I have owned Dell machines for over 20+ years and still using my 12 year old laptop for work purposes. But as far the Alienware gaming machines I have had a great experience of it running DCS which is the only thing I do with it. It’s done such a great job with DCS that I just ordered the

R11 - i9-10900KF - M.2 NVMe 2tb -Rtx 3090 -64gb Xfury Ram @ 3400MHz alittle over $4700 US. I did a parts price check and it was way over that price. The Dell sales person couldn’t come down on the price but he gave me the best warranty they had. He also offered me 128gb of 3200mhz Ram which I opt for the 64/ 3400. I got this for VR purposes and hopeful will last at least 5 years... hopeful.

But anyways Alienware is a super great prebuilt rig for DCS. My R9 runs it great.

there’s a lot of great stuff coming down the rail from Eagle Dynamics and their partners and I am getting ready now. I hope this helps in any way and Welcome again

 

Cheers

 

 

 

[Leg2ion]

Hi @RavenLeader. People here are awesome at responding and providing help - as you are finding out. I have just built my own PC, after some input from here and elsewhere, as last time I built one was around 8 years ago so had completely lost touch with current standards. To be honest building a PC is not that difficult, and there is plenty of subject matter via google etc. Normally take me around an evening (and a bottle of red!). What it does do is give you a good understanding of how it all goes together - so if things do go wrong you know how it was built.

 

My build was:

AMD 5600X

Asus X570-f Rog Strix Motherboard

32 GB DDR4 Ram (2 x 16gb)

500GB m2 NVMe boot drive - Windows/Office etc

2TB m2 SSD 'Games' Drive

2TB SSD for photos/editing etc.

DVD-RW Optical Drive

MSI 3070 GPU

850w Modular PSU

BeQuiet 600 Pure Case

 

Always used to use Scan - and have never had problems with them, though for this build went with CCL as their component prices were slightly lower. 

 

After doing some research have also just purchased headtracking - and went with the DelanClip due to decent pricing and availability.