need help using radar in F-15C

[skypickle]

Here I am in an F-15C trailing two MiG29 drones, each about 8 nm ahead. The radar shows nothing. The TDC cursor is ar the top of the display.

 

Here I move the TDC cursor to the bottom of the display.

Shouldnt the numbers at the left hand margin be closer together indicating a narrower vertical slice of the sky?

Why am I not finding the targets on the scope?

[razo+r]

In the first pic, you scan the area between 6'000ft and 0 ft at 10 Miles while your target is way above 20'000ft or the second one at 20'000ft. You told your radar to look way below the target. You will never pick it up if you set your antenna to scan downwards.

Move the antenna elevation upwards, and make sure the bandit's altitude is inbetween the from your radar scanned altitudes.

22 minutes ago, skypickle said:

Shouldnt the numbers at the left hand margin be closer together indicating a narrower vertical slice of the sky?

It shows the scanned altitude at the cursors location. So if you put the cursor all the way at the bottom, you basically see what altitude you are at since it shows what it scans directly infront of your nose. If you move the cursor further way you'll see where your antenna is actually pointing at.

Edited April 2, 2023 by razo+r

[skypickle]

where do you see the elevation? I try using scan zone up/down but see no indications.

[razo+r]

The elevation is on the left side of the screen, indicated by two circles left of the most left vertical line as well as a number to the right of each circle.

Edited April 2, 2023 by razo+r

[skypickle]

here are two more pics:

cursor at top alts 16/6

cursor at bottom alts 25/20

 

 

shouldnt be the other way round? all i did was move the tdc

also moving the scan zone left/right/up/down does nothing. should it?

Edited April 2, 2023 by skypickle

[razo+r]

Just now, skypickle said:

here are two more pics:

cursor at top alts 16/6

cursor at bottom alts 25/20

 

 

shouldnt be the other way round? all i did was move the tdc

 

Imagine the whole screen as a top down view of the whole situation. The TDC basically moves only horizontally, so in range and azimuth. These numbers on the left represent what altitude range is being scanned at the TDCs location. TDC all the way up is the range that you've set your screen at, in this case 10 miles. TDC at the bottom 0 miles.

If the TDC is high up, in this case at around 8 miles in your picture, it will show you that the antenna elevation is set in such a way that it scans an altitude between 6'000ft and 16'000ft. The antenna is scanning downwards.

Now if you move the cursor all the way down, to basically 0 miles range, it will show you what altitude it scans at 0 miles. As you can imagine, at 0 miles is basically the location of the antenna, so it shows you your altitude. At the same time, at this very close distance, the radiation pattern is still very narrow. Imagine that one like a funnel. Very close to the aircraft, the funnel or radiation pattern is very narrow. The further out you go the bigger the funnel gets, the bigger the radiation pattern gets / the more area it scans.

[skypickle]

Thank you , I get that. But how do I point the funnel up and down? I cannot get the numbers to change without moving the TDC. Using scan zone controls seems to not work.

[razo+r]

It's RShift+ they key that moves your TDC up and down. Should be called Scanzone up/down. It does work for me.

[skypickle]

yep, not working for me. can only move TDC

[razo+r]

And the keybindings for your scanzone up/down are also RShift+the TDC moving keys?

[skypickle]

yes. i even tried binding hotas buttons to the different functions. scan zones dont move. time to repair dcs

[skypickle]

antenna elevation does not exist in the control binding options for the F-15C.

[draconus]

4 minutes ago, skypickle said:

antenna elevation does not exist in the control binding options for the F-15C.

You're right, I'm sorry for confusion. This is default binding:

[skypickle]

I downloaded a fresh copy of dcs open beta. Deleted the saved games folder. Restarted the game , bound some controls for basic flight. Now, scan zone up and down work, but scan zone left and right do nothing still. Changing from TWS to RWS gives me a narrower scan angle but even in TWS, I cannot move the 'cone' of the scan volume left/right.

Edited April 2, 2023 by skypickle

[razo+r]

The scan azimuth in TWS in the F-15C is linked with the TDC. Scanzone left/right is only used in the russian FC3 jets.

[skypickle]

I imagine something bizarre was happening with the F15C controls. Even tho the correct keys were bound, it was as if the game did not recognize them. Maybe it was the F15 SMTP mod I had installed before .

[draconus]

Anyway, here's a tool that can help you understand how the radar cone and TDC works:

https://tawdcs.org/radar-f15/

[Nahen]

A few things:

First of all - the TDC cursor above the middle line of the radar screen, preferably around the third horizontal line from the bottom - what does it do - extends the vertical scanning range of the radar.

Secondly - and basically PRIORITY - to learn what frequencies of radar work at which aspects of the objects are most effective. In this particular case, since you are following the intercepted target - flying in the same direction as it - the radar frequency should be set to "medium" MED - and not high HI, not "mixed" Hi-MED.

Another thing is that at a distance of less than 10 miles it is much more effective to switch to boresight or vertical mode - then the avionics will find and lock on the target.

[draconus]

3 hours ago, Nahen said:

First of all - the TDC cursor above the middle line of the radar screen, preferably around the third horizontal line from the bottom - what does it do - extends the vertical scanning range of the radar.

The TDC alone is just a marker to designate targets - it doesn't affect radar scanning in any way apart from TWS narrow left/right antenna azimuth.

[Nahen]

7 hours ago, draconus said:

The TDC alone is just a marker to designate targets - it doesn't affect radar scanning in any way apart from TWS narrow left/right antenna azimuth.

Well, set the radar to, for example, 80 miles, leave the TDC in the middle of the radar screen and set the elevation so that it reaches as high as possible from zero (0-41) - that is, from the imaginary ground surface to 41,000 feet at a maximum distance of 80 miles. Then, without moving the radar elevation, move the TDC cursor towards the top of the radar monitor... stop when the low value jumps to 1,000 feet and read the high value... Don't forget to enter it here ok?

Moving the cursor changes the vertical position of the antenna, just as moving it to the left and right changes the horizontal position of the antenna depending on whether you have a narrowed beam or not.

As I see, very few people know how to use the radar in the F-15C...

[Nahen]

For those interested, I will add that depending on the vertical position of the cursor, we influence the "speed" of radar search by narrowing or expanding the vertical range of the antenna. If we know what height the enemy is at, we lower the TDC down the radar screen and then by adjusting the elevation of the antenna (not by moving the TDC cursor) we move the narrowed scanning range, which is searched much faster by the radar. As a result - we shorten the time to detect the target.

In the opposite case - TDC cursor in the upper part - extended vertical search range, slower scanning but more vertical space to search.

[draconus]

OMG, @Nahen stop trolling and spreading misinformation, especially in the thread when new pilot is willing to learn.

TDC does not affect how fast antenna moves in the pattern at all and neither how big that pattern is! You can always see how it moves, watch the Vs:

[Ironhand]

@skypickle, these are old but I still have folks telling me that they are extremely helpful. You might want to give them a look: 

 

[Nahen]

1 hour ago, draconus said:

OMG, @Nahen stop trolling and spreading misinformation, especially in the thread when new pilot is willing to learn.

TDC does not affect how fast antenna moves in the pattern at all and neither how big that pattern is! You can always see how it moves, watch the Vs:

You have absolutely no idea what the radar of the F-15C module from FC3 is all about. Did you do what I wrote to you? NO. Either you don't have this module or you don't know how to use it, I don't see any other way out.
 

 

Edited April 3, 2023 by Nahen

[draconus]

13 minutes ago, Nahen said:

You have absolutely no idea what the radar of the F-15C module from FC3 is all about. Did you do what I wrote to you? NO. Either you don't have this module or you don't know how to use it, I don't see any other way out.

 

What were you trying to show?