Proper 21-9 Support

[draconus]

Pressing one key solves the "problem" but you're free to wait for the devs to implement the magic "support" for you, if it ever comes.

Edited May 19, 2021 by draconus

[fapador]

As of now it makes you see more but incompromise of smaller instruments and ground tagets its not correct and we have to make the devs aware of this

[some1]

You can't increase horizontal field of view without making things smaller, because vertical field of view is increased at the same time. That's how computer graphics work. And optics in real life. 

 

As others have said, just zoom out and you'll get more field of view for your ultrawide. The "zoom in/out" key in game works just like FOV slider in mainstream FPS games. 

 

The only thing ED may change, is the default zoom setting, which is the same regardless of the monitor aspect ratio. But the preferable field of view (aka "zoom") is a function of a monitor size, more than the monitor aspect ratio anyway. So there is no single setting that will work for everyone. Which you've already learned, as the game allows you to set wider field of view than what's comfortable for your monitor size. 

Edited May 19, 2021 by some1
Checked in game and DCS already does that.

[draconus]

To make it fair, the fov change can make some things look different and affect visibility. That I cannot argue with.

[fapador]

 

check arma 3 and rise of flight these games work perfectly fine as they are optimised for 21:9. Also I might have mismentioned the issue its not a fov thing its an image cropping problem!

 

Edited May 19, 2021 by fapador

[Rudel_chw]

7 minutes ago, draconus said:

To make it fair, the fov change can make some things look different and affect visibility. That I cannot argue with.

 

Question: What's the correct way to change the FOV value?  .. I was editing the viewAngle parameter for snapview key 5 on the SnapViews.lua file at /Saved Games/DCS/Config/View but it seems to have less effect than I was expecting and also it is a per/plane parameter ... Is there a better way to change the default FOV?

[fapador]

num / and * but you will see it makes things smaller than  16:9 plus higher fov = more distortion

Edited May 19, 2021 by fapador

[Donut]

8 minutes ago, draconus said:

To make it fair, the fov change can make some things look different and affect visibility. That I cannot argue with.

And that is why adjusting the FOV is not the solution.

 

A 16:9 monitor right next to a 21:9 monitor both displaying the exact same image and FOV should be identical except that the 21:9 monitor will display more to the sides which are cut off by the 16:9 display.

[fapador]

Exactly Donut !

[some1]

Guys, there is no other way to show more on a 21:9 monitor than to adjust FOV. Every game does that. It's just in DCS you have to press the zoom key. 

[fapador]

No it doesnt work correct dcs crops image, other games scale properly check this site https://www.wsgf.org/dr/rise-flight-first-great-air-war

[some1]

Like that? https://www.wsgf.org/dr/digital-combat-simulator-10c-warthog

 

DCS already does what you're asking. 

 

I wrote that ED in the future may change the default zoom setting, but they already do that, there's really nothing to fix. Default vertical field of view is the same, the horizontal field of view increases.

 

16:10

24:10

[fapador]

Here we go again. No it doesnt for the rest of the planes. Maybe it is so for the a10 warthog but I dont own that. In the screenshot you provide instruments look smaller. Its not an issue with fov but an image cropping issue. 21:9 users will experience a cropped 16:9 image increasing fov is not the proper remedy. Other games are fine others arent like IL2 sturmovik which suffers of the same issue. its just dcs's mishandling of 21:9 aspect ratios

Edited May 19, 2021 by fapador

[some1]

Which other airplanes have this issue? Hornet looks fine too. 

 

The instruments are not smaller, it's just the forum scales the image preview to constant width. Click on the images to see it in the full resolution.

 

These pictures come straight from my ultrawide monitor. Everything fine here.

 

16: 10 (2560x1600)

 

24:10 (3840x1600)

[draconus]

8 minutes ago, fapador said:

In the screenshot you provide instruments look smaller.

No, open them up fully and compare in two windows. Both are 1600 vertical so it makes it easy to compare. No difference and no distorion.

 

Why don't you specify which module does it wrong? Screenshots please.

[fapador]

You are Right, My bad apparently it works correct in a10 and the flaming cliifs planes BUT NOT for all the rest of the planes I wonder why?

what is 16:10 and 24:10 you mean 16:9 and 21:9 right? dont crop the 21:9 image to make me believe that is the same in 16:9 Instead set the game to 16:9 and compare then! for sure it doesnt work correct for bf109 ,f16 focke wulf and p51 these I remember for sure I will post screenshots when i come back from work

Edited May 19, 2021 by fapador

[Hiob]

54 minutes ago, Donut said:

And that is why adjusting the FOV is not the solution.

 

A 16:9 monitor right next to a 21:9 monitor both displaying the exact same image and FOV should be identical except that the 21:9 monitor will display more to the sides which are cut off by the 16:9 display.

 

That's exactly, where you and OP are wrong and @draconus is right.

The fov determines the horizontal viewing angle. To match it with your physical reality you have to calculate the width of your monitor and your distance from the screen.

 

Say you have the exact same monitor hight and viewing distance, the 21:9 is obviously wider - meaning that your "window" in the DCS World is wider, meaning you have a wider horizontal fov. The Setting of fov has to match that.

 

Unlinking the horizontal zoom from the vertical would lead to distortion.

 

Edit: You can easily calculate the "correct" fov-setting. (correct means "realistic" in regards to your monitor width and viewing distance - doesn't mean that it's useful in a simulation context)

 

Edit2: In regards of the custom setting of views (fov e.g.) for each individual plane I recommend the thread "Proper Neck Mod".

Edited May 19, 2021 by Hiob

[fapador]

I mention again its not a fov issue but an image cropping issue . To see the difference set the game to 16:9 window and compare dont crop the 21:9 image in paint with 16:9 borders. See the rudels screenshots and read carefully Jesus Christ  

 

Edited May 19, 2021 by fapador

[Tippis]

8 minutes ago, fapador said:

See the rudels screenshots and read carefully Jesus Christ 

What Rudel_chw's screenshots show is that he hasn't set the proper wider FoV to match his wider-aspect monitor.

[Donut]

19 minutes ago, Tippis said:

What Rudel_chw's screenshots show is that he hasn't set the proper wider FoV to match his wider-aspect monitor.

So are those of us with 21:9 monitors to just deal with either a vertically cropped display or a zoomed out FOV that distorts the image/zoom level?

 

I bought a 21:9 inch monitor to more realistically simulate a person's natural vision with an increased peripheral view.  You are saying that isn't achievable in DCS...

Edited May 19, 2021 by Donut

[Tippis]

17 minutes ago, Donut said:

So are those of us with 21:9 monitors to just deal with either a vertically cropped display or a zoomed out FOV that distorts the image/zoom level?

No. The correct FoV will spread the same amount of cockpit real estate over the same number of pixels. What us 21:9 users have to deal with is that our “correct FoV” is different from the one 16:9 uses… and 16:10… and 4:3. The only “issue” here is that the way to set your default FoV to match your monitor isn't entirely obvious and immediately accessible, and that it's most likely set to fit a 16:9 aspect ratio out of the box.

 

17 minutes ago, Donut said:

I bought a 21:9 inch monitor to more realistically simulate a person's natural vision with an increased peripheral view.  You are saying that isn't achievable in DCS...

No, we're saying the exact opposite. It's just that it doesn't do that with the default FoV.

Edited May 19, 2021 by Tippis

[Donut]

4 minutes ago, Tippis said:

No. The correct FoV will spread the same amount of cockpit real estate over the same number of pixels.

 

This where I am not understanding things.  A 21:9 has more pixels than  16:9 as well as should display more cockpit real estate horizontally...all while being at the same FOV/zoom level.  

[Hiob]

Jesus Christ folks,

 

it's not that complicated really -

 

You have to devide differ between width and hight of a monitor.

 

With the same width, a 21:9 monitor will show the same size of gauges with the same fov compared to 16:9 monitor BUT WILL HAVE a vertically cropped image for obvious reasons.

With the same hight, a 21:9 monitor will show the same size of gauges without a vertically cropped image, BUT WILL NEED a wider FOV-setting.

 

You can't have it both - that's impossible without warping/distortion of the image (aka oval gauges e.g.)

Seriously, take a piece of paper and draw a proper field of view and your monitor, seat and so on from a top down perspective.

 

Hint: when viewing distance = width of screen a fov of 60 (regardless of monitor aspect ratio) would be "realistic"

(granted - for stereoscopic view, it's a little bit more)

Edited May 19, 2021 by Hiob

[Hiob]

1 hour ago, fapador said:

I mention again its not a fov issue but an image cropping issue . To see the difference set the game to 16:9 window and compare dont crop the 21:9 image in paint with 16:9 borders. See the rudels screenshots and read carefully Jesus Christ  

 

 

 I read carefully - and more important I experimented with this matter for countless hours and did actual math on it.

The point is - you are wrong. There is no issue, only your wrong understanding.

 

I don't want to pick on you, just encourage you to draw it down and do the math.

 

and before you ask. I can test every physical resolution from 32:9 to 16:9 and did so. DCS works fine (in this regard)

[some1]

10 minutes ago, Donut said:

This where I am not understanding things.  A 21:9 has more pixels than  16:9 as well as should display more cockpit real estate horizontally...all while being at the same FOV/zoom level.  

 

DCS already gives you more real estate by default. Check my screenshots.

 

As a side note, 21:9 does not have more pixels. In fact, most ultrawide monitors, except for rare and expensive "5k2k" models, have less pixels than a standard 4k 16:9 screen.