Can we expect a female WSO?

[Hiob]

DCS is a male heavy community. What a shocker.

How does this relate to the option of a female WSO? I don’t see the connection.

[MAXsenna]

So you'll just assume someone's gender by the tone of their voice. Talk about exclusionary.
 

To be fair, neither tone nor gender was mentioned, but now we border on breaking rules.
It would be fantastic if ED could open up so ATC and every voice could be modded in easy way. I'm sure users would flock to get their voice heard.
Personally I find it totally in immersive to hear out of place accents in parts of the sim, and in certain campaigns. But it is what it is currently, but I'm positive it will change.
Cheers!

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk

[TEMPEST.114]

5 hours ago, trevoC said:

Maybe like Elite Dangerous we can pause development of the sim for 2 years and focus on a first person mode that allows you to exit your cockpit and walk around the plane and airport for a bit allowing us to completely customize our characters and lose focus completely on what the sim is about in the first place and then all come to the realization that this was a waste of time and that we'd much prefer any development resources to focus on the point of the simulator in the first place.

Until this thread I had not given even a single moments thought to how similar the pilots may or may not have been to my likeness. Mostly because like other games I can imagine a first person experience however I like and secondly because they are all wearing helmets and suits. When it comes to the voices, if there was a want/need for a female WSO I'm sure a third party could fill it. As a developer myself I think this is a bad idea as I doubt it would have much interest. I doubt I could recover even my cost in modding.

I also doubt that female players of DCS account for any significant numbers at all. I personally have never met one or heard of any online. Obviously I'm sure there are some but I highly doubt their numbers are statistically significant at all. I don't think any product or service should be persuaded to bend to the will of the lowest common denominator.

Entitled privilege. You don't understand it because you're the default that is represented. 

I'm a woman, a real world pilot and have been flying planes and simulators before you were born and there have been many on here vocal (and get harassed and talked down to like you've just done) and silent. 

Grow a little empathy and realise there are other people out there. And keep your Elite Dangerous false equivalency out of DCS. Frontier ruined that game. 

DCS isn't the place for toxicity, whether the masculine kind or just the arrogant, dismissive kind. 

1 hour ago, trevoC said:

Just for reference (not that this is proof or indicative of how many women/girls play DCS, but it is a general indication of audience) which is all I have to go on, but more than you provided and lets be clear, I stated an opinion and expressed the idea that I may be wrong, you made a statement that would appear as fact.

Here is a DCS video from my channel with 80,000 views: thats 80,000 to zero

 

 

Might have something to do with your sexist attitudes and probably immature 'banter' than anything else...

 

[Hiob]

Let's face it. The overwhelming majority here probably couldn't care less or would even like to see female pilots, WSOs, Georginas, ATCs etc. represented in DCS. Why TF not?
They exist in reality after all. The same men probably had no issues whatsoever to play Lara Croft in Tomb Raider back in the day and didn't even think about it twice. (I really can't remember that the gender of protagonists in games/movies was ever much discussed in this day and age... but whatever....)

And then there is a (sometimes very vocal) minority of boys who gets wound up and offended by such things. I don't know what went wrong there - but it's probably best not to feed the trolls.

 

And to be crystal clear and honest: Gender-swapping an old and beloved IP for no other reason but.... Grab your torch and pitchfork - I'll lead the mob....
But that is not what was asked for in this thread.

Edited November 22, 2022 by Hiob

[Eugel]

16 hours ago, trevoC said:

I also doubt that female players of DCS account for any significant numbers at all. I personally have never met one or heard of any online. Obviously I'm sure there are some but I highly doubt their numbers are statistically significant at all. I don't think any product or service should be persuaded to bend to the will of the lowest common denominator.

But that´s not even the point here. Male players could also like to have a female copilot/WSO.
What´s wrong with having this as an option ? 

[trevoC]

10 hours ago, Elphaba said:

and have been flying planes and simulators before you were born

That would be impossible.

10 hours ago, Elphaba said:

and get harassed and talked down to like you've just done

how exactly did I harass you? Please explain.

10 hours ago, Elphaba said:

Frontier ruined that game. 

We definitely agree on some things.

 

10 hours ago, Elphaba said:

DCS isn't the place for toxicity, whether the masculine kind or just the arrogant, dismissive kind. 

I think you have either misinterpreted something I've said, or are reading into my comments with a tone that does not exist.

 

10 hours ago, Elphaba said:

Might have something to do with your sexist attitudes and probably immature 'banter' than anything else...

Or the "fact" that DCS does not have a significant female base. Why would the above be your assumption? this comment is more toxic than anything I have said.

[trevoC]

8 minutes ago, Eugel said:

But that´s not even the point here. Male players could also like to have a female copilot/WSO.
What´s wrong with having this as an option ? 

Nothing. I never said there was anything wrong with having a female copilot/WSO. you missed the point. I don't care the gender of the copilot or WSO. Had any developer made the default a female I wouldn't have thought twice about it until this post. My only point is that I think this topic is insignificant. That being said, I stand by my original point that a developer or studio or anyone else should not feel obligated to  comply with the lowest common denominator which in this case I believe is female players. If I were to have to bet on those numbers, I'm guessing that they are statistically insignificant. From a developers standpoint (or any realist instead of some woke dreamer) a waste of time. That may sound harsh, but that is the reality. Its possible I'm wrong, in which case I would be truly interested in any data that supports an opposing opinion to this as I would find that truly fascinating that I was so completely off base.

[Nahen]

19 hours ago, trevoC said:

why would I be joking? you claimed "There are quite a lot of women/girls flying at DCS". I'm sure you wouldn't make such a statement without some sort of information in regards to it. 

Personally, I doubt it, but I don't know this for a fact. If you do, I'd like to be shown otherwise. I'd consider it pretty interesting if that was fact.

Where do you get the idea that there are "quite a lot of women/girls flying at DCS"?

Since on the public servers of the Virtual Fighter Wing of which I was a member, or on the servers of another community, of which I was also a member a few years ago, there were regularly women / girls flying as part of community squadrons or as unaffiliated. I dare say that in other communities of other countries it is similar . Both communities have 4 servers each, with at least 100-150 people active on both community Discord. About 10% of them are women/girls. I don't need much research, just based on what I see. I would like to add that the Polish 304th Virtual Fighter Wing has recently prepared, in cooperation with a girl who is currently at the Air Force Academy, a video material from a typical SEAD mission in DCS - cooperation, communication, etc. as part of her final home work. Besides, it's probably not only in our air force that women fly fighter jets. If you think that DCS is the "kingdom of guys" then you probably don't even know how many times you've been beaten by a girl on public PvP servers

[trevoC]

What I find amusing about individuals who pretend to hold some moral high ground in this conversation is that the act of trying to insult me by stating "beaten by a girl" would only hold weight by someone who thought that getting beaten by a girl was somehow insulting. I'm not sure how any of these statements are relevant at all.

 

[Nahen]

48 minutes ago, trevoC said:

What I find amusing about individuals who pretend to hold some moral high ground in this conversation is that the act of trying to insult me by stating "beaten by a girl" would only hold weight by someone who thought that getting beaten by a girl was somehow insulting. I'm not sure how any of these statements are relevant at all.

 

Honestly? I have absolutely no interest in what would offend you, etc. I react to your vision of a DCS world without women. You are very wrong to assume that they are a "minor part" of the fun. For me, 10% (and I bet it could be more) is a hell of a lot.
That I mention the fact of not knowing how many times (assuming you fly on public PvP servers) you've been shot down by a "girl" is just a simple statement of fact. Just because you haven't consciously met a Shaolin monk doesn't mean they don't exist. Just like the fact that you haven't seen many things in the world that you only know about from stories, television, radio, books, etc.

I assure you that a woman / girl in DCS is not a phenomenon on the scale of Bigfoot or Yeti ...

Bay the way, this fact does not appeal to me at all for the need to introduce "female voices" other than "BitchinBetty" to modules or "female" models of remotes, etc. This is pure stupidity having absolutely nothing to do with discrimination against anyone.

[Silver_Dragon]

Dont break the rules folks... 1.1 / 1.2...

[BIGNEWY]

OK this conversation is done, it is not going anywhere.