Any speculation about Pico 4

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

If I order from Amazon, I can always return, so I decide to give this a go.  I read from some VR YouTube Channels that this is a very good PCVR headset, with QA issues. One even compare it with Quest PRO and well, I some what prefer the Pico 4 visual...

[RealDCSpilot]

In my case, i bought the Pico 4 just out of curiosity. Those huge lenses, per eye resolution and resulting FOV caught my attention. To my surprise it turned out to be a very capable HMD, shockingly cheap but also a true swiss army knife. My Index is now collecting dust and the Pico 4 is my daily driver.
Just one of it's advantages, it's a normal "open" Android device. You can do whatever you want with it, it's not hold hostage by it's manufacturer.
I got PMs asking about how to use the USB tethering method for the streaming connection, so here is a step by step guide:

This gives you the best possible data rate with a bit less latency, fully independent of your Wifi network capabilities.
- get a 10G USB 3.2 cable (fibre optic cores for data transfer, 5 meters long etc.)
- use a USB 3.2 connector on your PC
- enable developer mode on the Pico 4:

- for standard android settings, get this apk copy it to the Pico4 and install it there: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1PUTpT9boTKssDXQ2qUCLxOKM3LPxQtlA/view
- a new app for system settings appears, run it and enable USB tethering
- now check your network settings in Windows, a new connection should appear - set this to private
- now run the Virtual Desktop streamer on Windows and start Virtual Desktop on the Pico 4 (it needs to be connected over Wifi to the internet at the start, VD's copy protection...)
- let VD establish it's standard streaming connection until you see your Windows desktop in the HMD
- give it a couple of seconds, then switch off Wifi on the Pico 4
- Virtual Desktop should now run on USB tethering automatically
- start Steam VR on your PC
- run DCS...

Pico's Streaming Assistant can also use this connection, choose the Wifi method and there should appear two possible connections (or with Wifi off, only the USB network).

Edited November 18, 2022 by RealDCSpilot

[RealDCSpilot]

You can also mod it for Valve Index sound quality:




But sadly you will loose USB tethering because the Logitech Chorus USB passthrough only allows charging. Luckily i sit in the same room with my Wifi5 router. I use the USB cable to keep the HMD charged for longer sessions (plugged into the wall charger).

I also use prescription lenses, for the best visual experience without the need to wear my glasses: https://vroptician.com/prescription-lens-inserts/pico-4
Those frames around the pancake lenses are prepared for modding with magnets. They snap on automatically, very thoughtful design!
Other 3rd party accessories are in the making, like better face gaskets etc. Watch out for stuff made by GeekVR and VRcover ...

Edited November 18, 2022 by RealDCSpilot

[vladimusmaximus]

Welp, my Pico 4 is going back for a refund. As much as I wanted to like it, I just can't get over the pin cushion and the poor streaming quality. Guess I'll wait for the Quest 3 / Pimax Crystal.

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

On the other hand, mine arrives today. First impressions:

Like:

1. Really light, really balanced
2. The covering is just right, no leakage; comfortable enough but I am spoiled by VR Cover so...
3. The eye pieces are really large! No glare noted.
4. Better FoV but not enough to write home about, need more investigation.
5. The black seems to be much better than Quest2
6. IPD adjust by 0.5mm, nice
7. VD looks really great until...

Not like so much:

1. The default environment is not so sharp but it is very minor
2. Very annoyed to find SteamVR has not improved in the last 2 years!!! It is a pain in the neck! I want OpenXR!!!
3. Cannot use hand tracking when setting up the play boundary which is quite annoying
4. PCVR function is still need a lot of improvement.
5. My PC still unable to run DCS under SteamVR like it should be, I should upgrade and try again.

 

[Pride37]

8 hours ago, RealDCSpilot said:

Those frames around the pancake lenses are prepared for modding with magnets. They snap on automatically, very thoughtful design!

That's trully one of the smartest moves of all the VR industry... I'm bothered with the thickness of my VROptician prescription lenses in my G2, and I couldn't believe how thin the ones for the Pico 4 are!

[RealDCSpilot]

16 hours ago, vladimusmaximus said:

Welp, my Pico 4 is going back for a refund. As much as I wanted to like it, I just can't get over the pin cushion and the poor streaming quality. Guess I'll wait for the Quest 3 / Pimax Crystal.

Oh no, don't do that. Streaming quality is awesome with Virtual Desktop if set right and 3rd party face gaskets are already on their way.

[RealDCSpilot]

@VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants

I have a very clean and stable experience with SteamVR beta since forever (okay: 2016). Something on your machine must be set up badly or interfere. With Virtual Desktop everything works pretty automatically and reliable. And SteamVR provides both VR APIs, OpenVR and OpenXR. It's DCS that has to implement proper OpenXR support. The OpenXR hack that WMR headsets use is just a wrapper.

[cerebrave]

Guys,

I’m from Q2 user here (driven by 3080 10G) and is in a crossroad whether I should purchase P4 or wait for Q3.  (Qpro is definetely a big NoNo - not because its price, but because the features I have to pay that I won’t use - facetracking, camera controllers, etc).

I’m using standalone DCS, and in Q2, the VD fps is always like 10-15fps worse than the native Quest Airlink (both wireless method).  This make me worry that in P4, as of today, the VD is the better solution for PCVR (given the compression artifacts exist in the native P4 pcvr).  Because if they do, it means I have to deal with lower fps if I adopt P4.
So, May I ask for VD user of P4, do you see a different fps performance between VD and the native method?.  I’m also wondering whether my worse VD fps in Q2 was due to the standalone DCS or anything else?  (My VD resulting like 42fps compared to 55fps in F16 training mission 5 - my testbed). 
 

thanks for any suggestions or shared views.

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

Is there any chance we get VD to have direct support of USB tethering? Anyway, I heard that another solution is via WI-FI dongle of which a private wireless connection can be established without going through the router.

To prove that Pico4 can use OpenXR + OpenComposite, here is a video:

In HMD video capture is bad, I guess I need to redo it if I had time.

[Bearskin]

Just a heads up, so this morning I had a push notification on my mobile about the Pico Black Friday sale, so I logged into the Pico app on my phone to check it out. Anyway, later on I enabled Wi-Fi on my phone to check my banking app and a load of texts came through from my friends and family. I replied to a text, and it wouldn't send, so I enabled Wi-Fi, and it sent the message. WTF maybe the network is down. Nope network is up, I did a soft reset on my phone and the texts still wouldn't send unless I enabled Wi-Fi. Then I remembered about the Pico message, so I deleted the Pico app and now my messages send normally. Thats some scary sh** right there. 

 

Edit,

So now I can't receive texts unless I enable Wi-Fi, but I can send them normally. Headset is going back.

Edited November 20, 2022 by Bearskin

[Bearskin]

So I reset my phone and got everything working again, the Pico app is not going on my phone again. Do not trust it at all.

 

A big thanks to Flight Guy, DCS now runs without Steam and what an improvement. Thanks mate.

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

Credit goes to @RealDCSpilot, I just made a video.

[Bearskin]

Thanks, RealDCSpilot I am able to run all but the Apache and Black shark at much higher settings now I don't have to use SteamVR, 

Edited November 21, 2022 by Bearskin

[Gruman]

So the number of happy Pico 4 users is growing? @VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants, is your Video in the Hornet at night shot while using the Pico 4?

Thanks

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

To be frank, my computer is still "too weak" to produce any high quality video with Pico4 and the software side of Pico is still very lacking, especially when compared to the mature and constantly improving Quest. I have order a bigger rig... Please tolerate with the Quest2 videos for the time being.

The night time PG video was made way before I ordered the Pico4. Thank you for your interest in my silly productions.

[cerebrave]

3 hours ago, VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants said:

To be frank, my computer is still "too weak" to produce any high quality video with Pico4 and the software side of Pico is still very lacking, especially when compared to the mature and constantly improving Quest. I have order a bigger rig... Please tolerate with the Quest2 videos for the time being.

The night time PG video was made way before I ordered the Pico4. Thank you for your interest in my silly productions.

Since you own and are playing with both Q2 and P4, would you mind sharing here, considering with a similar resolution and bitrate, how does the fps compared between the two headsets?  How Do they differ in term of performance? what will be the best method of connection used in the current state?  
 

You have mentioned before that P4 PCVR is still need some improvement.  How does this translated in term of fps?

Thanks a lot.  This will help me decide whether or not to replace my Q2.

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

Since I am being called out, even though I have no idea why me, I have to respond.

Honestly, my current computer cannot push Quest2 to its fullest glory, let alone the even more powerful Pico4. If you think VR video are no good by nature, I have watched a lot more that are way better than mine, not by monster Aero or Pixma or something, which are made using Quest2 or something of that level.

So my answer would be, on paper, Pico4 should win, but it is currently hindered by PCVR software. VD does not use the USB cable link by default, it requires the user to do a couple of steps before fully utilise the benefits of the USB link, where as in Quest2 is just 2 buttons away to become a PCVR headset.

In short, I dunno. Even though over the past weekend, I had quite a strong tendency of returning the Pico4 but now, instead, I am investing in a higher-speed 20Gps USB-C cable and a lens cover for it.

Not to mention, a 5800-X3D based new computer with the mighty RTX-4090.

Edited November 22, 2022 by VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants

[RealDCSpilot]

11 hours ago, Gruman said:

So the number of happy Pico 4 users is growing? @VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants, is your Video in the Hornet at night shot while using the Pico 4?

Thanks

Yeah, retired my Valve Index because of it. It will be my daily driver until a really good new HMD is getting released. (something like the Valve Index 2)

Edited November 22, 2022 by RealDCSpilot

[Max Thunder]

1 hour ago, RealDCSpilot said:

Yeah, retired my Valve Index because of it. It will be my daily driver until a really good new HMD is getting released. (something like the Valve Index 2)

 

What settings do you use in VD and DCS? With usb tethering the P4 could be an alternative to my quest2. I am a little bit worried that my system can’t handle the resolution required to max out the P4.

Edited November 22, 2022 by Max Thunder

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

If you are in the US and don't mind the cable problem and smaller sweet spot of the Reverb G2, the HP site sells one at USD299.99

Edited November 22, 2022 by VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants

[dburne]

4 hours ago, RealDCSpilot said:

Yeah, retired my Valve Index because of it. It will be my daily driver until a really good new HMD is getting released. (something like the Valve Index 2)

 

 

Man oh man, if they stayed devoted to native PC-VR I would love to see what Valve would do with an Index 2. The Index is so dated now yet still sells fairly well. Not too mention the even greater sales of Lighthouse 2.0 trackers as other headsets utilize them now also. I use em with my Aero.

[RealDCSpilot]

10 hours ago, Max Thunder said:

What settings do you use in VD and DCS? With usb tethering the P4 could be an alternative to my quest2. I am a little bit worried that my system can’t handle the resolution required to max out the P4.

 

Ultra setting in VD, 3010x3010 pixels per eye in SteamVR. I'm using the Wifi connection and the 5m USB cable in the wall charger. (When my new computer arrives i will crank up the resolution) Right now i have more fps and better image quality than with my Index (ran it at 2880x3200 per eye). The P4 is not just an alternative to the Quest2, it's his nemesis

Edited November 23, 2022 by RealDCSpilot

[Max Thunder]

Thanks a lot! What are your DCS settings and fps in a F14 quick start mission? Just to compare it with my Quest2. Our systems should nearly the same.

 

Edit: Maybe I will order a P4 to test it. According to you must be really great.

Edited November 23, 2022 by Max Thunder

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

Order from a place where you can return for free.  Good luck.