What VR headset will dominate in the future?

[sepruda]

Hello!

 

Decently happy G2 owner here. I'm looking to upgrade as soon as the next go to VR headset for DCS reveals itself. Need higher resolution, better colors, wider FOV, more comfort... Etc.

 

I've owned the Quest 2 previously.

 

I've seen a video declaring that the quest pro is currently the best, and then there's Pimax Crystal, the vote is still out I guess. I have high expectations of the Quest 3, but seems a lot is happening now.

 

Which headset are you waiting for?

[Burt]

The most expensive one will dominate haha ! I just got the Varjo Aero so I'm good for a few years, I'm more interested in what mbucchia is putting out for us. My next big purchase would be a new rig hopefully a 14900K and a RTX 5090ti. 

[diego999]

5 hours ago, sepruda said:

Which headset are you waiting for?

 

Quest 3. I hope it brings great improvements over the Quest 2 which I own.

Those expensive headsets look amazing but I honestly can't pay u$s 1000 or more for a gaming gadget. Not to mention the rig you need to support them.

 

[Dogmanbird]

Hopefully quest 3 will have the lens quality of the quest pro but with reverb g2 resolution / pixel pitch, or higher

plus usable passthrough / masking for using our real cockpit controls 

[nikoel]

I hate to be the partypooper but the chances of Quest 3 being that headset are rather slim

According to the information out there, Meta Quest 3 utilises a single LCD, splitting its resolution to 2064 by 2208 per eye. It has [stated] identical field of view to QP. This gives a lower pixel density of 19.8 PPD on the Q3 compared to Pro's 22.6. The reason the numbers don't match up is because the single LCD wastes more pixels as it goes across the width of the entire screen as the IPD adjustment moves the lenses but not the screen[s]. Unlike, QuestPro and some other headsets have 2 screens and thus fewer "wasted" pixels

DFR wont be part of the experience as the headset doesn't have eye tracking. Therefore it's likely to have a lower PPD and also more difficult to run than the QuestPro

It's not possible to release something for 33% of the price and make it superior without reasonable amount of time passing in-between the two products, especially in the world of inflation that we're currently in

When you launch QuestLink, it becomes obvious that PCVR is a second class citizen within Meta's vision for the VR space. It's still called Rift in the menu, and hell, they can't even be bothered to copy and paste the hand tracking code to be used inside QuestLink Menu which has remained unchanged for years. The debug tool is littered with options which no longer do anything

Finally, talking about resolution as 'be all', 'end all' thing for headsets is downright wrong. Photographers and cinematographers have known this for decades - Optics are the true king, Resolution and Dynamic Range second. Look at the parallel work of Digital Cameras and see this for yourself. Take the best 'prosumer' camera on the market Sony A7R Mark 4. I can have the body of the camera with all of its innovation for $3900 kangaroos... with a G-Master 18-110mm F4 lens for 5000 of those same puppies. Even the likes of Pico 4 with their terribly dim panels and below average software stack knew this and put out the headset with good optics

There is no "killer headset" out there as there is no "killer car" out there. They all try and balance feature-set, software, price and build quality. It's true that Meta is positioned the best out of all the manufacturers to create the most amount of meaningful change within the PCVR space. They are concentrating their efforts elsewhere -

Here is a video by Lukas who within the DCS community is perhaps only behind to mbucchia in his knowledge of VR

 

Edited July 31, 2023 by nikoel

[Dogmanbird]

I thin I meant PEA rather than pitch   (pixel emittance area?) being better if it's LCD. Less black area around pixels for less screen door which is fairly noticeable on quest pro. 

I'm fairly sure someone reporting on reddit noted a visible resolution improvement over quest pro (and reddit always speaketh the truth!)

[Dogmanbird]

Thanks for the vid nikoel.

I guess that unless he's prepared to bust open the quest pro, we still don't know how much coverage the lens has on each of it's panels to really compare, though we'd assume it's greater (bloody hope for the price). I can push the pro right up to the eyeballs and still not see any panel edge in the peripheral, though it gains a heap of fov,  so it looks like there might be quite a bit of spare panel all around beyond the fov. It's only 1800 x 1920 ish per eye to begin with and maybe only 1650 x 1720 ish visible when worn as intended

Edited July 31, 2023 by Dogmanbird

[sepruda]

7 hours ago, nikoel said:

I hate to be the partypooper but the chances of Quest 3 being that headset are rather slim

According to the information out there, Meta Quest 3 utilises a single LCD, splitting its resolution to 2064 by 2208 per eye. It has [stated] identical field of view to QP. This gives a lower pixel density of 19.8 PPD on the Q3 compared to Pro's 22.6. The reason the numbers don't match up is because the single LCD wastes more pixels as it goes across the width of the entire screen as the IPD adjustment moves the lenses but not the screen[s]. Unlike, QuestPro and some other headsets have 2 screens and thus fewer "wasted" pixels

DFR wont be part of the experience as the headset doesn't have eye tracking. Therefore it's likely to have a lower PPD and also more difficult to run than the QuestPro

It's not possible to release something for 33% of the price and make it superior without reasonable amount of time passing in-between the two products, especially in the world of inflation that we're currently in

When you launch QuestLink, it becomes obvious that PCVR is a second class citizen within Meta's vision for the VR space. It's still called Rift in the menu, and hell, they can't even be bothered to copy and paste the hand tracking code to be used inside QuestLink Menu which has remained unchanged for years. The debug tool is littered with options which no longer do anything

Finally, talking about resolution as 'be all', 'end all' thing for headsets is downright wrong. Photographers and cinematographers have known this for decades - Optics are the true king, Resolution and Dynamic Range second. Look at the parallel work of Digital Cameras and see this for yourself. Take the best 'prosumer' camera on the market Sony A7R Mark 4. I can have the body of the camera with all of its innovation for $3900 kangaroos... with a G-Master 18-110mm F4 lens for 5000 of those same puppies. Even the likes of Pico 4 with their terribly dim panels and below average software stack knew this and put out the headset with good optics

There is no "killer headset" out there as there is no "killer car" out there. They all try and balance feature-set, software, price and build quality. It's true that Meta is positioned the best out of all the manufacturers to create the most amount of meaningful change within the PCVR space. They are concentrating their efforts elsewhere -

Here is a video by Lukas who within the DCS community is perhaps only behind to mbucchia in his knowledge of VR

 

 

I don't think there will be killer headset, but there will probably be a new headset which will hit a sweet spot between performance and price, like the HP Reverb G2 is now. (At least I think that's the most widely adopted).

I just hope there will be a new "default" soon. I've also watched Lucas' videos, he currently hold the Quest Pro as the best VR headset, but that is very expensive.

 

 

Edited July 31, 2023 by sepruda

[diego999]

9 hours ago, nikoel said:

I hate to be the partypooper but the chances of Quest 3 being that headset are rather slim

According to the information out there, Meta Quest 3 utilises a single LCD, splitting its resolution to 2064 by 2208 per eye. It has [stated] identical field of view to QP. This gives a lower pixel density of 19.8 PPD on the Q3 compared to Pro's 22.6. The reason the numbers don't match up is because the single LCD wastes more pixels as it goes across the width of the entire screen as the IPD adjustment moves the lenses but not the screen[s]. Unlike, QuestPro and some other headsets have 2 screens and thus fewer "wasted" pixels

DFR wont be part of the experience as the headset doesn't have eye tracking. Therefore it's likely to have a lower PPD and also more difficult to run than the QuestPro

It's not possible to release something for 33% of the price and make it superior without reasonable amount of time passing in-between the two products, especially in the world of inflation that we're currently in

When you launch QuestLink, it becomes obvious that PCVR is a second class citizen within Meta's vision for the VR space. It's still called Rift in the menu, and hell, they can't even be bothered to copy and paste the hand tracking code to be used inside QuestLink Menu which has remained unchanged for years. The debug tool is littered with options which no longer do anything

Finally, talking about resolution as 'be all', 'end all' thing for headsets is downright wrong. Photographers and cinematographers have known this for decades - Optics are the true king, Resolution and Dynamic Range second. Look at the parallel work of Digital Cameras and see this for yourself. Take the best 'prosumer' camera on the market Sony A7R Mark 4. I can have the body of the camera with all of its innovation for $3900 kangaroos... with a G-Master 18-110mm F4 lens for 5000 of those same puppies. Even the likes of Pico 4 with their terribly dim panels and below average software stack knew this and put out the headset with good optics

There is no "killer headset" out there as there is no "killer car" out there. They all try and balance feature-set, software, price and build quality. It's true that Meta is positioned the best out of all the manufacturers to create the most amount of meaningful change within the PCVR space. They are concentrating their efforts elsewhere -

Here is a video by Lukas who within the DCS community is perhaps only behind to mbucchia in his knowledge of VR

 

 

 

I expect the Quest 3 to be better than the 2 with a reasonable price. Nothing more.

 

[freehand]

For me the quest pro is less demanding than my G2 so I received a free up grade as well but yes expensive for sure. 

 

[Lange_666]

As long as the stand alone versions don't offer the same video throughput as headsets with a display port the future headsets will need a display port imho.

[WipeUout]

5 hours ago, sepruda said:

I've also watched Lucas' videos, he currently hold the Quest Pro as the best VR headset, but that is very expensive.

That is an 8 months old video. Wonder if he can say that now.  He states that he tried a pimax 5k+ and 8k (released in 2018!) but did not talk about the 8kX?  

There are always holes in those youtubers videos.

[freehand]

2 hours ago, WipeUout said:

That is an 8 months old video. Wonder if he can say that now.  He states that he tried a pimax 5k+ and 8k (released in 2018!) but did not talk about the 8kX?  

There are always holes in those youtubers videos.

His last video is a month ago regarding DCS: VR Eye-Tracked Foveated Rendering (Quest Pro)

And what hole does he have in the video ?

Edited July 31, 2023 by freehand

[WipeUout]

31 minutes ago, freehand said:

And what hole does he have in the video ?

Dismissing Pimax from 2018 hardware!  What about the Crystal or the 8kX?  considering that he is making this statement from a DCS sim perspective!! No doubt that the Quest pro is a very good HMD but not everyone want to fly with the FOV of a pair of binos...  When you state that this HMD is the best, you need to consider the whole crowd.

[dburne]

There is absolutely no such thing as a "Best VR Headset". It does not exist.

What there is however, is a "Best for me VR Headset".  Big difference.  Everyone is different and looks for different things.

[freehand]

1 hour ago, WipeUout said:

Dismissing Pimax from 2018 hardware!  What about the Crystal or the 8kX?  considering that he is making this statement from a DCS sim perspective!! No doubt that the Quest pro is a very good HMD but not everyone want to fly with the FOV of a pair of binos...  When you state that this HMD is the best, you need to consider the whole crowd.

Point taken.

[freehand]

2 hours ago, dburne said:

There is absolutely no such thing as a "Best VR Headset". It does not exist.

What there is however, is a "Best for me VR Headset".  Big difference.  Everyone is different and looks for different things.

Did you watch the video ? 

[dburne]

7 minutes ago, freehand said:

Did you watch the video ? 

Yes.

[nikoel]

12 hours ago, sepruda said:

I don't think there will be killer headset, but there will probably be a new headset which will hit a sweet spot between performance and price, like the HP Reverb G2 is now. (At least I think that's the most widely adopted).

I just hope there will be a new "default" soon. I've also watched Lucas' videos, he currently hold the Quest Pro as the best VR headset, but that is very expensive.

 

 

 

I suspect, Quest Pro should come down in price when the quest 3 gets released. So ironically if you have your sights set on that headset, wait for the Q3 and see…

[Steel Jaw]

I have a Q2 and its a good kit.

[freehand]

7 hours ago, dburne said:

Yes.

So why are you stating the obvious lol , for me the video is about the content not his personal liking.

Edited August 1, 2023 by freehand

[nikoel]

10 hours ago, WipeUout said:

Dismissing Pimax from 2018 hardware!  What about the Crystal or the 8kX?  considering that he is making this statement from a DCS sim perspective!! No doubt that the Quest pro is a very good HMD but not everyone want to fly with the FOV of a pair of binos...  When you state that this HMD is the best, you need to consider the whole crowd.

 

8 hours ago, freehand said:

Point taken.

Absolutely not taken. He does talk about it, its you who has not looked at the video. I have time stamped it for you

  

If you don't have the time, he says about Pimax in much eloquent way what I say, which is below

A company that over-hypes and under-delivers time and time again with - whilst not technically illegal - but very questionable business decisions, a company that is so focused on stats and specs that they forget to deliver a good product, oh and seriously sub-par binocular overlap/ stereoscopathy due to screen canting in the pure pursuit of FOV. The 8KX headset only works well for people within the narrow range of IPD's - this is why we often see posts praising the headset and people who do the opposite

Edited August 1, 2023 by nikoel

[freehand]

3 minutes ago, nikoel said:

 

Absolutely not taken. He does talk about it, its you who has not looked at the video. I have time stamped it for you

  

If you don't have the time, he says about Pimax in much eloquent way what I say, which is below

A company that over-hypes and under-delivers time and time again, a company that is so focused on stats and specs that they forget to deliver a good product, oh and seriously sub-par binocular overlap/ stereoscopathy due to screen canting in the pure pursuit of FOV

 

instead of jumping in with 2 big feet That video is not the one I was referring to is it ? 

 

[dburne]

6 hours ago, freehand said:

So why are you stating the obvious lol , for me the video is about the content not his personal liking.

 

 

Not sure what you are getting at here. Or where his personal liking came in. I simply disagreed with his assertion it was the best headset currently as imho there really is not one, due to the vast differences in users and what they look for in a headset.

Not a big deal really just expressing my opinion.

 

[Rodeo]

My opinion is I think it’s going to take ED a lot of dedicated effort to catch up with the future generation of VR headsets. I will not go on about my issues with Pimax 8kx but having it for a year and then switching to the Aero is night and day different. With that said I feel that I will enjoys years of DCS VR with the Aero and either continued firmware updates or mbbucchia wonderful tools all of this will outpace ED’s VR performance.