Mission 4 - 9 line

[phillik747]

I'm really enjoying the campaign and love the immersion into the feel of a squadron.  The SOPs for departure and arrivals are great too.
I have a question about the first 9-line.

Spoiler

I just flew mission 4 and was a bit confused on talking to sandman 5-1 when giving the 'in' call.  I was 4nm 265 radial from the target L/L and heading 085 at 15,000.  I continued to get the 'blind' call every time I tried the call 'in.'  I even tried flying from the East (heading 265, bearing 085) just to see if I wasn't thinking right, and still same calls. 

Thank you

Edited March 24, 2023 by phillik747
change baring to radial

[ChillNG]

4 hours ago, phillik747 said:

I'm really enjoying the campaign and love the immersion into the feel of a squadron.  The SOPs for departure and arrivals are great too.
I have a question about the first 9-line.

  Hide contents

I just flew mission 4 and was a bit confused on talking to sandman 5-1 when giving the 'in' call.  I was 4nm 265 radial from the target L/L and heading 085 at 15,000.  I continued to get the 'blind' call every time I tried the call 'in.'  I even tried flying from the East (heading 265, bearing 085) just to see if I wasn't thinking right, and still same calls. 

Thank you

 

Hi, the blind call means the JTAC can't see you, which is because you are too high and above the cloud layer.  Get below the clouds and all should be ok.  Only thing to bear in mind is that since the mission was designed moving clouds were introduced so if the clouds were actually still blocking his line of sight I don't know...might require a slight suspension of belief if not.

[phillik747]

That makes sense.  I was below the layer from what was rendered on my pc. Even when coming down the shoot I was continuing to call 'In' and same blind call. I'll try lower from the IP and report.  I was trying to stay above 10,000 AGL

[Crimson_Ghost138]

Having the exact same issue, but will try it lower, thx!

 

EDIT: Yes, lower altitude (below clouds) did do the trick!

Edited March 24, 2023 by Crimson_Ghost138

[phillik747]

Sorry for the late reply.  After trying lower, <9,000 MSL, I was able to get a 'cleared hot.' 

[ChillNG]

55 minutes ago, phillik747 said:

Sorry for the late reply.  After trying lower, <9,000 MSL, I was able to get a 'cleared hot.' 

Ok thanks, good stuff 

[xflyer]

4 hours ago, phillik747 said:

Sorry for the late reply.  After trying lower, <9,000 MSL, I was able to get a 'cleared hot.' 

Did you manage to kill the second target? I dropped 3 MK82s and emptied my gun into it, but kept getting reattack calls. Finally flew away with the JTAC no doubt cursing me.

[phillik747]

Yes, I used gun on the first North target, and 1 bomb on the second South target.  I had to use the last 3 82's on the last target.  Made two runs when it was moving and missed.  The last one got it, just wait until it stops. CCIP 30 degree dive.   If CCIP isn't your thing, then setup a practice mission dropping 82's on armor so you don't have to re-run the mission multiple times.

[xflyer]

12 hours ago, phillik747 said:

Yes, I used gun on the first North target, and 1 bomb on the second South target.  I had to use the last 3 82's on the last target.  Made two runs when it was moving and missed.  The last one got it, just wait until it stops. CCIP 30 degree dive.   If CCIP isn't your thing, then setup a practice mission dropping 82's on armor so you don't have to re-run the mission multiple times.

It was probably the dive angle and not using CCIP. Used CCIP on the first target and got it right away, then tried CCRP with the DMT on the second one in a pretty shallow attack. Kept nailing the building, not the units.

[kikimora]

Hi, I am having great time with this campaign, got really obsessed. But in mission 4 I realized how poor military pilot player I am ;-). Is there any advice for newbie like me how not to get hit by AAA? I did M04 twice today. The first time I killed both TGT 01 and 02, managed to kill the T-72 but got hit during the "show of force" part. During my second attempt I got hit and damaged already during the attack on TGT 02. Due to cloud layer it is necessary to fly below 10 MSL which probably makes me an easy target. I am trying to figure out how to use countermeasures but those AAA attacks come without a (radar) warning. I managed to RTB during my second attempt but I gave up on attacking the T-72 which makes me feel miserable...

Edited April 3, 2023 by kikimora

[phillik747]

@kikimora, The AAA in mission 4 was unguided so make sure you keep your speed up (>400kts) and don't stay low for longer than needed.  Stay to the South of the target area, but when you do your bomb runs, come from the South West (265 radial from the target) and egress to the South East and orbit to the right, back to the South West.  In other words, if looking at a clock, fly in on the 7-8 o'clock position and egress anywhere from the 3-6 o'clock position.  Don't turn North since that will put you closer to AAA as you orbit.  Changing your altitude and your heading, while going fast, makes it harder for the gunners to hit you.

When I did the show of force I came in from the South and flew up the road and pulled up and to the right to egress to the East.
Here is a chapter out of the T45 Weapons/Strike Flight Training Instructions manual.  Imagine the image below but to the right vs left.  (Pilots like left due to flying props and the 'pull' of the prop in a climb is more to the left.)  I setup the attack cone of 4-5 miles and basically did this, but at AV-8B speeds.

Manual P-1209

Edited April 5, 2023 by phillik747
Typos :/

[kikimora]

The best thing about your advice is not that it actually helped me to finish the mission to my complete satisfaction but that it demonstrates how helpful people can be found here. Thank you!

[phillik747]

@kikimora I'm glad it worked out for you and I appreciate the comment! I find myself on the side of we are all here for the love of military aircraft and tactics and enjoy helping build that community! 

[Solemn-laugh]

The more I learn, the more I realise I have to learn . Thanks all for the insights. 

[andyn]

1) Are the target coords intentionally for Sandman 5-1 and not the target? They clearly point at the group of Humvees.

2) Where is the IP on the western edge of the green zone? There is none on the actual map, it's just one huge patch of various shades of brown. I've tried calling IP inbound on multiple locations along the attack heading from above the river to the outskirts of the town to no avail.

[ChillNG]

17 hours ago, andyn said:

1) Are the target coords intentionally for Sandman 5-1 and not the target? They clearly point at the group of Humvees.

2) Where is the IP on the western edge of the green zone? There is none on the actual map, it's just one huge patch of various shades of brown. I've tried calling IP inbound on multiple locations along the attack heading from above the river to the outskirts of the town to no avail.

No the coords given are the enemy position, however it is fairly close to the friendly position so it can be an easy mistake to make.  The enemy position is about 300m to the northeast of the humvees.

The green zone, is the name for the area with vegetation in it, so a mix of brown and green - you'll see it outlined in the kneeboard.  My suggestion would be to create a waypoint from the coords given, then set a course line from this waypoint of 085 (your attack heading).  Fly this course line, when you hit the point where the sand becomes vegetation, you should be in the correct position..

Hope the helps!

You can see me demonstrate this on this exact task at around 7 mins in this video (note I deliberately do it wrong to start with):

 

Edited May 10, 2023 by ChillNG

[Parasiticus]

a why isn't the dcs default 9th line that can be auto-loaded on the cas page? 

[ChillNG]

20 minutes ago, Parasiticus said:

a why isn't the dcs default 9th line that can be auto-loaded on the cas page? 

As it's all custom built and you can't link into the aircraft's CAS page via the mission editor. 

[Parasiticus]

8 часов назад, ChillNG сказал:

As it's all custom built and you can't link into the aircraft's CAS page via the mission editor. 

that's understandable, but couldn't you have done it through dcs jtag?

[ChillNG]

1 hour ago, Parasiticus said:

that's understandable, but couldn't you have done it through dcs jtag?

Not the way I like to do things.  My system allows me a lot more fidelity over how the attack is controlled and the conditions for approving the attack, adds another level of immersion to the gameplay.  Plus I hate having the default comms voice from the default JTAC playing when the player/JTAC are taking in different voices.

[Delta-canard]

A really great mission! I was happy to pass this mission fairly rapidly (not actually first try because of my computer crashing or RL interfering) but not with full score. I can fairly reliably hit the first two targets with single Mk 82s, I really struggle to find and destroy the tank. I went back to the armor training range where I did fairly good but I'd rely on hotspot chevrons to find targets, refine with the DMT then drop on the DMT marker. In the mission, just visually acquiring the target is difficult and well, not being able to bust armour is somewhat bad for a Harrier pilot.

Also, should I use a Mk 82 (as I've seen in a playthrough video)? The Mk 20 seems to be the logical choice and possibly able to mitigate the difficulty of the target moving?

[ChillNG]

6 minutes ago, Delta-canard said:

A really great mission! I was happy to pass this mission fairly rapidly (not actually first try because of my computer crashing or RL interfering) but not with full score. I can fairly reliably hit the first two targets with single Mk 82s, I really struggle to find and destroy the tank. I went back to the armor training range where I did fairly good but I'd rely on hotspot chevrons to find targets, refine with the DMT then drop on the DMT marker. In the mission, just visually acquiring the target is difficult and well, not being able to bust armour is somewhat bad for a Harrier pilot.

Also, should I use a Mk 82 (as I've seen in a playthrough video)? The Mk 20 seems to be the logical choice and possibly able to mitigate the difficulty of the target moving?

Personally I always go for the cluster bombs on the tank, it's a tricky target to hit.

 

[DimSim]

Same issue here. I noticed when I was real close (~4mn) and low (~6000ft) I heard  "Cleared Hot" even though I hadn't made the 'in' call that time. Like others, I was trying to stay high until the final dive.

[MichTerran]

Completed this mission with 75% effectiveness. I couldn't hit the second target. I shot all the ammunition and dropped everything that was under the wings (

[wowbagger]

If this mission gets any tweaks in the future, could you also perhaps look at  giving sandman 5-1 a little stronger prescription ?
The "I'm blind" call still  activates at a pretty low altitude, and doesn't seem to coordinate as well with the weather as perhaps it once did.


Loving the immersion and atmosphere of the campaign!

Cheers

Edited August 17, 2024 by wowbagger
spelling