Nealius Posted March 4 Posted March 4 On 2/28/2025 at 5:14 AM, Cab said: I thought knife-edge passes required cross controls. Wing down and top rudder to keep flying straight. Stick is close to neutral in roll, slightly forward on pitch to track straight, on a knife edge pass.
NytHawk Posted March 4 Posted March 4 (edited) On 2/28/2025 at 2:46 AM, bbrz said: Apparently. The only thing cross controlling the F-16 would do, is to greatly increase the possibility of departing controlled flight! The F-16 FLCS does not prohibit cross controlling. However the FLCS does have a beta limiter, as high levels of sideslip can affect elevator effectiveness. The ROKAF employment manual states that sideslipping the F-16 is a valid way to manage excess energy on approach. Edited March 4 by NytHawk
NytHawk Posted March 4 Posted March 4 (edited) 43 minutes ago, Nealius said: Stick is close to neutral in roll, slightly forward on pitch to track straight, on a knife edge pass. The F-16 needs substantial rudder pedal deflection to maintain a Knife Edge both in real life, and in DCS. Edited March 4 by NytHawk
Cab Posted March 4 Posted March 4 (edited) Threads like this always make me wonder how many people are actually just guessing. I mean, I have 4000 hours of flight time but I have no clue about the nuances of the F-16 flight control system. Edited March 4 by Cab
Nealius Posted March 4 Posted March 4 17 minutes ago, NytHawk said: The F-16 needs substantial rudder pedal deflection to maintain a Knife Edge both in real life, and in DCS. I never said it didn't. I was addressing the question about the stick position.
bbrz Posted March 4 Posted March 4 16 hours ago, NytHawk said: The ROKAF employment manual states that sideslipping the F-16 is a valid way to manage excess energy on approach. Do you have a link? The minimum speed must be pretty high I assume, so it's not really comparable with the high AoA during the flare. Just look at the speed during this sideslip test: Idle + speedbrakes + sideslip....That must result in extremely high ROD. i7-7700K 4.2GHz, 16GB, GTX 1070
DummyCatz Posted March 5 Posted March 5 On 3/4/2025 at 9:45 AM, NytHawk said: The F-16 FLCS does not prohibit cross controlling. However the FLCS does have a beta limiter, as high levels of sideslip can affect elevator effectiveness. The ROKAF employment manual states that sideslipping the F-16 is a valid way to manage excess energy on approach. The beta (AOS) feedback in the DFLCS is not functional in take-off & landing gains. 1
NytHawk Posted March 5 Posted March 5 14 hours ago, bbrz said: Do you have a link? Page 3-69 of KOREAN AIR FORCE TACTICS, TECHNIQUES & PROCEDURES 3-3 VOLUME 5. This is unclassified and easy to search up. "3.21.1.4 Handling excess energy. Once you have lowered the LG and placed the aimpoint on the threshold, make an assessment of your energy state. If airspeed is increasing, open the speedbrakes as required to maintain optimum airspeed. If full (overridden) speedbrakes are not enough to hold the desired airspeed, cross-controlling (slipping) the jet may increase drag enough to control airspeed or descend to a more manageable approach angle, at which time you neutralize the controls and complete the approach. Use caution during cross-control input to insure the toes brakes are not activated by the rudder input, thus depleting the Brake/JFS accumulators." 14 hours ago, bbrz said: The minimum speed must be pretty high I assume, so it's not really comparable with the high AoA during the flare. Yeah, you shouldn't be slipping in the flare, as the manual states you return to a normal approach once you have achieved the desired approach angle.
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