Any speculation about Pico 4

[Bearskin]

Hey Flight Guy, Real DCS Pilot, I haven't fired up DCS for a couple of weeks, I just upgraded to the Blackshark lll and fired up DCS and Open composite doesn't seem to work anymore, I am just wondering if it is still working OK for you. Cheers.

Edited December 20, 2022 by Bearskin

[RealDCSpilot]

I actually never use Open Composite or any of the other VR compositor hacks like OpenXR toolkit etc. These are actually made for WMR headsets like the HP Reverb G2. I only run just VD and SteamVR and it performs and looks better than with my former Valve Index.

[propeler]

On 12/22/2022 at 9:07 AM, RealDCSpilot said:

just VD and SteamVR

RT3080. VD + SteamVR. Works good without any hacks.

[propeler]

Do someone have both Pimax 8KX and Pico 4? 

 

[cerebrave]

On 12/25/2022 at 1:31 AM, propeler said:

Do someone have both Pimax 8KX and Pico 4? 

 

I think only a very few people may do.  Because the two headsets are in a very far away in term of their pricing segment, i.e. prosumer vs consumer.  Youtouber may have both of them (MRTV for example).  So go ahead visit their channel to get their views, as I did.
From my own understanding coming from multiple youtube reviews,  I would think the 8KX will beat pico4 in term of FOV and overall picture quality,  while Pico 4 will beat 8KX mostly in term of comfort, simplicity, and price.  
The question will be whether the price gap justifies the increase of picture quality?  If money is no object, go for the higher segment.  I did consider pimax once, but I leave it out mostly due to the practicality of the headset, and the better feeling of value that pico4 brings.
 

(I also play beatsaber very often, so I dont think I play pimax with that huge log and cables in my face, also I’d hate to alternate headset between my wireless quest2 and pimax switching between games.  So pico4 is an ideal upgrade to my existing quest2).

Edited December 26, 2022 by cerebrave

[Johnny Dioxin]

I was really cautious about buying the Pico 4. Now I have, I'm so pleased I did - it's a great headset that doesn't get the credit it deserves. I can understand why it isn't sold in the US, but that choice does mean they get a lot less "air time".

Vertical FOV is on a par with Index as far as my feeling goes (if not the actual numbers), though horizontal FOV seems a little less - I'm using the glasses/spectacles spacer until my prescription lenses arrive so can't give a definitive opinion on that. I think start-up is quicker than either the Index or Quest 2 - it's very quick for me, though I only have two apps on mine. I do hope for some higher resolutions at some stage, though. Can't see me bothering with Quest 3, though I was already not keen on going that way.

[Mr_sukebe]

On 12/13/2022 at 7:07 PM, RealDCSpilot said:

Ehm, no? Even with a 3080 you should be able to run the "Ultra" profile. Going 4090 is just my personal choice. And this here:

is also in the works...
Pico is keeping up with enhancing the software, nothing to worry about. The Pico 4 is currently one of the best PCVR headsets and not just because of it's price.

 

 

Have you seen any news about them bringing in OpenXR?

[Johnny Dioxin]

Anyone with a Pico 4 that wants a new gasket - you can get one from eBay (both UK and US). Price varies, but around £22-23 and just under $30. Usual month for delivery.

I expect the pad to be garbage, so it will help if you have some already - or you can order them directly from the likes of VR Covers. The pads all use velcro so no worries about fitting - I swap mine about all the time with ones for Rift CV1, Quest, Quest 2 and Index and it's no big deal.

Link

This is the only proper one I could find and I spent a lot of time searching. No doubt the usual commercial types will spring up after a while, but the only other ones I found were bodges involving using the glasses spacer, sticky velcro and an old pad! Apparently this gives a big increase in horizontal FOV!

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

On 12/20/2022 at 8:13 PM, Bearskin said:

Hey Flight Guy, Real DCS Pilot, I haven't fired up DCS for a couple of weeks, I just upgraded to the Blackshark lll and fired up DCS and Open composite doesn't seem to work anymore, I am just wondering if it is still working OK for you. Cheers.

 

Sorry for the lack of reply. I was off the country for over a week and now I am almost back in business, waiting for my new computer to arrive.

To answer your question, I have not check BS3 yet in VR, but OpenXR only works with the SteamVR version.

On 12/22/2022 at 8:07 AM, RealDCSpilot said:

I actually never use Open Composite or any of the other VR compositor hacks like OpenXR toolkit etc. These are actually made for WMR headsets like the HP Reverb G2. I only run just VD and SteamVR and it performs and looks better than with my former Valve Index.

I suppose OpenXR and OpenComposite are 2 different things, more like layers on top of each other. I don't think they are hacks, but I am not here to argue about definition. The merits of having OpenXR + OpenCompsite is performance gain. It is way better in performance than SteamVR alone. Not to mention there is no loading screen stuttering, and OpenXR also provides some sort of reshade.

[dburne]

22 minutes ago, VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants said:

Sorry for the lack of reply. I was off the country for over a week and now I am almost back in business, waiting for my new computer to arrive.

To answer your question, I have not check BS3 yet in VR, but OpenXR only works with the SteamVR version.

I suppose OpenXR and OpenComposite are 2 different things, more like layers on top of each other. I don't think they are hacks, but I am not here to argue about definition. The merits of having OpenXR + OpenCompsite is performance gain. It is way better in performance than SteamVR alone. Not to mention there is no loading screen stuttering, and OpenXR also provides some sort of reshade.

 

Techinally I would call it a Mod as it requires a dll file to be inserted. Same with getting Open XR to work in the sim. MSFS 2020 is only flight sim I am aware of that has native Open XR support hence no need for Open Composite or dll file insertion.

Most do report even with running through both of those an increase in performance. Mine seemed to be slight, and I really did not care for going down that rabbit hole of all the tweaks one can do with Open XR Tookit so I reverted back to the simpler Steam VR.

[No1sonuk]

On 11/30/2022 at 7:32 AM, VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants said:

Upgrade to a USC-C charging hub with Giga-ehternet for PCVR

 

How is this set up?

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

Get a USB hub which supports USB-C charging, with Ethernet, and must have a USB-C connector, which the last one is used to connect to the HMD. Connect the ethernet to the same WiFi hub as your computer and connect to a USB power source via a USB-C cable. Strap the whole hub onto the Pico 4 as shown.

Mine is the "SSK USB-C Hub 8-in-1 Type C Multiport hub adaptor". It is just one of the many available on the market.

[No1sonuk]

7 hours ago, VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants said:

Get a USB hub which supports USB-C charging, with Ethernet, and must have a USB-C connector, which the last one is used to connect to the HMD. Connect the ethernet to the same WiFi hub as your computer and connect to a USB power source via a USB-C cable. Strap the whole hub onto the Pico 4 as shown.

Mine is the "SSK USB-C Hub 8-in-1 Type C Multiport hub adaptor". It is just one of the many available on the market.

Thanks.
What about the software and settings?
There's so much to and fro in this thread, I lost track of USB tethering, Wifi 6, USB 3.2, VD, SA, SteamVR, etc.

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

20 hours ago, No1sonuk said:

What about the software and settings?

Please kindly elaborate.  Thank you.

[No1sonuk]

53 minutes ago, VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants said:

Please kindly elaborate.  Thank you.

There's a lot of conflicting info in this thread about which streaming software to use and how.
What software and settings do you use with that setup?

[Johnny Dioxin]

I highly recommend VR Lens Labs (Gauss Tech) for their prescription lenses. I've used them for all of my headsets since 2016. I did try other makes but none were as reliable or consistently able to produce the goods. To say nothing of customer service for either general queries or when something isn't right, which I didn't get when I had an issue with lenses bought from another brand who basically told me to get lost after I took the lenses to an optician who told me they had been put into the frames at the wrong rotational angle - they were useless to me.

The only thing that led to me trying other brands was the long delivery times for Lens Labs. Not any more, though - they've really upped their game. I ordered my Pico prescription lenses on the 19th and they arrived yesterday. That's just 10 days, including Christmas! That's some turnaround rate. Maybe it's down to them now using FedEx.

The lenses themselves are excellent - with magnetic frames that have little pins for proper locating and to stop them moving. First class - and no issues with warping etc, they are very clear and make my experience so much better - I'd been using specs up to now.

Now I'm just waiting for my new face gasket to arrive, which will hopefully also give me a slight increase in horizontal FOV and I'll be all set and a very happy teddy with my Pico 4

[dburne]

25 minutes ago, Johnny Dioxin said:

I highly recommend VR Lens Labs (Gauss Tech) for their prescription lenses. I've used them for all of my headsets since 2016. I did try other makes but none were as reliable or consistently able to produce the goods. To say nothing of customer service for either general queries or when something isn't right, which I didn't get when I had an issue with lenses bought from another brand who basically told me to get lost after I took the lenses to an optician who told me they had been put into the frames at the wrong rotational angle - they were useless to me.

The only thing that led to me trying other brands was the long delivery times for Lens Labs. Not any more, though - they've really upped their game. I ordered my Pico prescription lenses on the 19th and they arrived yesterday. That's just 10 days, including Christmas! That's some turnaround rate. Maybe it's down to them now using FedEx.

The lenses themselves are excellent - with magnetic frames that have little pins for proper locating and to stop them moving. First class - and no issues with warping etc, they are very clear and make my experience so much better - I'd been using specs up to now.

Now I'm just waiting for my new face gasket to arrive, which will hopefully also give me a slight increase in horizontal FOV and I'll be all set and a very happy teddy with my Pico 4

 

I thought I would give them a try just to compare how they were to my VR Optician Lens with my Aero. Waste of time and money for me, total crap. Never could get them mounted. VR Optician goes on so nice and easy, these VR Lens Lab inserts I received today - not even close. They have the appearance of being slightly larger than my VR Optician Lenses but who knows. Struggled with them a good part of the afternoon and never could get them on so said screw it ain't worth the frustration.  I will be passing the word on to fellow Varjo users on Discord as well. VR Optician is the way to go with Aero. These were a total waste of money for me.

 

Edited December 29, 2022 by dburne

[Johnny Dioxin]

VR Optician are the ones I had issues with - as described in my post, and they didn't want to know. "We did it right, so it's not our problem" end of subject.

Swings and roundabouts.

Did you bother speaking to Lens Labs support?

Edited December 30, 2022 by Johnny Dioxin

[dburne]

29 minutes ago, Johnny Dioxin said:

VR Optician are the ones I had issues with - as described in my post, and they didn't want to know. "We did it right, so it's not our problem" end of subject.

Swings and roundabouts.

Did you bother speaking to Lens Labs support?

 

No. Decided to just put my VR Optician Lenses back in ( very easily) before I kept screwing around with it and end up scratching a lens. Lesson learned for me. I did not even get to compare them.  No lens insert should be that difficult to put in. I noticed they also did not seem to have the same type of tabs on them as the VR Optician Lenses.

Perhaps tomorrow I will have cooled off and feel a little different and write their support showing my frustration with their mess. Will see not sure I want to waste any more time on it.

Edited December 30, 2022 by dburne

[Gunnars Driver]

9 hours ago, dburne said:

 

I thought I would give them a try just to compare how they were to my VR Optician Lens with my Aero. Waste of time and money for me, total crap. Never could get them mounted. VR Optician goes on so nice and easy, these VR Lens Lab inserts I received today - not even close. They have the appearance of being slightly larger than my VR Optician Lenses but who knows. Struggled with them a good part of the afternoon and never could get them on so said screw it ain't worth the frustration.  I will be passing the word on to fellow Varjo users on Discord as well. VR Optician is the way to go with Aero. These were a total waste of money for me.

 

 

VR Optician was perfect for me on the Reverb. Only needed one lens to that one. 

For Varjo they also fit perfect but for one eye did not get the right strength so it is not sharp. I need to get that fixed, otherwise the quality and the mounting is perfect. 

Varjo has a quite close viewing distance (90cm?), so it probably cause other people to need lenses than the reverb.

[dburne]

26 minutes ago, Gunnars Driver said:

VR Optician was perfect for me on the Reverb. Only needed one lens to that one. 

For Varjo they also fit perfect but for one eye did not get the right strength so it is not sharp. I need to get that fixed, otherwise the quality and the mounting is perfect. 

Varjo has a quite close viewing distance (90cm?), so it probably cause other people to need lenses than the reverb.

 

I wrote my opinion to support yesterday evening, had an email this morning - describing how to take them out of the headset on the Aero lol. I guess I just reverse that procedure. I don't know I tried every way I could think of yesterday, may give it at least another shot later on in the morning today.

 

[RealDCSpilot]

On 12/26/2022 at 6:01 PM, Mr_sukebe said:

Have you seen any news about them bringing in OpenXR?

This is a misunderstanding by many people. OpenXR has to be implemented by ED. It's about time to get rid of the current implemented OpenVR and OculusVR APIs. Hopefully this comes with the multi core engine upgrade. All current available VR HMDs support OpenXR, it's already integrated in SteamVR and the other VR Compositors. And of course the Pico 4 can run a native OpenXR application. Via VD and SteamVR for instance. The problem is, that the only real OpenXR game that i know and play is MSFS2020. All the other mentions of "OpenXR" in the VR sim community are about wrappers that do middleman translation from OpenVR or Oculus API to OpenXR in SteamVR or WMR or OpenComposite as VR compositors. The reason for all of this is mostly WMR, the most inferior VR compositor. Sadly the main VR compositor of the beloved HP Reverb series. If HP would have chosen one of the already established standard VR compositors, nobody would ever needed to program all those hacks.

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

On 12/29/2022 at 11:13 PM, No1sonuk said:

There's a lot of conflicting info in this thread about which streaming software to use and how.
What software and settings do you use with that setup?

I only use Virtual Desktop for Pico4 (to be precise) which runs great. No complicated setting, just select the option based on your GPU. I just put SteamVR video resolution to "Auto" and leave it there.

I just got my new desktop with RTX 4090. I am making another round of comparison video with Quest 2 (OpenComposite), Pico 4 in Oculus runtime, Pico 4 (OpenComposite +SteamVR) abd Pico 4 (SteamVR).

Edited December 31, 2022 by VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants

[No1sonuk]

2 hours ago, VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants said:

I only use Virtual Desktop for Pico4 (to be precise) which runs great. No complicated setting, just select the option based on your GPU. I just put SteamVR video resolution to "Auto" and leave it there.

I guess I need to be more explicit...
What exact steps are required to be taken to get that setup to work?

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

I may have pushing my settings too far: