resolved New spotting is great / New spotting is overcooked feedback thread

[pastranario3]

hace 2 horas, draconus dijo:

Currently more than 2400 players on standalone DCS plus over 800 on Steam. I can't see any trend here related to spotting updates.

https://steamcharts.com/app/223750

Where do you get that there are 2400 with standalone dcs?

[=475FG= Dawger]

2 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

I’m gonna guess 90% of the pilots in WWII never saw who killed em and pilots fighting it out like Udet vs Guynemer or Richthofen vs Hawker was almost non existent. 

While true, that is a stupid pretext for game design. And this is a game no matter how much you want it to be something else.

[=475FG= Dawger]

2 hours ago, draconus said:

Currently more than 2400 players on standalone DCS plus over 800 on Steam. I can't see any trend here related to spotting updates.

https://steamcharts.com/app/223750

There are presently 1780 "players" and 1326 servers. 14 servers have population in double digits for a total of 250. Only 100 ish have more than 1 player, most of those at 2 or 3 but even if the average is 5, that is still 500 players so the player count is including the "admin" slot.

So you have to subtract the server count from the player count to get the live human count.

And I was referring to the visual range PvP servers, not the modern BVR or PvE so you can lop off the most populated servers right there.

Numbers are paltry. Noticeably lower. Of course, the weather is still nice and the world is pretty scary and lots of folks are selling their computers to buy food but there has been a noticeable drop in interest in WVR PvP since ED started mucking with spotting a few updates ago.

[Red_Dragon]

2 часа назад, SharpeXB сказал:

I’m gonna guess 90% of the pilots in WWII never saw who killed em and pilots fighting it out like Udet vs Guynemer or Richthofen vs Hawker was almost non existent. 

They didn't see but they could see if they were less careless.. unfortunately  they didn't pay enough attention for their tails. This is not the same thing as in the dcs right now where you can be blind despite you pay attention for your tail and at the same time you can see everyone on fantastic distance around  

[PawlaczGMD]

Yeah, just to reiterate, spotting in VR went from perhaps too easy to non-existent in one of the recent updates. Meanwhile, it's still too powerful in 2D, which creates a huge differential between players in MP.  It has to change one way or the other to make it more consistent.

[draconus]

7 hours ago, pastranario3 said:

Where do you get that there are 2400 with standalone dcs?

It's here:

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/personal/profile/

9 hours ago, Zakson85 said:

How detailed a description of the problem do you need to believe that the dots in dcs disappear?

What aircraft at what distance. Then I'll test.

Edited September 12, 2024 by draconus

[KoN]

On 9/10/2024 at 8:13 PM, SharpeXB said:

If dots in VR were as large as on a monitor they’d be gigantic. I don’t think most people liked that. VR is like sticking your nose right up to the screen of a display, the pixels are huge. That problem will likely persist as long as a pixel derived dot is used. 
Using a 4K screen with the dots enabled I don’t find myself seeing anything too egregious so I leave them on knowing everyone else probably does too. 

I hate to say it sharpe another combat flight sim has no issues in spotting wether that be flat screen or VR , I've just this minute finished flying online in VR . Guns only . Something is amiss with DCS and VR . The WWII server is empty. That server was always full weekends and half midweek. Now that tells a story . 

[PawlaczGMD]

10 minutes ago, KoN said:

I hate to say it sharpe another combat flight sim has no issues in spotting wether that be flat screen or VR , I've just this minute finished flying online in VR . Guns only . Something is amiss with DCS and VR . The WWII server is empty. That server was always full weekends and half midweek. Now that tells a story . 

part of this is the horrible performance degradation in the latest patch. But yes, a lot of WWII people complain about spotting, and it is bad on some hardware and settings.

[KoN]

Is the option for the new spotting actually working . I have it ticked but I don't see anything anymore before I could see big blob , but now I see nothing. I see cannon fire on me yet no airframe not until on top of me and flying past . Twice now this has happened . Maybe I should turn it off. Lol  

[SharpeXB]

2 hours ago, =475FG= Dawger said:

While true, that is a stupid pretext for game design. And this is a game no matter how much you want it to be something else.

Well the game is supposed to be a sim so realistic action is what you should get. In WWII that means the majority of kills will be one player ambushing another. What else would you expect? DCS could always be played with icons on but I don’t see any servers with full labels. Most people don’t come to DCS for that style of gameplay it seems. 
I have to say I prefer the modern era since all the sensors give players a better picture of the game and this results in an actual fight vs just ambushes. 
 

[SharpeXB]

2 hours ago, =475FG= Dawger said:

lots of folks are selling their computers to buy food

Huh? I see you’re in the US where we have record low unemployment, a soaring stock market, driven inflation back down to 2.5% without causing a recession and a strong economy by any measure. If anything the high unemployment during the pandemic was a boon to video games. I got into flight sims during a long stretch of unemployment during the Great Recession

2 hours ago, Red_Dragon said:

This is not the same thing as in the dcs right now where you can be blind despite you pay attention for your tail and at the same time you can see everyone on fantastic distance around 

A player that’s even remotely close enough to be a threat to you with guns is easy to see. You might miss them out of not looking but they are very visible. 

1 hour ago, KoN said:

I hate to say it sharpe another combat flight sim has no issues in spotting wether that be flat screen or VR

Personally I find them to be about equal but DCS has better graphics which translates into better visibility. People in those other games complain about visibility all the time too. 

Edited September 12, 2024 by SharpeXB

[PawlaczGMD]

5 hours ago, KoN said:

Is the option for the new spotting actually working . I have it ticked but I don't see anything anymore before I could see big blob , but now I see nothing. I see cannon fire on me yet no airframe not until on top of me and flying past . Twice now this has happened . Maybe I should turn it off. Lol  

in VR, I've found very little difference, or even that the new spotting option is worse. I just don't have spotting dots at all. 

[draconus]

5 hours ago, KoN said:

before I could see big blob

That was wrong and unrealistic.

[Zakson85]

6 hours ago, draconus said:

What aircraft at what distance. Then I'll test.

Spend a few minutes watching this video. I showed step by step how to make a dot disappear. This situation occurs on any unit-rich server

[draconus]

8 minutes ago, Zakson85 said:

Spend a few minutes watching this video. I showed step by step how to make a dot disappear. This situation occurs on any unit-rich server

This was already reported:

[Zakson85]

4 minutes ago, draconus said:

This was already reported:

I don't think so. The topic "died" Flappie asked for details in April, I helped as much as I could. Currently, I do not see the reported status and there is no discussion on the topic.

[draconus]

21 minutes ago, Zakson85 said:

I don't think so. The topic "died" Flappie asked for details in April, I helped as much as I could. Currently, I do not see the reported status and there is no discussion on the topic.

OK, then continue to push ED there, but I don't see how it is relevant in this thread - I doubt everyone complaining about spotting here were faced with this exact problem.

[KoN]

50 minutes ago, draconus said:

That was wrong and unrealistic.

Totally agree. But now I don't see any dark contacts. Where can I get an older version of DCS . I want to test . 

Edited September 12, 2024 by KoN

[KoN]

5 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

Huh? I see you’re in the US where we have record low unemployment, a soaring stock market, driven inflation back down to 2.5% without causing a recession and a strong economy by any measure. If anything the high unemployment during the pandemic was a boon to video games. I got into flight sims during a long stretch of unemployment during the Great Recession

A player that’s even remotely close enough to be a threat to you with guns is easy to see. You might miss them out of not looking but they are very visible. 

Personally I find them to be about equal but DCS has better graphics which translates into better visibility. People in those other games complain about visibility all the time too. 

 

Do you fly in VR sharp . I don't see your headset in sig.

[draconus]

6 minutes ago, KoN said:

But now I don't see any dark contacts. Where can I get an older version of DCS . I want to test .

Use this mission and test for yourself.

Here's how to revert to older DCS version (only the most recent ones can be available):

1 minute ago, KoN said:

Do you fly in VR sharp .

No, he just pretends to know how it is.

[Zakson85]

52 minutes ago, draconus said:

I doubt everyone complaining about spotting here were faced with this exact problem.

Maybe some people don't even know that there is such a problem. We talk whether it's a big dot or a small dot, whether it's real or not. What difference does it make if it disappears completely at important moments? We're talking about the cherry on the cake here, but the cake has to be thrown away. There are many topics on the forum. Thousands of posts trash-talk and dcs is getting more and more irritating from version to version.

[SharpeXB]

5 hours ago, KoN said:

Do you fly in VR sharp . I don't see your headset in sig.

No I’m using a 4K monitor

5 hours ago, draconus said:

No, he just pretends to know how it is.

I’ve used VR headsets just not for gaming or flight sims. My impression of them was that the resolution was way too low for something like this, trying to see small targets and cockpit gauges etc. 

Edited September 12, 2024 by SharpeXB

[AMVI_Boomer]

11 ore fa, SharpeXB ha scritto:

A player that’s even remotely close enough to be a threat to you with guns is easy to see. You might miss them out of not looking but they are very visible. 

 

 

I personally accept it, but if everyone has the same "level" of spotting.... 

[SharpeXB]

41 minutes ago, AMVI_Boomer said:

I personally accept it, but if everyone has the same "level" of spotting.... 

DCS just isn’t a game focused on multiplayer or a level playing field. There are so many ways the game can be exploited you might as well just accept that if you’re going to play online. Realize the old 2.8 spotting dots are still selectable and those allow some players to easily see other aircraft tens of miles away. If the game was really focused on MP the spotting dots would be a mission/server option. 

[Zakson85]

My eyes are bleeding... Is DCS really not multiplayer focused?! What do you think about AI Bots in DCS? What do you think about the Dynamic Campaign? I bought several WW2 campaigns. The man who made them put an incredible amount of work into it. Everything is being ruined by stupid DCS bots. Burning planes returning to base as if nothing had happened. Wingmans who want to kill you with their flight. It doesn't sound like a great single player game. True?